F*CK You Valve I Cant Play Half Life 2 Becasue Of Your Goddam Piracy Bullshit!!!!
C
codeninja
Guest
Are you people retarded or what?
I bet you've all got MMORPGs at home and moan about them too.
FFS - This game has been in the news for AGES. Can't you READ?
It says - and always has done, that it REQUIRES an internet connection to activate it.
I'm suprised there is no phone-based option but thats just tough shit for all you guys.
And those people who say "just go to an internet cafe etc.." you are TOTALLY stupid as many people have pointed out this won't work.
I bet you are frustrated and I don't blame you since HL2 is seriously enjoyable, but maybe you should be frustrated at yourselves rather than Valve.
The fact that it requires internet activation really has been common knowledge for a long time now.
DUH!
I bet you've all got MMORPGs at home and moan about them too.
FFS - This game has been in the news for AGES. Can't you READ?
It says - and always has done, that it REQUIRES an internet connection to activate it.
I'm suprised there is no phone-based option but thats just tough shit for all you guys.
And those people who say "just go to an internet cafe etc.." you are TOTALLY stupid as many people have pointed out this won't work.
I bet you are frustrated and I don't blame you since HL2 is seriously enjoyable, but maybe you should be frustrated at yourselves rather than Valve.
The fact that it requires internet activation really has been common knowledge for a long time now.
DUH!
-JeZ-
Newbie
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SunHawk, many people are dissapointed and in some cases angry that Half-Life 2, this single player masterpiece, requires online activation in order to play. Many people want HL2 only for it's single player experiance and have no want for Counter-Strike : Source or any other single or multi-player mod. Unfortunately VALVe decided against releasing a sp only version of the game (which I assume wouldn't have required online activation). Perhaps they decided to remove this retail option simply because they wanted everyone to use Steam, to be in some way connected to their online service.
It's a shame that this option was removed, as many people cannot now play the game, this SINGLE PLAYER game. I can see you argument, and I do agree with what you've said, looking at it from a pure, single player only, position.
I've always wanted HL2 for both online and offline play, mainly because I know somewhere out there is a MOD being developed which will change the mp gaming scene as much as CS did. But from a purely sp point of view, your argument is sound.
There's really not much anyone can do about this situation though, it's just the way VALVe/Vivendi have decided to play it.
Not much more to say really, apart from HALF-LIFE 2 is the best FPS I've ever played, and if you decided to put your misgivings behind you, you would experience something which truly is the next level in PC gaming. :thumbs:
It's a shame that this option was removed, as many people cannot now play the game, this SINGLE PLAYER game. I can see you argument, and I do agree with what you've said, looking at it from a pure, single player only, position.
I've always wanted HL2 for both online and offline play, mainly because I know somewhere out there is a MOD being developed which will change the mp gaming scene as much as CS did. But from a purely sp point of view, your argument is sound.
There's really not much anyone can do about this situation though, it's just the way VALVe/Vivendi have decided to play it.
Not much more to say really, apart from HALF-LIFE 2 is the best FPS I've ever played, and if you decided to put your misgivings behind you, you would experience something which truly is the next level in PC gaming. :thumbs:
S
showbiz2
Guest
Sun, just out of curiosity, were you aware of the registration process before you purchased the game? I find it hard to believe you were not, but still curious.
If you weren't, did you read the requirements on the box?
If you weren't, did you read the requirements on the box?
Showbiz:like many others, I monitored this game closely since incept.
In case you missed my earlier intro(its an old post so thats okay) I've played them ALL.
CS,DoD, HL singleplay, HL multiplay, a huge load of mods.The lot.Mine was the GOTY edition..hell I even helped write some beta test data for wickedgl(did three bug reports and forwarded them with an analysis of what happened..never got a reply but I did it because thats what gamers do)
I was aware that up until recently (and NO I can't find where they changed it, so maybe you can tell me) that no online auth was required to play singleplayer.
After browsing both this forum and steampowered.com (and I'd be careful what you say over there, there are some VERY angry people with very good reason to be so.) I have decided I am not even THINKING of buying HL2 until I am certain that Valve has solved what seem to be some serious issues with the game and with authentication.
Read through my earlier posts and you will see my earlier comments and stance on this.
If I do not see that the issues raised have been addressed satisfactorily, then I wont buy it...and will dissuade anyone else I see and know from buying it either.
I am well aware I am "disposable"...but that does not invalidate the growing number of angry posts and upset people over what looks to be some serious shortcomings and lack of foresight on the part of Valve.
I am not a "troll"..and it looks like I am not alone in my misgivings either.
One of the responses to an angry customer was to snidely tell her she should have preloaded...in case it had escaped the notice of many here, not everyone has broadband and not everyone can download a 300 meg update or patch on a 56k dialup.
Dismiss me if you will....it will change nothing.
In case you missed my earlier intro(its an old post so thats okay) I've played them ALL.
CS,DoD, HL singleplay, HL multiplay, a huge load of mods.The lot.Mine was the GOTY edition..hell I even helped write some beta test data for wickedgl(did three bug reports and forwarded them with an analysis of what happened..never got a reply but I did it because thats what gamers do)
I was aware that up until recently (and NO I can't find where they changed it, so maybe you can tell me) that no online auth was required to play singleplayer.
After browsing both this forum and steampowered.com (and I'd be careful what you say over there, there are some VERY angry people with very good reason to be so.) I have decided I am not even THINKING of buying HL2 until I am certain that Valve has solved what seem to be some serious issues with the game and with authentication.
Read through my earlier posts and you will see my earlier comments and stance on this.
If I do not see that the issues raised have been addressed satisfactorily, then I wont buy it...and will dissuade anyone else I see and know from buying it either.
I am well aware I am "disposable"...but that does not invalidate the growing number of angry posts and upset people over what looks to be some serious shortcomings and lack of foresight on the part of Valve.
I am not a "troll"..and it looks like I am not alone in my misgivings either.
One of the responses to an angry customer was to snidely tell her she should have preloaded...in case it had escaped the notice of many here, not everyone has broadband and not everyone can download a 300 meg update or patch on a 56k dialup.
Dismiss me if you will....it will change nothing.
S
showbiz2
Guest
Nope, just curious. Good luck with your anger management and the warez copy you will get.
Sunhawk, it is pretty simple. You look at the minium system requirements and then you compare them to yours.
My PC | PC Needed
----------------------
No internet | Internet
Can you see how your problem araised? It's so very simple, yet you still have trouble grasping the concept YOU where wrong and find it easier to blame valve
Sort ya self out, please...
My PC | PC Needed
----------------------
No internet | Internet
Can you see how your problem araised? It's so very simple, yet you still have trouble grasping the concept YOU where wrong and find it easier to blame valve
Sort ya self out, please...
B
b0ned0me
Guest
Sorry to say, I have to agree with Sunhawk
My DVD copy of HL2 arrived on my desk this morning. I decided to have a quick browse around for known problems & solutions so when I get home I would have some idea what to expect, and came across this thread, amongst many similar ones
Why did I go looking for problems? Because 50% of the games I have purchased in the last couple of years have had problems of some kind in the installation process. What has been the cause of most of these problems? Copy Protection. How have I solved most of these problems? By downloading cracks circulated by the Warez community for the purposes of piracy.
It's an interesting state of affairs when paying customers get a worse user experiene than the thieves, and actually have to go to the thieves to get help in making their legitimate purchases work. Sort of like towing you brand-new car from the dealer to the local carthief to get the immobiliser switched off.
Hopefully I won't have any issues, because my PC is easily twice the minimum spec and I have DSL, but if I do have problems I will be relying on the crackers/warezfiends rather than Valve/Sierra/VU customer support to get it working. And every time this happens, I have to admit I do wonder why I bother getting games from Amazon rather than bittorrent....
My DVD copy of HL2 arrived on my desk this morning. I decided to have a quick browse around for known problems & solutions so when I get home I would have some idea what to expect, and came across this thread, amongst many similar ones
Why did I go looking for problems? Because 50% of the games I have purchased in the last couple of years have had problems of some kind in the installation process. What has been the cause of most of these problems? Copy Protection. How have I solved most of these problems? By downloading cracks circulated by the Warez community for the purposes of piracy.
It's an interesting state of affairs when paying customers get a worse user experiene than the thieves, and actually have to go to the thieves to get help in making their legitimate purchases work. Sort of like towing you brand-new car from the dealer to the local carthief to get the immobiliser switched off.
Hopefully I won't have any issues, because my PC is easily twice the minimum spec and I have DSL, but if I do have problems I will be relying on the crackers/warezfiends rather than Valve/Sierra/VU customer support to get it working. And every time this happens, I have to admit I do wonder why I bother getting games from Amazon rather than bittorrent....
The Dark Elf
Newbie
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- Oct 5, 2003
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showbiz2 said:
For a long time that wasn't the case. You'd buy the retail one, and not have to use the net unless you wanted to update it, at which point you'd have to use steam like that.. Then with all the changes this one got quietly mentioned and a lot of people didn't realise, so its an honest mistake. Lots of people buying retail and not knowing about it. It's the problem, no net or very little makes it hard to keep upto date, so its catch 22 really.
I personally think the whole steam thing stinks to high heaven, im stuck having to play it on a net machine not a games machine simply because of steam and the fact I don't want the other machine going near the net for obvious security reasons. And from what I've seen, im not the only one in that position neither. Not everyone has the means to use the net on any machine they want, in many cases the ISP themselves have rules against more than one.
If someone uses warez without buying the game, yeah, they need dealing with.. But if someone buys the game, and then warez' it so they can actually play what they just bought (moreso in this case cause it ain't even Multiplayer) then I don't see a problem with that, they legally paid for a game that would otherwise run for them, if it wasn't for piracy measures that wont work in the long run anyway.)
Steam and the whole online thing makes sense for CS:S, because its MP, it doesn't for HL2 because its SP.
They should go back to the old method.. If you buy it retail, you don't need the net period. Or atleast allow for a phone in registration or something so it can be played. Then if you want to update it, you need to use steam and you need to do it online. It would be the fairest method cause right now, people buying it legit are being stung far worse than the warezmonkey's who'll just crack it anyway and never have this problem.
Anyway, HL2 is great, loved the ending
A really naughty friend of mine told me that there is already a crack out there to disable the steam requirement. This same horrible, horrible person told me that he's going to try it out when his copy arrives. If I can bear to speak to this scumbag again, I will let you know what he says about it.
K
KyanVrezpor
Guest
My PC isn't great, but I use the same one for both the Internet and single-player gaming. So I don't have any problems with Steam, I think it's a great idea.
I can see your frustration though.
I can see your frustration though.
S
showbiz2
Guest
I guess I look at this a bit differently. In this day and age it becomes something of a chore to not have the internet in some form or fashion.
I would like to see some statistics of the number of users complaining of not having the internet broken down by age and location. Cross reference by how much illegal stuff on their computers. And then see how many of these people have antivirus on their computers.
I am NOT trying to imply anything, I just am very curious.
As time goes on, more and more things will require registration. OS's, antivirus, office programs, accounting software, etc etc. People who say it is not needed take no time to think of the money that goes into R and D on these items. It is simply protection of intellectual property. How would you feel if I took your diary and put it out on the net and didn't give you credit for the brilliant new mod idea you have? Protected that little Source World, didn't you?
Be prepared, it won't be long before registration is required on more and more pieces of software. I, for one, don't mind, it is the future of computing. (You think nothing of giving out your email to sign up for sights like this, what's the difference?)
Those that scream the loudest are typically the ones who are concerned with how they will get their stolen warez to work. They are ON THE INTERNET screaming about how it's an invasion of privacy to request information over the internet. Bit ironic isn't it?
I would like to see some statistics of the number of users complaining of not having the internet broken down by age and location. Cross reference by how much illegal stuff on their computers. And then see how many of these people have antivirus on their computers.
I am NOT trying to imply anything, I just am very curious.
As time goes on, more and more things will require registration. OS's, antivirus, office programs, accounting software, etc etc. People who say it is not needed take no time to think of the money that goes into R and D on these items. It is simply protection of intellectual property. How would you feel if I took your diary and put it out on the net and didn't give you credit for the brilliant new mod idea you have? Protected that little Source World, didn't you?
Be prepared, it won't be long before registration is required on more and more pieces of software. I, for one, don't mind, it is the future of computing. (You think nothing of giving out your email to sign up for sights like this, what's the difference?)
Those that scream the loudest are typically the ones who are concerned with how they will get their stolen warez to work. They are ON THE INTERNET screaming about how it's an invasion of privacy to request information over the internet. Bit ironic isn't it?
S
spanky222
Guest
For those of us with up to date hardware and expensive web connections, we wanted a game that would take advantage of our investments. Valve answered with Half Life 2. Thank you!
I bought HL2 download online from steampowered.com.
-The price was smooth
-The credit card transaction was smooth
-The download was smooth
-The installation was smooth
-The registration was smooth
-The game play is smooth
-The graphics are more than smooth! (and look even better than the trailers)
Besides a highspeed cable modem connection, I believe I have standard, everyday, current, cheap gaming hardware for todays standards: A64-3200, MSIk8tNeo-mb, 1gb-ram, 256mb-9800pro & sata-hdd. This hardware is nothing special and cost me less than $800
Everything goes smoothly if you buy the right tools for the job.
So all you whinners complaining about the other aspects of this game: "this game wasn't made for people like you". So go buy a playstation or something.
I have no complaints about any aspect of this game (exept that at the moment I appear to be stuck in 3-meters of water trying to stack some barrels so I can reach a tunnel entrance 10-meters up... LOL)
I bought HL2 download online from steampowered.com.
-The price was smooth
-The credit card transaction was smooth
-The download was smooth
-The installation was smooth
-The registration was smooth
-The game play is smooth
-The graphics are more than smooth! (and look even better than the trailers)
Besides a highspeed cable modem connection, I believe I have standard, everyday, current, cheap gaming hardware for todays standards: A64-3200, MSIk8tNeo-mb, 1gb-ram, 256mb-9800pro & sata-hdd. This hardware is nothing special and cost me less than $800
Everything goes smoothly if you buy the right tools for the job.
So all you whinners complaining about the other aspects of this game: "this game wasn't made for people like you". So go buy a playstation or something.
I have no complaints about any aspect of this game (exept that at the moment I appear to be stuck in 3-meters of water trying to stack some barrels so I can reach a tunnel entrance 10-meters up... LOL)
S
substrate001
Guest
Here's how this whole situation feels to me:
I paid for the game at BestBuy, I come home to install it and have numerous problems trying to do so. No big deal, as it's the day of release and the servers are busy... well, it took 2 freakin hours to get to the Steam servers, just so they could tell me they were too busy to process my registration, then it took about 15-20 more minutes for them to make my retail version ready to play on my PC(still not fully registered, just ready to play). They knew it was gonna be big, they should have been prepared- no excuses! Finally get it installed and IT IS an awesome game! One caveat: I don't feel I should have to login to Steam every single time I play my Legally Purchased and Steam validated SINGLE PLAYER GAME! What do I do if my connection isn't working due to weather problems? Those times are when I would most want to play! I do have a relatively fast internet connection (1.5Mbps Satellite) and a fast enough PC to enjoy this game, and IT ROCKS! I simply feel the security implementation unfairly punishes the person like me who shells out $54.99, registers the valid, retail game online, then has to connect to Steam every freakin time they wanna play! BTW: One of the reasons this P.O.'s me is the inability to use my custom harware configs, which DO NOT include any services such as: network connections, internet , print spooler, etc. I must say that I love everything else about this game. Just my $.02.
I paid for the game at BestBuy, I come home to install it and have numerous problems trying to do so. No big deal, as it's the day of release and the servers are busy... well, it took 2 freakin hours to get to the Steam servers, just so they could tell me they were too busy to process my registration, then it took about 15-20 more minutes for them to make my retail version ready to play on my PC(still not fully registered, just ready to play). They knew it was gonna be big, they should have been prepared- no excuses! Finally get it installed and IT IS an awesome game! One caveat: I don't feel I should have to login to Steam every single time I play my Legally Purchased and Steam validated SINGLE PLAYER GAME! What do I do if my connection isn't working due to weather problems? Those times are when I would most want to play! I do have a relatively fast internet connection (1.5Mbps Satellite) and a fast enough PC to enjoy this game, and IT ROCKS! I simply feel the security implementation unfairly punishes the person like me who shells out $54.99, registers the valid, retail game online, then has to connect to Steam every freakin time they wanna play! BTW: One of the reasons this P.O.'s me is the inability to use my custom harware configs, which DO NOT include any services such as: network connections, internet , print spooler, etc. I must say that I love everything else about this game. Just my $.02.
C
codeninja
Guest
Sunhawk.
Its obvious from your posts that :
a) You didn't read the requirements.
and
b) You didn't read the requirements.
Do you whine and bitch about every aspect of your life in this manner?
I bet you own an automatic 4x4 and live in the city don't you.
Its obvious from your posts that :
a) You didn't read the requirements.
and
b) You didn't read the requirements.
Do you whine and bitch about every aspect of your life in this manner?
I bet you own an automatic 4x4 and live in the city don't you.
Kadayi Polokov
Go to steampowered.com and say that.
Then get ready to run.
Substrate:
Yes, it does. Why'd you do it, Valve? What were you thinking??? WERE you thinking???
Except that these are consumers who will not hesitate to complain and return the product.
"Goods not of a merchantable quality".
Hear that Kodoy?
Go on say it..or I will.
Whichever wunderkind thought this one up didn't think it through.
Yes.I've been saying this for a while.
No one listened.
Funny..isn't that exactly what I was saying?
Um Kodoy....thats one of your own moderators speaking,
I'd shut up and listen if I were you.
Go to steampowered.com and say that.
Then get ready to run.
Substrate:
Yes, it does. Why'd you do it, Valve? What were you thinking??? WERE you thinking???
Except that these are consumers who will not hesitate to complain and return the product.
"Goods not of a merchantable quality".
Hear that Kodoy?
Go on say it..or I will.
Whichever wunderkind thought this one up didn't think it through.
Yes.I've been saying this for a while.
No one listened.
Funny..isn't that exactly what I was saying?
Um Kodoy....thats one of your own moderators speaking,
I'd shut up and listen if I were you.
D
Dragoneyez
Guest
Kadayi Polokov said:
Right... Being a first time poster means that all the experience the poster in question has of experience from games, life and jobs doesn't matter - because they're first time posters with an opinion not fitting the Mighty Kadayi, they are stupid gits...
First of all, we ALL are first time posters at some point. Believe it or not, but you were, too, when you started.
Also, sorry to burst your bubble, mate, but Steam stinks... As in is not working. As in keeps crashing. As in won't let you activate/use the game, because you cannot connect to the servers...
A
AlmostThere
Guest
If the method of activation is 'reasonable' perhaps someone would explain the process for deactivating a copy of HL2 so that it can be sold second hand?
Unless I am mistaken, valve get a $10 tax on every copy sold second hand thorugh a deactivation charge (plus shipping costs and inconvenience, which is more for non-US residents who have to ship a DVD case overseas) which I find hard to justify.
Unless I am mistaken, valve get a $10 tax on every copy sold second hand thorugh a deactivation charge (plus shipping costs and inconvenience, which is more for non-US residents who have to ship a DVD case overseas) which I find hard to justify.
let's think about this and look at it logically. In order for the game to validate that you've registered online, it HAS to create a file in your HL2 directory.. so if you installed it on a friend's PC, waited a day or so and then verified it the next day, you could search for files created on that day in that directory. Just a theory, haven't tried it or bought HL2 yet.
C
codeninja
Guest
At work I submit a requirements document for a new piece of software, everyone who will use the new software reads it and signs it off. Then I do the design, which gets signed off, then the implementation. This is signed off by the other coders. After that it's tested and again signed off by the testing team and the users that will use it. Then the senior management team sign it off and thats it all sorted.
You know what - by this stage I'm feeling pretty proud of what I've done. Its all good - working and everyone is happy. I get to go home early for a change - enjoy the weekends and I sleep better too.
But you know what? as soon as people start using it they complain
"Oh - its not what I wanted whine whine"
"Its nice but it isnt what I asked for...it doesnt do this etc etc."
I get this day-in, day-out and I'm sick to death of it. Why is it people love to criticise once something is finished, but never help to make it better before then. Has anyone else read "A little red hen" here?
I fully support Valves position on this matter - it states quite clearly on the box "requires internet connection". Its not like they have tried to cover it up - its no secret - this is an attempt by them to sell and market a game themselves.
We all know how little the developers get paid - and what they go through (if you don't you really should find out). Its not a fair industry and the developers at Valve deserve some payback for the work they have put in to it.
It requires you to go online to active it - SO WHAT?! its a brave attempt to reduce piracy and increase the money going to developers - thumbs up from me. I hope it works out for them.
They dont have a phone based activation service - SO WHAT?! They never said they were going to ! did anyone ASK for this before it was released? NO. Only NOW do they get thousands of complaints about it.
On top of that,
I doubt that phone activation could actually work for this game anyway - from what I am *guessing* the entire content is encrypted using a public key based system. (Otherwise letting anyone download the whole of HL2 would just be an invitation to copy it).
This is not some dumb scratchcard offer where u ring a number, enter a code and see what u have won. This is a real attempt at making game sales more secure and reducing piracy.
I can tell you now that the key to activate/unencrypt it is not going to be "secret" or "letmein" or even the 000-000-000-000 format we are used to - its more likely going to be a 128/256 bit binary key. There will be no "remind me of my unencryption key if I forget it", and there sure as hell isn't a "whats your mothers maiden name" box.
Now, if you want to sit on the phone and have some call centre trainee go "A3FFD00110103dA5171FCDA123BAB3FFD00110103dA5171FCDA123BAB3FFD00110103dA5171FCDA123BAB3FFD00110103dA5171FCDA123BAB3FFD00110103dA5171FCDA123BAB3FFD00110103dA5171FCDA123BABB ETC " (yes I do know T is not Hex) down the phone at you then go for it. Oh - you'll need a binary file editor (hmm actually Valve are crap because they don't provide one aren't they), and a good understanding of Hexidecimal. Of course the operator will have perfect english, the phone line will be crystal clear, there will be no queue and you will of course have perfect hearing (doesn't everyone these days?)
I just don't see it working. sorry. Phone activation just wont work for this imho.
These guys have had to work hard for another year on this project - trying to salvage their work from the pits of piracy (tm).
yeah, I bet you are all thinking thats really cool aren't you - it isn't. Game development is one of the most demanding industries there is. They have had to do this JUST because their code was put on the net by some thief. Oh - did I mention that during this time they would not have got any extra income? no bonus, no lovely royalties. I bet a lot of them were pushed to the point of quitting in fact.
I whole heartedly support the developers at Valve, what they have produced is stunningly good, and they have made a brave move in the industry towards independant sale. This is a good thing.
You know what - by this stage I'm feeling pretty proud of what I've done. Its all good - working and everyone is happy. I get to go home early for a change - enjoy the weekends and I sleep better too.
But you know what? as soon as people start using it they complain
"Oh - its not what I wanted whine whine"
"Its nice but it isnt what I asked for...it doesnt do this etc etc."
I get this day-in, day-out and I'm sick to death of it. Why is it people love to criticise once something is finished, but never help to make it better before then. Has anyone else read "A little red hen" here?
I fully support Valves position on this matter - it states quite clearly on the box "requires internet connection". Its not like they have tried to cover it up - its no secret - this is an attempt by them to sell and market a game themselves.
We all know how little the developers get paid - and what they go through (if you don't you really should find out). Its not a fair industry and the developers at Valve deserve some payback for the work they have put in to it.
It requires you to go online to active it - SO WHAT?! its a brave attempt to reduce piracy and increase the money going to developers - thumbs up from me. I hope it works out for them.
They dont have a phone based activation service - SO WHAT?! They never said they were going to ! did anyone ASK for this before it was released? NO. Only NOW do they get thousands of complaints about it.
On top of that,
I doubt that phone activation could actually work for this game anyway - from what I am *guessing* the entire content is encrypted using a public key based system. (Otherwise letting anyone download the whole of HL2 would just be an invitation to copy it).
This is not some dumb scratchcard offer where u ring a number, enter a code and see what u have won. This is a real attempt at making game sales more secure and reducing piracy.
I can tell you now that the key to activate/unencrypt it is not going to be "secret" or "letmein" or even the 000-000-000-000 format we are used to - its more likely going to be a 128/256 bit binary key. There will be no "remind me of my unencryption key if I forget it", and there sure as hell isn't a "whats your mothers maiden name" box.
Now, if you want to sit on the phone and have some call centre trainee go "A3FFD00110103dA5171FCDA123BAB3FFD00110103dA5171FCDA123BAB3FFD00110103dA5171FCDA123BAB3FFD00110103dA5171FCDA123BAB3FFD00110103dA5171FCDA123BAB3FFD00110103dA5171FCDA123BABB ETC " (yes I do know T is not Hex) down the phone at you then go for it. Oh - you'll need a binary file editor (hmm actually Valve are crap because they don't provide one aren't they), and a good understanding of Hexidecimal. Of course the operator will have perfect english, the phone line will be crystal clear, there will be no queue and you will of course have perfect hearing (doesn't everyone these days?)
I just don't see it working. sorry. Phone activation just wont work for this imho.
These guys have had to work hard for another year on this project - trying to salvage their work from the pits of piracy (tm).
yeah, I bet you are all thinking thats really cool aren't you - it isn't. Game development is one of the most demanding industries there is. They have had to do this JUST because their code was put on the net by some thief. Oh - did I mention that during this time they would not have got any extra income? no bonus, no lovely royalties. I bet a lot of them were pushed to the point of quitting in fact.
I whole heartedly support the developers at Valve, what they have produced is stunningly good, and they have made a brave move in the industry towards independant sale. This is a good thing.
Max_Payne
Spy
- Joined
- May 20, 2004
- Messages
- 424
- Reaction score
- 3
codeninja your da man. if i ever see ya , remind me to buy ya a beer lol. Seriously people... LISTEN TO WHAT HE HAS TO SAY! lol dude i am a full supporter too, of what valve did. THEY HAD EVERY RIGHT TO DO IT... so people stop your bitching and get on wit the world.
PEACE
Mike
PEACE
Mike
P
perryrhodan
Guest
codeninja said:
The tiny label state "internet connection required".....when in the past, did you purchase a game that stated that, it was for activation purpose? when? never. Because when you purchased a game with this "requirement" they alway specified that: "for online play you need Internet connection"...so you know why you need this connection. But right now, on this Half Life 2 requirement label, this is not specified!!!!! In no place on the box it is specified that YOU NEED AN INTERNET CONNECTION TO PLAY THE OFFLINE GAME or to AUTHENTIFICATE IT. So anybody unaware of all the "politics" around the Steam service, can think that it simply mean, like on all the other "requirement label" of any other game, that you need it to play online.
On the second paragraph of the quote, I totally agree this fact.
On the third paragraph of the quote: If you think that this method of anti-piracy will be succefull and in the next few weeks, nobody will be able to crack it, you're more stupid than I think. This protection "sheme" is more annoying for every one than anything else. It's just a lame attemps to counteract the piracy. But like all other method this one will just fall flat. Period.
Steam it's a good way for getting direct game by downloading it. maybe a good serviced for playing online. But Far far from a good way to beat piracy.
C
codeninja
Guest
Ok..I must the the only person on the planet that HAS had to activate software over the net then. Valve are not the first to do it but they are the first to enforce it rather than offer a phone service in tandem.
As I mentioned, the phone service won't work inho.
I also never said that this method would be successful, OR that no one would be able to crack it. The simple fact is - that for a very reasonable amount of money, we can get HL2, HL:Source, DoD:Source, CS:Source and their back catalogue AND most importantly, the money we have paid for it is going to Valve and not the publisher.
This money is gonna help them finance their next project, and make them less reliant on scheduled chunks of money from investors/publishers. This is a very good thing is you knew what game dev was like.
I am pretty sure that someone will crack it - but I've already seen people say on the forums here "our group has cracked it but I am going to buy it because its so good". I don't care if its cracked - I want to pay Valve for this.
This is the first time I have bought a new game and not thought "thats expensive". I seriously would happily have paid even more for this - because my money is not going to the spawn of satan (marketing and sales), and that makes me happy.
You think its a bad way to beat piracy? well...
a) How else could Valve distribute their software without using a publisher? would you like them to just put a link up to HL2 on their website? non-game Software like Paintshop Pro has been doing this for years and has failed miserably to combat piracy. Even software with hardware dongles (AutoCAD, 3d Studio etc) has had its security schemes removed.
b) Public key cryptography has been used by companies and military institutions for years. It works. It ensures that one person downloading HL2 will get data that is unique to them. One person cannot copy their downloaded files to a mate for them to unlock. In addition, the encryption itself cannot be cracked by non governmental means.
c) Believe me, Valve are not stupid in doing this. This IS the way we will be aquiring software in the near future.
In short, for you to say its a lame attempt to counteract piracy is a naive statement. Its a good attempt in my opinion.
As I mentioned, the phone service won't work inho.
I also never said that this method would be successful, OR that no one would be able to crack it. The simple fact is - that for a very reasonable amount of money, we can get HL2, HL:Source, DoD:Source, CS:Source and their back catalogue AND most importantly, the money we have paid for it is going to Valve and not the publisher.
This money is gonna help them finance their next project, and make them less reliant on scheduled chunks of money from investors/publishers. This is a very good thing is you knew what game dev was like.
I am pretty sure that someone will crack it - but I've already seen people say on the forums here "our group has cracked it but I am going to buy it because its so good". I don't care if its cracked - I want to pay Valve for this.
This is the first time I have bought a new game and not thought "thats expensive". I seriously would happily have paid even more for this - because my money is not going to the spawn of satan (marketing and sales), and that makes me happy.
You think its a bad way to beat piracy? well...
a) How else could Valve distribute their software without using a publisher? would you like them to just put a link up to HL2 on their website? non-game Software like Paintshop Pro has been doing this for years and has failed miserably to combat piracy. Even software with hardware dongles (AutoCAD, 3d Studio etc) has had its security schemes removed.
b) Public key cryptography has been used by companies and military institutions for years. It works. It ensures that one person downloading HL2 will get data that is unique to them. One person cannot copy their downloaded files to a mate for them to unlock. In addition, the encryption itself cannot be cracked by non governmental means.
c) Believe me, Valve are not stupid in doing this. This IS the way we will be aquiring software in the near future.
In short, for you to say its a lame attempt to counteract piracy is a naive statement. Its a good attempt in my opinion.
P
perryrhodan
Guest
The encryption key will have to be 256 bits, because if you dont already know, two years ago, a group of hackers have proved to be able to crack 128 bit encryption key with 4 Apple MacG4 in running in parallel in "only" 15 ours. That why the american governement had adopted the 256 bit now.
But I know one thing. If Valve or Vivendi goes out of business, your game will become useless (if crakers did not successfully crack the game or if you stay in the "good way" to not crack any game). Take the exemple of the popularity or Half Life 1 and Counter Strike 1. After near 6 year, people still play it. People purchased reedition. So it have a market for "oldies". But with Half Life 2 , if Vivendi or Valve goes out of business, or decide to force people to purchased their last game, they can decide to not support it anymore. Will be just good to clean your ass with the paper of the box.
Like someone else reflection on another board:
"my friend yesterday bought HALO2 on the Xbox. After coming home, it open the DVD box, read the little booklet, pop the disk in and play............look theres something wrong here."
Try to compose the same paragraphe with HL2 (HL base edition not the supposed "special edition")....
"my friend yesterday bought HL2. After coming home, it open the box and find nothing more than 5 cheap sleeve with five CD disk...no book....he pop the first disk, and start installing it...after 20 minutes of disk swapping, he think he can begin to play but start a long process of authentifying online and unlocking files also only...that took near 1 hour with his 56k modem. After that he can start playing"
Thats annoying.
As I stated Steam is a very good idea in implementing "online services" that range to selling game directly to the gamer and online play. But only for those who dont care in the "beatifull" box, manual and other good like that. And this method of authentification will be only good, if in the future of the game, in its EOL, Valve relase a patch to bypass the need of a connection whit their server, to permit future generation of gamer and older gamer, and game collector, to be able to play with the game in a legal matter.
I'm for anti-piracy conter measure. But when did you see this kind of futile and annoying method for books? movie DVD? Music CD? console games? Imagine that in the near futur you have to do this with all digital media you purchase with this kind of poor performance result? It's innaceptable. If the governement take more measure to track pirates that they take to conteract drugs, piracy will drop in a level that publishing company will not have to use this king of annoying method.
Anyway I hope this will not be a general tendency and another effective method will be foud, because I think its not a bright future for game publisher.
But I know one thing. If Valve or Vivendi goes out of business, your game will become useless (if crakers did not successfully crack the game or if you stay in the "good way" to not crack any game). Take the exemple of the popularity or Half Life 1 and Counter Strike 1. After near 6 year, people still play it. People purchased reedition. So it have a market for "oldies". But with Half Life 2 , if Vivendi or Valve goes out of business, or decide to force people to purchased their last game, they can decide to not support it anymore. Will be just good to clean your ass with the paper of the box.
Like someone else reflection on another board:
"my friend yesterday bought HALO2 on the Xbox. After coming home, it open the DVD box, read the little booklet, pop the disk in and play............look theres something wrong here."
Try to compose the same paragraphe with HL2 (HL base edition not the supposed "special edition")....
"my friend yesterday bought HL2. After coming home, it open the box and find nothing more than 5 cheap sleeve with five CD disk...no book....he pop the first disk, and start installing it...after 20 minutes of disk swapping, he think he can begin to play but start a long process of authentifying online and unlocking files also only...that took near 1 hour with his 56k modem. After that he can start playing"
Thats annoying.
As I stated Steam is a very good idea in implementing "online services" that range to selling game directly to the gamer and online play. But only for those who dont care in the "beatifull" box, manual and other good like that. And this method of authentification will be only good, if in the future of the game, in its EOL, Valve relase a patch to bypass the need of a connection whit their server, to permit future generation of gamer and older gamer, and game collector, to be able to play with the game in a legal matter.
I'm for anti-piracy conter measure. But when did you see this kind of futile and annoying method for books? movie DVD? Music CD? console games? Imagine that in the near futur you have to do this with all digital media you purchase with this kind of poor performance result? It's innaceptable. If the governement take more measure to track pirates that they take to conteract drugs, piracy will drop in a level that publishing company will not have to use this king of annoying method.
Anyway I hope this will not be a general tendency and another effective method will be foud, because I think its not a bright future for game publisher.
A
AlmostThere
Guest
I don't see this as an issue about piracy but more an increasing encroachment by software developers of consumer rights to a functional product.
Valve have set up a system that means they can prevent you from using their product at any time and for any reason (check sections 12 and 13 of the Steam subscriber agreement). In the case of offline games such as HL2 this is marginally less limited by provision of an 'offline' mode but one that still offers no guarentees when you come to a reinstall where activation is once again required.
I offered also the example of a tax on the resale of HL2 - I hope I am wrong in this but I don't see where.
This is a one way street and the traffic is flowing in the developers direction. Licences may or may not be enforceable in court - few are fully tested and tend to be US based - but recent legislation e.g. DMCA and EUCD, actively restricts the manner in which the end user may use the software. This is a manufacturer dictating how a product may be used. Hundreds of products may have stupid or inappropriate usages which invalidate warranties and guarentees but how may actively legislate that it is illegal to do so per se?
All these are introduced under the guise of protecting software from piracy and steam is just another step down that path.
Furthermore, software developers have an embarrassingly low level of responsibility to the end user. When was the last time that any software came with any liability agreement for the effects of it's usage?
Many people will accept this on the basis that at the end of the day they have a software product that worst comes to the worst they can hack about with, phone technical support (often at their cost) and hopefully get working in a satisfactory manner. Where Valve have gone further is not only to place the requirement that the actual software works but the need for them to provide a functional activation service in addition. If I pay money to valve then why is it not a reasonable requirement that on the given date, they provide the service for which I have handed over my money? Anyone who took a day off work to celebrate and enjoy the release of HL2 has every right to pe feel pissed off and cheated that they cannot enjoy that software through no fault of their own.
Thousands of hours of gameplay (i.e. somebody's time) have been lost because of an inadequate, paid for, service that prevented access to the game. If HL2 was free then I would have a different level of expecatation. Again, there is no liability on Valve's part.
OK, so it is just a game, big deal? Well, why not extrapolate the situation to the software that runs your computer, the software that runs medical devices or manages air traffic? What about the software than controls the brakes in your car? Software that costs not $50 but $5,000,000? How would you feel about any of those just giving up at any time or at the whim of the developer who has delivered below expectations? Slightly more serious, I think.
I might also add that entertainment is even easier - how often can you take a game back beacuse it is a load of toss? You are forced into a postion that necessitates acceptance of an agreement where it is not even possible to tell if the software meets its stated purpose. Even if I find a supplier that does take unwrapped software back, how are they going to accept a sub-standard game that is going to cost $10 to unlock?
Rather than the hard done by programmer that CodeNinja describes, software developers have it way too easy. The world needs software just like it needs roads and cars, aeroplanes, water purification and so on and so on. Everyone of these engineering achievements puts in place standards for safety, emissions, hygiene etc. etc. - when it goes wrong those responsible are held to account. The excuse that 'if you don't agree, don't install' is washing thin - sorry society has changed - developers should come down of their high horse and face the fact that they should be as accountable as everybody else in the world and accept a little liability for their errors. If you are going to compete in the market place then you should expect to be held responsible.
If you take away the end user's rights, why not offer some reasonable guarentees in it's place?
Cue the complaints from developers expressing how the lack of regulation enables them to push back the boundaries of software design ... well maybe if there were a few regulations and standards to maintain, half the world wouldn't be suffering from billion dollar effects of sobig, iloveyou and friends and 20-odd years of an OS that falls flat on its face when you install a new program. Despite regulations and responsiblity we seem to be able to build a variety of automobiles that variously carry hundreds of tons load, travel 55 miles to a gallon or reach 60mph in under 4 seconds.
Lastly, from those who support online activation, I would really like to know where the boundaries lie for reasonable protection against piracy. Why not mandate online access the whole time ... hey it helps valve? Why not scan the PC and deactivate if any hardware has changed suggesting a copy is on another machine? We already have programs that will not run if various CD buring software is installed - is it acceptable for HL2 not to run if Doom3 is installed? Different purpose? Just because Alcohol is installed does not make someone guilty of software piracy so the issue is no longer about punishing those guilty, merely those likely to be guilty. What about Kazaa or BitTorrent? Guilty too by association. Want to draw a line there, too?
Hell, 51% of convincted pirates are [Conservatives] so why not ban those users too.
Finally, after that rant, (1) sorry if there's any repetition - started as a short comment and I am using the quick reply box (2) this isn't specifically aimed at Valve. HL2 is a fantastic game and while that is the not the way it sounds, I do apprececiate their hard work and efforts to correct problems. Having followed HL, OppForce, BlueShift, CS and now HL2 though the games and got many others to buy and enjoy them too, plus followed a number of interviews and believe they are honestly doing their best and are a genuine group of developers proud of their work. The systems they introduce potentially have, imho, serious negative consequences. Pushing acceptance in this field is something others will not hesitate to take advantage of and the reality is that millions of people just do not read the licence agreements and will not be aware of the implications. Take over by stealth, if you will.
Finally : internet access requirement?
I don't have the exact wording with me but does it say internet access on the same computer and also, from previous post, I am unclear why an activation code, of however many bits, cannot be transferred by email (or even fax). I disagree with the practical constraints and just because you have a great game and can't come up with another method of distribution, doesn't give you the right to inflict misery on others.
Valve have set up a system that means they can prevent you from using their product at any time and for any reason (check sections 12 and 13 of the Steam subscriber agreement). In the case of offline games such as HL2 this is marginally less limited by provision of an 'offline' mode but one that still offers no guarentees when you come to a reinstall where activation is once again required.
I offered also the example of a tax on the resale of HL2 - I hope I am wrong in this but I don't see where.
This is a one way street and the traffic is flowing in the developers direction. Licences may or may not be enforceable in court - few are fully tested and tend to be US based - but recent legislation e.g. DMCA and EUCD, actively restricts the manner in which the end user may use the software. This is a manufacturer dictating how a product may be used. Hundreds of products may have stupid or inappropriate usages which invalidate warranties and guarentees but how may actively legislate that it is illegal to do so per se?
All these are introduced under the guise of protecting software from piracy and steam is just another step down that path.
Furthermore, software developers have an embarrassingly low level of responsibility to the end user. When was the last time that any software came with any liability agreement for the effects of it's usage?
Many people will accept this on the basis that at the end of the day they have a software product that worst comes to the worst they can hack about with, phone technical support (often at their cost) and hopefully get working in a satisfactory manner. Where Valve have gone further is not only to place the requirement that the actual software works but the need for them to provide a functional activation service in addition. If I pay money to valve then why is it not a reasonable requirement that on the given date, they provide the service for which I have handed over my money? Anyone who took a day off work to celebrate and enjoy the release of HL2 has every right to pe feel pissed off and cheated that they cannot enjoy that software through no fault of their own.
Thousands of hours of gameplay (i.e. somebody's time) have been lost because of an inadequate, paid for, service that prevented access to the game. If HL2 was free then I would have a different level of expecatation. Again, there is no liability on Valve's part.
OK, so it is just a game, big deal? Well, why not extrapolate the situation to the software that runs your computer, the software that runs medical devices or manages air traffic? What about the software than controls the brakes in your car? Software that costs not $50 but $5,000,000? How would you feel about any of those just giving up at any time or at the whim of the developer who has delivered below expectations? Slightly more serious, I think.
I might also add that entertainment is even easier - how often can you take a game back beacuse it is a load of toss? You are forced into a postion that necessitates acceptance of an agreement where it is not even possible to tell if the software meets its stated purpose. Even if I find a supplier that does take unwrapped software back, how are they going to accept a sub-standard game that is going to cost $10 to unlock?
Rather than the hard done by programmer that CodeNinja describes, software developers have it way too easy. The world needs software just like it needs roads and cars, aeroplanes, water purification and so on and so on. Everyone of these engineering achievements puts in place standards for safety, emissions, hygiene etc. etc. - when it goes wrong those responsible are held to account. The excuse that 'if you don't agree, don't install' is washing thin - sorry society has changed - developers should come down of their high horse and face the fact that they should be as accountable as everybody else in the world and accept a little liability for their errors. If you are going to compete in the market place then you should expect to be held responsible.
If you take away the end user's rights, why not offer some reasonable guarentees in it's place?
Cue the complaints from developers expressing how the lack of regulation enables them to push back the boundaries of software design ... well maybe if there were a few regulations and standards to maintain, half the world wouldn't be suffering from billion dollar effects of sobig, iloveyou and friends and 20-odd years of an OS that falls flat on its face when you install a new program. Despite regulations and responsiblity we seem to be able to build a variety of automobiles that variously carry hundreds of tons load, travel 55 miles to a gallon or reach 60mph in under 4 seconds.
Lastly, from those who support online activation, I would really like to know where the boundaries lie for reasonable protection against piracy. Why not mandate online access the whole time ... hey it helps valve? Why not scan the PC and deactivate if any hardware has changed suggesting a copy is on another machine? We already have programs that will not run if various CD buring software is installed - is it acceptable for HL2 not to run if Doom3 is installed? Different purpose? Just because Alcohol is installed does not make someone guilty of software piracy so the issue is no longer about punishing those guilty, merely those likely to be guilty. What about Kazaa or BitTorrent? Guilty too by association. Want to draw a line there, too?
Hell, 51% of convincted pirates are [Conservatives] so why not ban those users too.
Finally, after that rant, (1) sorry if there's any repetition - started as a short comment and I am using the quick reply box (2) this isn't specifically aimed at Valve. HL2 is a fantastic game and while that is the not the way it sounds, I do apprececiate their hard work and efforts to correct problems. Having followed HL, OppForce, BlueShift, CS and now HL2 though the games and got many others to buy and enjoy them too, plus followed a number of interviews and believe they are honestly doing their best and are a genuine group of developers proud of their work. The systems they introduce potentially have, imho, serious negative consequences. Pushing acceptance in this field is something others will not hesitate to take advantage of and the reality is that millions of people just do not read the licence agreements and will not be aware of the implications. Take over by stealth, if you will.
Finally : internet access requirement?
I don't have the exact wording with me but does it say internet access on the same computer and also, from previous post, I am unclear why an activation code, of however many bits, cannot be transferred by email (or even fax). I disagree with the practical constraints and just because you have a great game and can't come up with another method of distribution, doesn't give you the right to inflict misery on others.
A
AlmostThere
Guest
It was easy to order this game on pre-release - a long time before online activation was ever touted (October this year?)
digsy
Newbie
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- Messages
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Almost as easy as it was to cancel it aswell. Sorry but if people are pirating games, then I don't see how a legitimate user can moan if activation is required. There are ways to activate without having an internet connection, free trial cds, etc..
In my opinion this is a very good move by valve.
In my opinion this is a very good move by valve.
A
AlmostThere
Guest
A legitmate user has every right to complain if Valve prevent them using their software by failing to provide an adequate activation service.
The system requirements are neither here nor there.
The developers have no obligation to actually enable the program's functionality, and offer no compensation if they fail to do so.
They have, regardless of intent, be it genuine misjudgement (my guess), incompetance (possibly) or maleficence (highly unlikely), done this.
They are free to change the terms of service to those that are no longer acceptable to you and as a result suspend your ability to play the game and offer no compensation.
If you do not have online* activation, you can stick to the original terms and conditions initally agreed upon at the time of sale, published on the supplied CD or DVD.
*online implementation in this case, though other methods may be developed in the future.
I fail to see how this is in any way fair.
The system requirements are neither here nor there.
The developers have no obligation to actually enable the program's functionality, and offer no compensation if they fail to do so.
They have, regardless of intent, be it genuine misjudgement (my guess), incompetance (possibly) or maleficence (highly unlikely), done this.
They are free to change the terms of service to those that are no longer acceptable to you and as a result suspend your ability to play the game and offer no compensation.
If you do not have online* activation, you can stick to the original terms and conditions initally agreed upon at the time of sale, published on the supplied CD or DVD.
*online implementation in this case, though other methods may be developed in the future.
I fail to see how this is in any way fair.
I
itakenosides
Guest
Hi just want to point out stuff
Hi guys just wanted to say a few things.
Half life 2 is a revolutionary game.
It's piracy protection is revoultionary as well, i think it will go down in history as a pioneer in anti piracy.
I do not support piracy however i like to obsevre trends around the internet.
The game has been cracked already and there is already in warez about ten versions going around now.
What is scary is not how fast it was hacked but how motivated the hackers have been. There was even a hacker who had no training in programming or hex editing and he managed to just use common sense to crack half life 2....i can't say how cause i'll get my ass seriously kicked.A normal guy could do this and it scared the bejesus out of me. Its getting ridiculous at some of the hacker forums cause they are breaking hl2 bit by bit I am afraid they are getting the full source code soon its just plain scary.
I am all for anti piracy but i think the activation has made it a challenge for the pirates to break hl2.
I have always believed in the adage that there is always some one out there smarter and more determined than you and i think this fiasco has proved the adage right.
People i have seened in forums are turning to piracy cause their firewalls are blocking them for registring. BTW guys in college dorms there is a way to go over the firewalls by your selves ( again i cannoot disscuss how) a firewall was meant to stop ppl from coming in but not "really" out.
I think the activation needs to be thought out more carefully and redesigned . It should be a quick and easy job to activate the game. It should not fustrate an honest paying buyer.
please do not say valve sucks they brought you this game and it is good but the problem is they are trying to make it too revolutionary in everyway.Will activation be the future of tomorrow, only time will tell**shrugs**
But its first time implementation does not seem to be working quite well.
Valve seems to know abt this warez thing, they say they are going ban users from steam but what happened if that person has no account and how abt the warez servers on the net??.i don't have all the answers but i can tell its not going down well.
What i am afraid is some of the hackers are going to get revenge on valve and try to disrupt steam or do dos attacks. I have a feeling with all the pent up anger in the air things will start happening. All i want to do is play a great game created by a great company.
Thanks for reading this!
Hi guys just wanted to say a few things.
Half life 2 is a revolutionary game.
It's piracy protection is revoultionary as well, i think it will go down in history as a pioneer in anti piracy.
I do not support piracy however i like to obsevre trends around the internet.
The game has been cracked already and there is already in warez about ten versions going around now.
What is scary is not how fast it was hacked but how motivated the hackers have been. There was even a hacker who had no training in programming or hex editing and he managed to just use common sense to crack half life 2....i can't say how cause i'll get my ass seriously kicked.A normal guy could do this and it scared the bejesus out of me. Its getting ridiculous at some of the hacker forums cause they are breaking hl2 bit by bit I am afraid they are getting the full source code soon its just plain scary.
I am all for anti piracy but i think the activation has made it a challenge for the pirates to break hl2.
I have always believed in the adage that there is always some one out there smarter and more determined than you and i think this fiasco has proved the adage right.
People i have seened in forums are turning to piracy cause their firewalls are blocking them for registring. BTW guys in college dorms there is a way to go over the firewalls by your selves ( again i cannoot disscuss how) a firewall was meant to stop ppl from coming in but not "really" out.
I think the activation needs to be thought out more carefully and redesigned . It should be a quick and easy job to activate the game. It should not fustrate an honest paying buyer.
please do not say valve sucks they brought you this game and it is good but the problem is they are trying to make it too revolutionary in everyway.Will activation be the future of tomorrow, only time will tell**shrugs**
But its first time implementation does not seem to be working quite well.
Valve seems to know abt this warez thing, they say they are going ban users from steam but what happened if that person has no account and how abt the warez servers on the net??.i don't have all the answers but i can tell its not going down well.
What i am afraid is some of the hackers are going to get revenge on valve and try to disrupt steam or do dos attacks. I have a feeling with all the pent up anger in the air things will start happening. All i want to do is play a great game created by a great company.
Thanks for reading this!
how long has the net been a part of the world? I first got online at least.. 8 or so years ago. I truly feel for the people who absolutley cannot get online because of where they live, really. But it's just like going into a store and asking for Eminem's new CD Encore on 8-track, or even tape. They just won't have it. Yes, I'm sorry for the kid who can't afford a CD player, but times have changed, even with the net. Also, they DID say that a net connection is required and besides, it is JUST a GAME, yes, it is a good game, but only that.. a game.
C
codeninja
Guest
AlmostThere...no I'm sorry.
If you eat a pizza and have to be admitted to hospital because of an allergy to nuts - when the Pizza box clearly states it contains nuts - the pizza manufacturer is not in ANY way liable. Even if you died from it.
Valve have ALREADY done enough by telling you that HL2 requires a net connection - if you don't have one then you should CHECK the requirements because you never know - the next game u buy might require it. If you have an allergy to nuts you read the damn ingredients to check if there are any present.
Why is this process so unfair ? I don't think it is. If you are not satisfied with the product, complain to Trading Standards (or the US equivalent).
As far as banning users or shutting down web servers goes, I guess thats down to Valve and what they choose to do.
Pirating software because the price tag is too high for the consumer is one thing, but pirating something like HL2 - when the buying price is very reasonable for what you get is quite out of order in my opinion.
btw. my previous post regarding key sizes - i agree it would probably be 256-bit, but even that is crackable today. In the US you have a restriction on keys sizes of 256 maximum I believe (for commercial use), so it would have to be that I guess.
Infact, many cryptoanalysts believe the powers that be (read NSA) are capable of cracking 768-bit keys. After all, they have the most computer power in the world today.
Oh and just one last thing - the guy who reckons being a game developer is an easy life. Man. You don't have a clue. If you can name another job where you dont get weekends, where overtime isnt paid, where holiday is postponed or withdrawn and you work 12 hour days feel free to comment. A lot of people sleep in the office when working towards harsh deadlines - I'm not joking either.
Does that kind of job appeal to you?
If you eat a pizza and have to be admitted to hospital because of an allergy to nuts - when the Pizza box clearly states it contains nuts - the pizza manufacturer is not in ANY way liable. Even if you died from it.
Valve have ALREADY done enough by telling you that HL2 requires a net connection - if you don't have one then you should CHECK the requirements because you never know - the next game u buy might require it. If you have an allergy to nuts you read the damn ingredients to check if there are any present.
Why is this process so unfair ? I don't think it is. If you are not satisfied with the product, complain to Trading Standards (or the US equivalent).
As far as banning users or shutting down web servers goes, I guess thats down to Valve and what they choose to do.
Pirating software because the price tag is too high for the consumer is one thing, but pirating something like HL2 - when the buying price is very reasonable for what you get is quite out of order in my opinion.
btw. my previous post regarding key sizes - i agree it would probably be 256-bit, but even that is crackable today. In the US you have a restriction on keys sizes of 256 maximum I believe (for commercial use), so it would have to be that I guess.
Infact, many cryptoanalysts believe the powers that be (read NSA) are capable of cracking 768-bit keys. After all, they have the most computer power in the world today.
Oh and just one last thing - the guy who reckons being a game developer is an easy life. Man. You don't have a clue. If you can name another job where you dont get weekends, where overtime isnt paid, where holiday is postponed or withdrawn and you work 12 hour days feel free to comment. A lot of people sleep in the office when working towards harsh deadlines - I'm not joking either.
Does that kind of job appeal to you?
A
AlmostThere
Guest
Codeninja
Still disagree - the analogy is being sold a pizza and regardless of cause and regardless of ill effect, the pizza maker accepts no responsibility for what happens (current situation, most EULA).
(Aside) I know it says on the box it requires online activation - Valve failed to provide this to the detriment of their loyal customers who otherwise would have a working product.
But it is not about online activation in isolation.
Continuing the pizza analogy (now with added online activation)
... back in the pizzaria where I am with my girlfriend browsing the menu. I know am allergic to nuts, I read the toppings listed and select a Marguerita, no nuts there, fine, I can eat. After a few slices of pizza, along comes the restaurateur and tells me he is going to sprinkle some nuts on my pizza. "No thank-you", says I, "I am allergic to nuts". "Right then", responds he, "you will eat the pizza or I will take it back and you can get the hell out of my restaurant."
My girlfriend, distraught at the situation, offers to take my pizza from me as she doesn't suffer from my afliction. "Hey, hey", butts in the vulgar proprietor, "if you want to give your pizza to the young lady, you have to pay me the value of what is left on your plate".
Clear enough? With online activation developers are now in a position to strip the consumer of their entire product with no compensation whatsoever, they can change the terms of the licence for any reason they like and should I disagree, Valve will charge me to be able to resell my own game!
If developers are going to use these methods then, imho, they can at least start to offer a few promises, like assurances that registration servers will be running at a given time or date.
By example, look no further that Valve who have already blocked registration access albeit over a limited time frame and offer exactly what guarantee that the servers will be running?
That is why online activation is a load of unreasonable bull.
And you really believe that if valve did that no one should be allowed any come back?
The point that software development is not an easy life (that was me, too, I see we agree on many issues ) - long hours, low pay, etc. are irrelevant ...
Building cars, making drugs, laying railway tracks, assembling childrens toys, even selling pizza are all subject to legal requirements for performace and safety. Failing to meet those requirements will land you in court. With software development you can sell any old rubbish, marketed as you like and hide behind an EULA.
If you want to know why development is a cushy number, read this: http://news.zdnet.com/2100-3513_22-5067873.html and the sceptic in me despairs to think that the worlds richest legal team is squarely on the side of the software developer.
You want another tough job - try being a doctor or a nurse - on top of all that you actually have to take responsibility when you screw something up and will be held liable for your actions.
Take it up with Trading Standards?
Well, eventually - I suspect this will likely happen through a class action suit (hopefully from a security point of view especially as I would rather Valve are not the going to be in the firing line because they actually produce some decent games).
Still disagree - the analogy is being sold a pizza and regardless of cause and regardless of ill effect, the pizza maker accepts no responsibility for what happens (current situation, most EULA).
(Aside) I know it says on the box it requires online activation - Valve failed to provide this to the detriment of their loyal customers who otherwise would have a working product.
But it is not about online activation in isolation.
Continuing the pizza analogy (now with added online activation)
... back in the pizzaria where I am with my girlfriend browsing the menu. I know am allergic to nuts, I read the toppings listed and select a Marguerita, no nuts there, fine, I can eat. After a few slices of pizza, along comes the restaurateur and tells me he is going to sprinkle some nuts on my pizza. "No thank-you", says I, "I am allergic to nuts". "Right then", responds he, "you will eat the pizza or I will take it back and you can get the hell out of my restaurant."
My girlfriend, distraught at the situation, offers to take my pizza from me as she doesn't suffer from my afliction. "Hey, hey", butts in the vulgar proprietor, "if you want to give your pizza to the young lady, you have to pay me the value of what is left on your plate".
Clear enough? With online activation developers are now in a position to strip the consumer of their entire product with no compensation whatsoever, they can change the terms of the licence for any reason they like and should I disagree, Valve will charge me to be able to resell my own game!
If developers are going to use these methods then, imho, they can at least start to offer a few promises, like assurances that registration servers will be running at a given time or date.
By example, look no further that Valve who have already blocked registration access albeit over a limited time frame and offer exactly what guarantee that the servers will be running?
That is why online activation is a load of unreasonable bull.
And you really believe that if valve did that no one should be allowed any come back?
The point that software development is not an easy life (that was me, too, I see we agree on many issues
) - long hours, low pay, etc. are irrelevant ... Building cars, making drugs, laying railway tracks, assembling childrens toys, even selling pizza are all subject to legal requirements for performace and safety. Failing to meet those requirements will land you in court. With software development you can sell any old rubbish, marketed as you like and hide behind an EULA.
If you want to know why development is a cushy number, read this: http://news.zdnet.com/2100-3513_22-5067873.html and the sceptic in me despairs to think that the worlds richest legal team is squarely on the side of the software developer.
You want another tough job - try being a doctor or a nurse - on top of all that you actually have to take responsibility when you screw something up and will be held liable for your actions.
Take it up with Trading Standards?
Well, eventually - I suspect this will likely happen through a class action suit (hopefully from a security point of view especially as I would rather Valve are not the going to be in the firing line because they actually produce some decent games).
