Enough with the Time Travel

[scarecrow1]

I dont know why people keep referring back to the idea that hl trilogy is about time travel, granted it could be a pretty cool story but remember that Valve has much more style and creativity than that! i too once thought that you could end up in hl3 going back to hl1 and averting everthying, however then it struck me....Vavle wouldnt do that, they would give such a copout ending to their fans, in reality i think it would suck! I know valve, and i know that they will come out with an awesome ending to the story, and no i dont think gordon will die in the last chapter ala matrix 3, that would be dissapointing to the fans, so nuckle up and get ready for a rollercoaster ride that ends up flying of the track and resulting in a spectacular BANG to end it all.

Plus i agree with one of the reviewers who likened hl2 to Starshiptroopers, matrix and total recall..for me the last chapters and the final one especially reminded me of Total Recall and the alien machine in the Pyramid mine...with all the intense action u could think of...

Good job Valve.

 

[DrkBlueXG]

in reality i think it would suck! I know valve, and i know that they will come out with an awesome ending to the story.

Hmm interesting. I must have missed that on the last issue of PC Gamer.
Since "we" are on the illusion that we know valve....
I am Gabe Newell.

 

[scarecrow1]

and im Doug Lombardi and i say hl3 will be out in summer!!!

 

[CriYam]

Why do you want to disregard all the time travel elements in the HL storyline?

 

[scarecrow1]

Cause it sounds too cheap and cliched

 

[Mechagodzilla]

There really aren't any time travel elements. At least not time travel into the past. Time travel into the future is as simple as cryogenic freezing. I'm time traveling into the future as I write this.

Time travel back to the past, on the other hand, creates all manner of logical problems and paradoxes.

 

[Eejit]

There really aren't any time travel elements. At least not time travel into the past. Time travel into the future is as simple as cryogenic freezing. I'm time traveling into the future as I write this.

Time travel back to the past, on the other hand, creates all manner of logical problems and paradoxes.

There is definitely some time travel in HL1 at least - and it looks like backwards is all that fits:

Originally Posted by Marc Laidlaw
Hi, Solver, I'm assuming whatever I tell you is going to get posted somewhere, so I'll be very careful in answering.

I will not talk about the meaning of the game or clear up stuff that has yet to be clarified or revealed; it only makes sense to do this in the context of the games themselves. Stuff that hasn't been revealed is that way because we're not ready to reveal it. Everything that's there is there for a reason; ditto for everything that isn't there. I can only say, "Stay tuned."

Race-X was Gearbox's creation, and likely would only be continued if Gearbox were to do more episodes in the HL universe. There were gameplay modes they wanted to explore, and their designers wanted to make some new monsters; Race-X was a great way for them to do this. The universe is expansive enough to allow this without conflicting with the core story. Remember, these are games first and foremost, and the story really is there to open up and extend (rather than shut down) possibilities for fun gameplay. We did coordinate overarching story elements with Gearbox, but left a lot of the details for them to explore and invent according to what worked for their design process. As for whether Shepherd was put on ice before or after the Nihilanth's demise, it's really hard to say, since Gordon's time in Xen and in the Nihilanth's chamber may not be mapped directly against the timeline of events at Black Mesa.

The gman mumbles sound fairly close to what I remember him saying...strangely enough, I can't find the script for that exchange.

Thanks for taking such an interest in the story. Before HL1 came out, it was tough to convince outsiders that FPS players would care at all about having any kind of story in their game. Obviously, given the wide range of reactions, they care quite a bit. The debate over HL2's content is much more varied.

Yours,
Marc Laidlaw

 

[Vesh]

No, that's not time travel that's just a difference in temporal alignment between universes.

 

[Eejit]

Teleportation IS time travel since it involves travelling faster than light through space...

 

[the5th]

Teleportation IS time travel since it involves travelling faster than light through space...

No, light does not equal time.

 

[CriYam]

Weird, in HL1 when you're on Xen there's a portal thingy and out of it you hear (paraphrased)"Oh No! Stop it, get him out of there!" You know, from the begining of the game where the experiment screws up.

 

[DoctorGordon3]

No, light does not equal time.

Confirmed

 

[scarecrow1]

Teleportation is not time travel but rather a means of transportation, think of startek beaming and its pretty much the same-"advanced form of transportation"...which could have some side effects regarding time but does not mean it is a transportation solely for the travel of timelines but physical travels.

 

[ShadowFox]

Teleportation IS time travel since it involves travelling faster than light through space...

I'm no expert, but isn't the point of teleportation that it is instantaneous? Thus you aren't travelling at a certain speed, you are just here one moment and there the next.

 

[Is This Tea]

Teleportation IS time travel since it involves travelling faster than light through space...

I’m calling B.S. on that… Here’s why…
“In 1982 physicists Alain Aspect, Jean Dalibard and Gerard Roger of the University of Paris produced a series of twin photons be heating calcium atoms with lasers. Then they allowed each photon to travel in opposite directions through 6.5 meters of pipe and pass through special filters that directed them toward one of two possible polarization analyzers. It took each filter 10 billionths of a second to switch between one analyzer or the other, about 30 billionths of a second less then it took light to travel the entire 13 meters separating each photon.” – Michael Talbot
In plain English…. The partials mimicked each others behavior faster then they could possibly send information to one another about their positions. This breaks Einstein’s law that nothing can travel faster then light… Or does it? According to a somewhat esoteric Quantum theory, David Bohm’s “Holomovement” theory, the particles are never actually two separate entities as mainstream Quantum theory confuses them to be. These “Quanta” from which the theory is named are simply separate expressions of a fundamental something more elemental then the Quanta that Quantum physics deal with. In which case teleportation, even slow teleportation, would not necessitate calling upon the notion of traveling faster then light, which, as Einstein proved… is not possible.
On another note… Yes, I too hate the idea of time travel being an integral part of the hl2 story. Unoriginal! However, the facts that are presented in the story currently do not rule out this possibility and even suggested it in some parts. It should be noted, however, that they do not come close to confirming it. As some very astute posters have noted...
Time Travel Forward in time is a normal condition of everyday life. I can slow down or speed up my passage through time in this manner by slowing down or speeding up my speed of movement in relation to the rest of you. Relativity. Of course extremes in speed are needed to cause appreciable results.

 

[DrkBlueXG]

I believe that there would be some delay in the teleportation and you would be, maybe, a fraction of a second younger than you were but, it wouldn't be enough to notice at all.

 

[CriYam]

Weird, in HL1 when you're on Xen there's a portal thingy and out of it you hear (paraphrased)"Oh No! Stop it, get him out of there!" You know, from the begining of the game where the experiment screws up.

Besides the portal being open to a past time, let's not forget the Gman; he obviously knows what the future holds.

 

[croperz]

I can't remember exactly where I picked this up from, but don't the teleports used in HL2 work via quantum entanglement? If this were the case, teleportation would be instantanious. Although that does kinda mess up the slow teleportation part of the story line...

 

[Grumpy]

The slow teleport is using the Xen Relay.

And as to the relevance of Time travel, if you think it is not important to the game, WAKE UP YOU HAVE BEEN PLAYING WARCRAFT !

THe End Sequence with the G-Man...listen to what he says and how he says it, then put on your thinking hat please..

/End Rant

 

[Mitch]

It's all time dilation due to teleporting huge distances/inter-dimensional barriers.

 

[fez]

Weird, in HL1 when you're on Xen there's a portal thingy and out of it you hear (paraphrased)"Oh No! Stop it, get him out of there!" You know, from the begining of the game where the experiment screws up.

could u give me the level name and exact point at which this happens? i must have missed it

thanks

 

[tranes]

Gentleman, I thought that Eienstein's theory stated that it is impossible to accelerate faster than the speed of light. If someone could figure out how to go faster than the speed of light, w/o acceleration (which is what I think these teleporters really do), then ALL sorts of crazy things would happen, including time travel (both backwards and forwards, as long as the place you plan on going exists).

 

[HadouKen24]

So far, I haven't seen anything that resembles true time travel. That is, no going back in time and changing things. (Other, of course, than all the times I died and loaded again from my last save.) I've seen "slow" teleportation, effectively speeding up time or teleporting you into the future or something, and I've seen time slowed down to a virtual standstill. Neither of those is enough to indicate time travel backwards. Sure, it might be an element of the game later on, but there's nothing in there to indicate it for sure.

Gentleman, I thought that Eienstein's theory stated that it is impossible to accelerate faster than the speed of light. If someone could figure out how to go faster than the speed of light, w/o acceleration (which is what I think these teleporters really do), then ALL sorts of crazy things would happen, including time travel (both backwards and forwards, as long as the place you plan on going exists).

You really don't "go faster than the speed of light" with teleportation. First you're one place, and then you're somewhere else. You don't pass through the space between the two places. Einsteinian time dilation wouldn't happen unless you did.

 

[Teta_Bonita]

could u give me the level name and exact point at which this happens? i must have missed it

thanks

If you stand right near the gaint weird looking (demonic?) portal that goes to Nihahilanth (the boss), you can here some faint dialouge from the begining of the game. It's quite spooky, actually. Nice touche added by Valve.

 

[Fishlore]

Some scientists consider space and time one entity. This is called the space time continuum. Basically if you are moving through space you are also moving through time. You can't move through space without also traveling through time. Even if you teleport across the room you are still moving though time.

If you don't know where you are and where you are going in space/time you could end up anywhere, anywhen. The Half Life story seems to take this theory to heart. This would explain why you loose time when the teleporter goes awry.

 

[Eejit]

Some scientists consider space and time one entity. This is called the space time continuum. Basically if you are moving through space you are also moving through time. You can't move through space without also traveling through time. Even if you teleport across the room you are still moving though time.

Exactly.
To teleport you have to circumvent normal space-time. The speed of light is absolute, nothing can travel faster. So to appear somewhere else instantaeneously you are not jus travelling through space but ALSO through time.

It's quite hard to explain

Basically if you are travelling instantaneously through 3 dimenions you are in fact also moving through the fourth - time.


And strangely this doesn't need time=light to work.... :bonce:

 

[westie]

I’m calling B.S. on that… Here’s why…
“In 1982 physicists Alain Aspect, Jean Dalibard and Gerard Roger of the University of Paris produced a series of twin photons be heating calcium atoms with lasers. Then they allowed each photon to travel in opposite directions through 6.5 meters of pipe and pass through special filters that directed them toward one of two possible polarization analyzers. It took each filter 10 billionths of a second to switch between one analyzer or the other, about 30 billionths of a second less then it took light to travel the entire 13 meters separating each photon.” – Michael Talbot
In plain English…. The partials mimicked each others behavior faster then they could possibly send information to one another about their positions. This breaks Einstein’s law that nothing can travel faster then light… Or does it? According to a somewhat esoteric Quantum theory, David Bohm’s “Holomovement” theory, the particles are never actually two separate entities as mainstream Quantum theory confuses them to be. These “Quanta” from which the theory is named are simply separate expressions of a fundamental something more elemental then the Quanta that Quantum physics deal with. In which case teleportation, even slow teleportation, would not necessitate calling upon the notion of traveling faster then light, which, as Einstein proved… is not possible.
On another note… Yes, I too hate the idea of time travel being an integral part of the hl2 story. Unoriginal! However, the facts that are presented in the story currently do not rule out this possibility and even suggested it in some parts. It should be noted, however, that they do not come close to confirming it. As some very astute posters have noted...
Time Travel Forward in time is a normal condition of everyday life. I can slow down or speed up my passage through time in this manner by slowing down or speeding up my speed of movement in relation to the rest of you. Relativity. Of course extremes in speed are needed to cause appreciable results.

Such copy and pastage. Except maybe the bottom bit, but who knows, the G-man, Einstein or even Gordon Freeman.

 

[we11er]

let's not forget the Gman; he obviously knows what the future holds.

I don't think he does...

 

[Grumpy]

The G-Man travels by stepping out of our Universe into the "corridor" then stepping back in at another point in time and/or space. Gordon may well have sent him back in time to ensure the Timeline was not altered by others, sort of a Temperal Cop :smoking:

 

[CriYam]

could u give me the level name and exact point at which this happens? i must have missed it

thanks

changelevel c4a1f

That will take you to the portal where you can hear past events.

 

[we11er]

changelevel c4a1f

That will take you to the portal where you can hear past events.

Yeah I remember that. There's lots of weird stuff that you hear nearer if I remember correctly.

 

[Is This Tea]

Such copy and pastage. Except maybe the bottom bit, but who knows, the G-man, Einstein or even Gordon Freeman.

Actually I spent the time transcribing it out of a book... and then elaborated on it my own words... that’s why it’s in quotations. No plagiarism here jack. I was referencing other sources to prove the validity of me running my mouth off. :O

 

[michael_obrien]

why would anyone talk about relativity and quantum physics seriously in a videogame? What happens is what valve wants to happen. The possibilities are endless, the sci fi lingo can explain anything, and if valve says there's a technology which can travel through space without traveling through time, you just try to stop them =P.

getting to my completely unsupported opinion: The reason the combine is so interested in earth is to steal its developing teleportation technology. The combine is a race of beings obsessed with going above the physical form, in mastering what they cannot even comprehend... They wish to become creatures of four dimensions, exploring the physical world behind the physical world... Similar to the miraculous jump from chemical ooze to living beings, they are hoping to jump from their mortal flesh and become... well... what the gman already is, something beyond.

And the gman is? A sort of god, a fourth-dimension scientist toying with a third dimension petri dish. And just like the legendary men of greek mythology, what the combine must ultimately learn is that they may never avoid their destiny... to get reamed royally by Gordon with a stick so big that it will make the one they put in nihilanth look like splinter =D

 

[SubCog]

i think you are all missing what's important.

Gordon gets to spend a week alone with Alyx! I know what happened during that week! 'Lots of snogging, I'd say.

 

[gcomeau]

I haven't seen any time travel...

A few points to consider for anyone interested in dwelling on the various temporal effects you see in the course of the game:

1. Being in some form of stasis is not time travel. At least not in any greater sense than I am time travelling right now. (I just time travelled a second... another one... another one!) Sure, from your perspective one moment you were in one time then a moment later you're in a very different later time, appearing to you to have "travelled" forward in time, but you traversed that time just the same as everyone else did, you just weren't conscious for the process.

The same thing applies to the "slow teleport".

2. Instantaneously teleporting somewhere does not let you travel backward in time just because you're outpacing light. It only allows you to "look" back in time after a fashion. Let's say I'm standing on Earth and then I instantaneously teleport to Alpha Centauri. If I was then to whip out a super-duper high powered telescope and look back at Earth I would see an earth approximately four years previous in time to when I left... but that's only because the light from those events is only just now reaching Alpha Centauri. If I was to spend five minutes watching this in amazement that I had "travelled back in time" 4 years and then rushed to teleport back so I could lay some wagers on some sporting events I would arrive back on Earth approximately five minutes after I left, not having travelled in time at all.

For those talking about being able to listen to earlier events that happened on Earth after teleporting to Zen in HL1, I would suspect some variant of this is the effect you're experiencing there... so no time travel.

However, if anyone has any other evidence of there being time travel involved I'd be interested in hearing it.

 

[Grumpy]

You have to realise where the G-Man comes from..time does not exist in any recognizable form. The Dimension he resides in is almost certainly the home dimension of the Vortigons, and it is connected to all points in time, or at the least allows access to any moment in time.

 

[KagePrototype]

You have to realise where the G-Man comes from..time does not exist in any recognizable form. The Dimension he resides in is almost certainly the home dimension of the Vortigons, and it is connected to all points in time, or at the least allows access to any moment in time.

The vortigaunts are from Xen, I doubt that Gman comes from there.

As for the whole time travel thing, I don't see how it's that big a deal in the story. Time in itself, maybe (since Gordon seems to bugger off for large amounts of time thanks to this slow teleport), might be some sort of recurring theme, but time travel I doubt.

 

[Grumpy]

Actually, according to the Vortigons, they do not ORIGINATE from Xen..they seem to have been enslaved and made to work there

The ending for HL1 and HL2 shows how the time travel works. There is a dimension that is an axial corridor, this corridor allows passage up and down its axis. You can go to any TIME and/or LOCATION by stepping off, as shown by the Gman opening a door for you in HL1 from the rail car and stepping through a door in HL2.

 

[CriYam]

A few points to consider for anyone interested in dwelling on the various temporal effects you see in the course of the game:

. Instantaneously teleporting somewhere does not let you travel backward in time just because you're outpacing light. It only allows you to "look" back in time after a fashion. Let's say I'm standing on Earth and then I instantaneously teleport to Alpha Centauri. If I was then to whip out a super-duper high powered telescope and look back at Earth I would see an earth approximately four years previous in time to when I left... but that's only because the light from those events is only just now reaching Alpha Centauri. If I was to spend five minutes watching this in amazement that I had "travelled back in time" 4 years and then rushed to teleport back so I could lay some wagers on some sporting events I would arrive back on Earth approximately five minutes after I left, not having travelled in time at all.

For those talking about being able to listen to earlier events that happened on Earth after teleporting to Zen in HL1, I would suspect some variant of this is the effect you're experiencing there... so no time travel.

However, if anyone has any other evidence of there being time travel involved I'd be interested in hearing it.

Your synopsis defeats itself; in that, in order for the sound to travel through space (impossible for one) and be heard by you on Xen; would require you to time travel ahead millions of years in time to wait for the exact moment that sound would reach Xen.

What you're hearing is the moment of the accident which involves yourself. And that is time travel.

 

[gcomeau]

Your synopsis defeats itself; in that, in order for the sound to travel through space (impossible for one) and be heard by you on Xen; would require you to time travel ahead millions of years in time to wait for the exact moment that sound would reach Xen.

It's coming through the portal, not space. Xen isn't even IN "space", at least not ours. It's in another dimension. The only question is how long it took to transmit... is that portal as fast as the one Gordon took to Zen or was it more delayed similar to the one Gordon and Alex took out of Nova Prospekt.

Evidence indicates the latter, since Gordon beat the sound there.