for you who want Adrian or 7-hour war. (Spoilers)

[Bob_Marley]

I think that both a shepard expansion and one focusing on the 7 hour war would be good, but they need to be seperate. for one if the Gman or his empolyers thought that the intervention of one of their subjects could have changed the course of events during the war why didnit they send Freeman, who is clearly the more favored one, and therefore in their eyes the most powerful, to assist the humans in their inital war with the combine?

the 7 hour war expansion would need to be from the point of view of a new charater with the objective being something like protecting a VIP on their way to a secure facility.

A new Shepard expansion would need to have a reason for the G man to have used him instead to Freeman. Thus it would either have to take place after Freeman's death or while Freeman was doing something else, eg leading the resistance in city 17. this could involve Shepard takling an objective that needed to be accomplished to increase Freeman's chance of sucsess. Eg disrupting Combine comunications and troop movements, this would work well with Shepard's backgrond of being in the USMC special forces.

just my thoughts on the matter, so if ya dont like 'em blame it on the ganja

 

[Marx! II]

Suppose Shephard is dropped off a little while prior to the war, and told to prove himself.
He wakes up in an outdoor environment, somewhere, and fights towards a major city, battling aliens along the way in various creative levels and sequences that Valve knows how to do.
He finally reaches the city, not during the war, but just after. Fight off some combine, take in all the post-war eye candy and tanks burning on the streets, hear Breen say uncle and G-man say better luck next time, here's your trans-dimensional osprey.

 

[Deathwish-uk-]

A 7 hour war expansion could be possible, highly scripted moments, big battles, having to hold strongholds and go harass the enemy. I think it would have to be more realistic however, but you could be a grunt in a platoon. It would have to have the correct weaponry however, e.g M16s, MP5s, M249s, etc, and I mean you wouldn't have to lose every battle, not much is explained about the 7 hour war in HL2, meaning a lot can be filled in by the imagination. For example, maybe the humans were winning the first 6 hours, until the combine really begun arriving en masse with armoured support. And after all it may have been a 7 hour war, but that doesent mean it was over fully, just the 'supposed' surrender, I'm sure there would have been a lot of troops who thought "F*ck Breen" and kept fighting.

 

[ríomhaire]

Why would the g-man drop him of to fight in the 7-hour war?
"all the efort in the world would have gone to waste"

 

[$kelet0r]

The gman cant tell the future he throws his agents into situations that they may have a profound effect on
anyway who's to say that adrian wouldn't win a major battle in a war that was lost elsewhere - capturing a combine advisor, wiping out the first hq (maybe it was in the US first etc), the possibilities are endless

 

[Faulk_Wulf]

7 Hour War - This could be fun. I could see you being Barney for it. Barney is sitting down, having a beer, and then BOOM-- Combine. I guess I could also see Adrian Shepard dropped in it. Here's the logic: G-Man wouldn't want to waste Gordon in a war that Earth is going to loose, but Adrian might be able to keep a small human resistance/group alive and away from the combine long enough to plant the seeds of uprival. (Barney makes more sense though...)

Adrian, In General: For the most part- my oppinion is in my sig. Good guy. My favorite expansion. But... G-Man really did not like Adrian. (Which is why I want to know why G-Man didn't just kill, unless he's above that stuff.) So I would doubt G-Man would pull him out of stasis.

My ONLY thought is that he could do it durring the slow teleport. Because G-Man couldn't get to Gordon. (right... somehow I doubt that, I think Valve just needed a way to pass the time it would take to set up the resistance...) But let's say that for some reason G-Man couldn't get to Gordon. He knows Adrian, he knows that Adrian can prove himself. Maybe a promise of releasing Adrian for motivation. Once again-- Barney just fits the role better.

That's my 2c. Slash and trash as you will.

 

[Marx! II]

I think G-man did like Adrian, and that's why he wasn't nuked with the rest of the base.
I say he'd be better for some after-Aftermath part, and I still think baiting Race-X into a combine area would be wicked awesome, especially if you could work in some Xen creatures into a giant free-for-all.

 

[T.H.C.138]

You can make anything fit with the storyline if you try hard enough.

why yes we can,can't we? it works both(all?) ways though..sooo

the debate rages on until VALVe confirm things..if they ever do

:cheers:

 

[Northwood83]

I'm just wondering what on earth that's supposed to prove... If I use a collar on my dog, am I part of the Combine?

Im sorry but you are reaching way to far here. You are using stupid alalogies against his quite good logic. I dont know why you persist in acting as if none of this stuff makes sense because as this guy has said many times it makes perfect sense given the information we have been given in HL2 and 1. To go against that is to act like the events (vorts speech in HL2 etc) never happened. Though thats probably what you want to do. Cant you just go live in your own fantasy land where Op For and anything related to Gearbox wasnt made instead of trying to bring down theories because you dislike a company?

Whats with all this anti sheapard stuff anyway? I thought OPFor rocked, and hell who doesnt like playing as a kickass military solider? Who wouldnt want to see a character make a return from a game in the series? I just dont get the logic behind it..Although its starting to become apparent that the same people that dont want to see him return also ignore the clear signs Valve is giving us in reguards to the story.

 

[Laivasse]

Im sorry but you are reaching way to far here. You are using stupid alalogies against his quite good logic. I dont know why you persist in acting as if none of this stuff makes sense because as this guy has said many times it makes perfect sense given the information we have been given in HL2 and 1. To go against that is to act like the events (vorts speech in HL2 etc) never happened. Though thats probably what you want to do. Cant you just go live in your own fantasy land where Op For and anything related to Gearbox wasnt made instead of trying to bring down theories because you dislike a company?

Whats with all this anti sheapard stuff anyway? I thought OPFor rocked, and hell who doesnt like playing as a kickass military solider? Who wouldnt want to see a character make a return from a game in the series? I just dont get the logic behind it..Although its starting to become apparent that the same people that dont want to see him return also ignore the clear signs Valve is giving us in reguards to the story.

Bizarre post. Seems like you're the one with the grudge. Collars on vorts in HL2 DO NOT PROVE ANYTHING. They don't even suggest anything. I seriously don't understand what you think they imply. Same with when the vorts say "let this end in victory or our extinction etc etc"...in what way does that back up anything? If you're going to debate, do it with more material than just saying "Come on...get real".

As has been demonstrated by about 50 pages of debate in this forum, the Combine-not-on-Xen argument is actually backed up by pretty strong evidence.

 

[eber]

Adrian Shepard Forever !!!!!!!

 

[UndeadScottsman]

Bizarre post. Seems like you're the one with the grudge. Collars on vorts in HL2 DO NOT PROVE ANYTHING. They don't even suggest anything. I seriously don't understand what you think they imply. Same with when the vorts say "let this end in victory or our extinction etc etc"...in what way does that back up anything? If you're going to debate, do it with more material than just saying "Come on...get real".

As has been demonstrated by about 50 pages of debate in this forum, the Combine-not-on-Xen argument is actually backed up by pretty strong evidence.

Then how come you didn't mention any of this strong evidence in the argument we had in this thread?

 

[Laivasse]

If you think it's my life mission to deal with your obtuseness, you're mistaken. Read the threads that already exist, or don't; pretend you haven't seen the evidence, or don't. What is the point of having me endlessly repeat the same thing? The theory is supported, your attitude towards it is your own business.

 

[pomegranate]

I have also not seen any evidence that actively refutes the Combine being in control of Xen. Can you just give a summary?

 

[Laivasse]

I have also not seen any evidence that actively refutes the Combine being in control of Xen. Can you just give a summary?

I don't mean to brush this off, but if I try to do this it will end up taking me an hour, then the whole argument will start all over again as people start to nitpick over individual points they don't like.

But allthe points can be found here (among other threads) - not necessarily on the first page, but spread throughout the entire thing. There's a lot to get through, but if you really want to give your mind a workout in terms of HL2 speculation then practically every theory on the game is covered from all possible angles in that thread.

 

[UndeadScottsman]

If you think it's my life mission to deal with your obtuseness, you're mistaken. Read the threads that already exist, or don't; pretend you haven't seen the evidence, or don't. What is the point of having me endlessly repeat the same thing? The theory is supported, your attitude towards it is your own business.

How am I being obtuse? I was asking why you didn't bring up any "strong evidence" during your argument. Everything you mentioned I presented arguments against and you never brought them up again, so I figured you gave up on argueing those points, ergo the evidence your brought up can't have been the "strong" stuff you mentioned.

 

[Laivasse]

How am I being obtuse? I was asking why you didn't bring up any "strong evidence" during your argument. Everything you mentioned I presented arguments against and you never brought them up again, so I figured you gave up on argueing those points, ergo the evidence your brought up can't have been the "strong" stuff you mentioned.

Is it beyond the bounds of possibility that a man can get tired of retyping the same things over and over again? This has been debated for a very long time on here - tbh I can't remember what arguments you or I used, but if I discarded anything it's because it didn't bring anything particularly new or useful to the debate. I'm more likely to try and address strong, fresh counter-arguments, not less. I've arrived at the conclusions I have because the evidence (or lack thereof) has pointed me this way, not by putting my hands over my ears and shouting loudly as some people seem to think.

So tell yourself that everyone has given up in the face of all your great points if you want, but consider for a moment the possibility that everyone's just bored of the issue because everything that can be said has been said. Of course it breaks my heart that you don't think my arguments are very strong, but what a coincidence. Go to the above mentioned link, and see if what you said hasn't been covered there, many times.

 

[UndeadScottsman]

Is it beyond the bounds of possibility that a man can get tired of retyping the same things over and over again? This has been debated for a very long time on here - tbh I can't remember what arguments you or I used, but if I discarded anything it's because it didn't bring anything particularly new or useful to the debate. I'm more likely to try and address strong, fresh counter-arguments, not less. I've arrived at the conclusions I have because the evidence (or lack thereof) has pointed me this way, not by putting my hands over my ears and shouting loudly as some people seem to think.

So, even when I corrected a few of your statements, that wasn't "fresh counter-argument?"

So tell yourself that everyone has given up in the face of all your great points if you want, but consider for a moment the possibility that everyone's just bored of the issue because everything that can be said has been said. Of course it breaks my heart that you don't think my arguments are very strong, but what a coincidence. Go to the above mentioned link, and see if what you said hasn't been covered there, many times.

See you there, I guess.

 

[Laivasse]

So, even when I corrected a few of your statements, that wasn't "fresh counter-argument?"

Help yourself to all the accolades you want, but you corrected nothing but my statement about loops on collars (which I am yet to check out) - and I've belaboured the point that the collar thing means nothing. Be sure you're not confusing me for anybody else.

 

[eber]

go to the speculation forum and go the the thread called "combine / xen realationships" or whatever its name is. it is all explained there with strong evidence out of the games.

 

[UndeadScottsman]

Help yourself to all the accolades you want, but you corrected nothing but my statement about loops on collars (which I am yet to check out) - and I've belaboured the point that the collar thing means nothing. Be sure you're not confusing me for anybody else.

The collar thing (Which, upon reading the Xen/Combine thread, you even go as far to use the reasoning of "Nihilanth doesn't seem to be the type to chain people up, so the HL2 collars can't be his." as strong evidence), and the fact that the Xen-relay conundrum you continually mention DOESN'T EXIST. The Xen race never once demonstrated the ability to use point-to-point teleportation on Earth, so there's no reason the Combine should use it or even KNOW of it, even if they had control of Xen.

 

[Laivasse]

The collar thing (Which, upon reading the Xen/Combine thread, you even go as far to use the reasoning of "Nihilanth doesn't seem to be the type to chain people up, so the HL2 collars can't be his." as strong evidence), and the fact that the Xen-relay conundrum you continually mention DOESN'T EXIST. The Xen race never once demonstrated the ability to use point-to-point teleportation on Earth, so there's no reason the Combine should use it or even KNOW of it, even if they had control of Xen.

Pretty selective aren't you? From that same post of mine you bowdlerised:

This signifies no significant link for or against the Combine/Xen argument, since the Combine could have simply discovered a few vorts on Earth and cooked up something to keep them docile. It certainly doesn't mean that the Combine have been their masters all along. Even if it is the same type of collar, it means very little.

I've based nothing on it, so don't pretend otherwise.

Also, regarding the Xen teleportation thing, you seem to have missed the point: regardless of whether Xen aliens can teleport locally on Earth or not (and there's nothing to say they can't), Humans can use Xen to do precisely that. Whether it's by a natural property of the Xen universe, or something to do with the crystals from Xen, we don't know. For the Combine not to be able to do it despite controlling Xen for as long as they must have would make them thick in the head somehow - they even have Breen, head of the facility that pioneered the teleportation, on their payroll now. Why can they still not accomplish point to point teleporting, even with his help? It indicates complete ignorance of the whole Xen factor. Nothing we see in HL2 leads us to think that the Combine are thick; on the contrary they're portrayed as being way more advanced than us. For us to have randomly surpassed them in one field of research in which technically they should be more experienced, is highly unlikely.

For all the microscopic fragments of the Independent-Xen theory you focus on and try to chip away at, never has a cohesive argument been put forward for Combine-on-Xen, other than "get real", "stop being awkward", or "of COURSE it's the same bad guy, it's the sequel!" If that's the way you WANT to view the story then fine, but it doesn't change the fact that it's supported by almost nothing. To date: 2 vague quotes, 1 metal arse.

 

[Faulk_Wulf]

Maybe I missed something, but Vort with the colar, doing the sweeping at the begging-- he IS a slave. (I don't remember seeing any other Vort with a colar.) Granted we're dealing with a new graphics engine, but that colar does not resemble the Vorts original colars. Besides-- Gordan freed Xen. Isn't it concievable that, after that, the Combine came to the free Xen and enslaved the Vort?

That's just me, and I haven't read hardly any of the speculation posts or anything. If I'm way off just say "You're completely wrong." and leave it at that. Just stating an observation.

--

It dawned on me after my first post on this thread: In regards to Shepard, it's kind of futile to argue that the plot says Shepard should or should not be in a HL2-Expansion. If Valve wants him in, or Barney, or Otis, or any of the Xen life from the original Half-Life/Op4 then they'll be there.

I just wish Half-Life 2 would have had a more complete story, like Half-Life 1. I get that Half-Life 3 is a garentee but HL2 really lacked a substantial depth. We should have at least got a few answer to series long questions (G-Man) or hints or at the very least- an actual explanation on the Combine. But that's me, and everyone can and will think what they want in regards to that.

 

[UndeadScottsman]

Pretty selective aren't you? From that same post of mine you bowdlerised:

Who's selective? I was demonstrating how your were in error, which you were.

I've based nothing on it, so don't pretend otherwise.

Actually you did base something on it (Using the the loops on the HL2 model as reason it can't be the same from HL1). Regardless of your next statement, you WERE in error on the first, hence why I corrected you. Apparently you didn't find that to be "fresh" when I corrected you in this thread though. Lord knows why you repeated it if you had already been shown how it was in error.

Also, regarding the Xen teleportation thing, you seem to have missed the point: regardless of whether Xen aliens can teleport locally on Earth or not (and there's nothing to say they can't), Humans can use Xen to do precisely that. Whether it's by a natural property of the Xen universe, or something to do with the crystals from Xen, we don't know. For the Combine not to be able to do it despite controlling Xen for as long as they must have would make them thick in the head somehow

Actually, yes, I would assume the Combine would be thick in the head, as you put it. They seem to get all their advancements from taking them from other races; not by pioneering them on their own. On top of that, I can easily see the quirky humans having the ability to jury-rig a form of teleportation that the Combine just plainly doesn't have the imagination to think of... Especially if they, for whatever reason, choose to use a different kind of teleportation (string based) that may not be compatible with the relay idea. That kind of thing happens all the time in Scifi; humans ingeniuity trumps the super-advanced aliens. Besides, controlling Xen doesn't even begin to mean you instantly understand everything about it, nor does it mean you'll ever understand everything about it.

- they even have Breen, head of the facility that pioneered the teleportation, on their payroll now. Why can they still not accomplish point to point teleporting, even with his help?

Same reason they couldn't devise a Xen-relay after Breen joined them had there'd been no Xen-Combine connection. Either Breen was keeping it for himself for whatever reason (Leverage, perhaps), or more than likley, as mentioned in previous episodes of the Half-Life saga; he was far more a buerocrat than a scientist. He simply never bothered to learn much about the science behind it and therefore couldn't aid the Combine in that endeaver beyond saying it involved Xen. (And, obviously, the Combine would have had to know about Xen after they invaded Earth; between Breen, the various new critters on Earth, and even the Portal storms, they would have had to have discovered Xen by that point. Obviously Breen wasn't able to help them develope the relay tech after that point.)

It indicates complete ignorance of the whole Xen factor. Nothing we see in HL2 leads us to think that the Combine are thick; on the contrary they're portrayed as being way more advanced than us. For us to have randomly surpassed them in one field of research in which technically they should be more experienced, is highly unlikely.

No, it indicates ignorance of the ability to use Xen as a relay, of which there is NO reason simply controlling Xen would automatically give them that idea. Just because you have something, doesn't mean you mean you somehow find out all the uses for it right away; Look at the laser. For awhile it was called the invention without a purpose. It took awhile before humans started finding out what they could do with it. Likewise, controlling Xen doesn't mean you'd automatically figure out how to use it as a relay, or even think of using it as a relay. It just means you control Xen.

For all the microscopic fragments of the Independent-Xen theory you focus on and try to chip away at

Actually, pretty much all of the arguments are easily explainable, as I and others have constantly done. There has yet to be a single thing that strikes a blow to the Xen-Combine theory and there are still things that support it.

, never has a cohesive argument been put forward for Combine-on-Xen, other than "get real", "stop being awkward", or "of COURSE it's the same bad guy, it's the sequel!" If that's the way you WANT to view the story then fine, but it doesn't change the fact that it's supported by almost nothing. To date: 2 vague quotes, 1 metal arse.

There exists on the dimensional Borderworld a race of enslaved beings who are linked to a creature that has had extensive cybernetic and surgical alteration. Meanwhile, there exists an empire that travels to other dimensions, enslaving what they find useful, and who's hobbies include cybernetics and surgery.

There are TWO possible scenerio's here. A. Combine and Xen are related or B. It's just bunch of coincidences. I'd like to give Valve a bit more credit than to repeat similar scenerio's like this for absolutly no reason.

Ultimatly, the Xen-Combine argument has the 2 vague quotes, 1 metal ass (Which is far more important than you give it credit) and a logical assumption. That's the reason why I think it's teh correct one, as it has more going for it than the other argument has, as far as I've seen.

Oh, and can you quit using the "of COURSE it's the same bad guy, it's the sequel!" quote. It's utterly irrelevent here.

 

[Laivasse]

Who's selective? I was demonstrating how your were in error, which you were.

No, you said I was using it as strong evidence, which I clearly wasn't, and you omitted the rest of my message to obscure that fact. Enough pedantry.

There exists on the dimensional Borderworld a race of enslaved beings who are linked to a creature that has had extensive cybernetic and surgical alteration. Meanwhile, there exists an empire that travels to other dimensions, enslaving what they find useful, and who's hobbies include cybernetics and surgery.

Extensive formatting and semantic slight of hand doesn't make the link any stronger. For a start, the creatures on Xen are not simply "a race of enslaved beings", and neither are the humans on Earth. If you figure in what Breen says in Nova Prospekt, humans are in fact due for either total annihilation or total assimilation into the Combine. We may be currently being treated as slaves, but that is not the Combine's long term plan for us - so the M.O, as we see it in HL2 is NOT enslavement, it is assimilation/extermination. The Combine don't seem to conquer only for territory, although you have to speculate that that is what they do if you're trying to fit in a Combine-on-Xen argument.

Similarly, regarding slavery on Xen - noone's sure quite how Xen worked yet. Exactly who controlled who or whether the slavery stopped with the vorts or not is still unresolved, so the idea that Xen constitutes a clear template which you can point to and say "Oh, look! That's what the Combine did in HL2!" is false. Not only false, but wilfully ignorant of the obvious difference in enemy and environment aesthetic, and the complete lack of any *solid* supporting signs, eg. a garg fighting for the Combine in HL2.

Then there's the modification to the Nihilanth - there are similarities to what the Combine do, but then modification is modification, and there are also obvious differences. For a start, the Nihilanth still has all it's faculties and self-awareness. "We are slaves" - is anything modified by the Combine in HL2 capable of saying that, do you think? The Nihilanth isn't de-limbed like the stalkers, hasn't had guns grafted on or hasn't been mechanised like the synth, hasn't got a logo (present on everything Combine) and isn't wearing a gas-mask. Also, why modify Nihilanth then leave him to his own devices, fully self-aware as he is, when everything they have modified in HL2, they take to be used in other worlds? Where have they used anything from Xen?

Severing the link between Xen and the Combine does not turn everything into fishy coincidences, because the similarities between the Combine MO and Xen are no way near as similar as you make out. Again, I'll say what's been said many times - the fact that they appear in the same game franchise is not enough to link them story-wise, without clear evidence linking them in HL2. Saying otherwise involves extra speculation, which people are free to make, but let's not act as if Combine-not-on-Xen is a weak, awkward theory, thanks.

(btw, I didn't address your other points because they are unsupported speculation, but feel free to take it as having "corrected" me)

 

[UndeadScottsman]

No, you said I was using it as strong evidence, which I clearly wasn't, and you omitted the rest of my message to obscure that fact. Enough pedantry.

It seemed to me that you were being contradictory by laying an argument down and then saying "But I don't think this is an arguable subject," which basically means if someone DID find it an arguable subject, you'd have an argument ready to debunk them. I apologize if I mistook that.

Extensive formatting and semantic slight of hand doesn't make the link any stronger. For a start, the creatures on Xen are not simply "a race of enslaved beings", and neither are the humans on Earth. If you figure in what Breen says in Nova Prospekt, humans are in fact due for either total annihilation or total assimilation into the Combine. We may be currently being treated as slaves, but that is not the Combine's long term plan for us - so the M.O, as we see it in HL2 is NOT enslavement, it is assimilation/extermination. The Combine don't seem to conquer only for territory, although you have to speculate that that is what they do if you're trying to fit in a Combine-on-Xen argument.

First of all Xen is a Borderworld, and it's territory was worth enough that the Gman made it a point to mention that it was in "our" control. From Laidlaw's description, Xen is quite a hot, if inhospitible, piece of territory. You can't even get to another spot on Earth through teleportation without stopping by the Borderworld. Now, using the Vorts to control Xen is not only efficient; but tactically advantagous since they ARE already suited to survival in the unsual conditions of Xen. (Another quote from Laidlaw)

Secondly, the only real difference (As far as can be seen) between the enslavement of the vortigaunts and the enslavement of the humans is that humankind had to be put under the knife one-by-one, not being of a hivemind. Whereas the vortigaunts all share a hivemind and therefore all that is needed is to do is to control that, which would logically be done through controlling the Nihilanth. Again, it's a hell of a lot easier, quicker and cheaper to do that than to set up a whole program of herding Vorts into modifcation facilities. Anywho, in both cases they are forced to serve the Combine's will, which is not their own, and they have no choice in the matter. I'd call that slavery.

Similarly, regarding slavery on Xen - noone's sure quite how Xen worked yet. Exactly who controlled who or whether the slavery stopped with the vorts or not is still unresolved, so the idea that Xen constitutes a clear template which you can point to and say "Oh, look! That's what the Combine did in HL2!" is false.

Your putting words into my mouth, I specificly said that it's either a big co-incidence that Xen was enslaved (Which they were; the Nihilanth said he was enslaved and the Vortigaunts are referred to as slaves,) and that there's an empire of slavers out there, or it was intentional. Earth and Xen are not the same, and therefore different tactics to enslave the different populations can and probably should be used. See the prior paragraph.

Not only false, but wilfully ignorant of the obvious difference in enemy and environment aesthetic, and the complete lack of any *solid* supporting signs, eg. a garg fighting for the Combine in HL2.

That's assuming that just because the combine had control of Xen, that it would be covered in Combine tech, or even have any influence of Combine tech beyond what they use to control the Hivemind.

In order to come to that conclusion, you have to assume that
A. The Combine needed that stuff there to take over Xen in the first place,
B. That the Combine would just leave it laying around Xen after it was taken over, when it could be put to use elsewhere,
C. That the Combine tech would be better suited to be on Xen than the Vort's own methods and
D. That there was enough stuff on Xen in the first place to leave a detectable imprint when Freeman, Shephard and Calhoun visited.
Plus, it's not like the Combine have shown any evidence of going mad-crazy and converting everything they come across, right down to every single plant and critter; Eath is reletivly untouched in that regard; only the human population really got the Combine's attention as far as we can tell.

The only piece technology the Combine would need on Xen is the cybernetics implanted in the Nihilanth. If they control him, they control the Xen race, and thusly have the best possible army for keeping Xen under their control, which means they're free to move on to other words.

As for the Garg situation, barring the fact that the Combine probably lost direct control of anything from Xen once the Nihilanth died, that situation requires the assumption that a Gargantua is a superior tool to, say, a Strider or a Motar Synth.

Then there's the modification to the Nihilanth - there are similarities to what the Combine do, but then modification is modification, and there are also obvious differences. For a start, the Nihilanth still has all it's faculties and self-awareness. "We are slaves" - is anything modified by the Combine in HL2 capable of saying that, do you think?

Probably, so long as it isn't lombotomized like the Stalkers (Which the Overwatch most likely would not have been, as lobotomized warriors seldom make good warriors). Destroying it's higher brain functions would probably be a rather stupid thing to do, in fact, if you're using the creature to control a hivemind. Additionally, can you really say that any of the Overwatch can't say "We are slaves?"

The Nihilanth isn't de-limbed like the stalkers, hasn't had guns grafted on or hasn't been mechanised like the synth, hasn't got a logo (present on everything Combine) and isn't wearing a gas-mask.

What need is there to delimb him, graft guns or a gasmask on him or even stick a logo on him (The logo's is probably for human intimidation anyway, rather than anything the Combine give a rip about. Notice how the Stalkers don't have logo's)? He's not going to be used as a fighter or a worker in a Combine factory; he's keeping the Vortigaunt population under Combine control.

Also, why modify Nihilanth then leave him to his own devices, fully self-aware as he is, when everything they have modified in HL2, they take to be used in other worlds? Where have they used anything from Xen?

As I said before, Xen is important. Using the Nihilanth to keep the Xen under Combine juridiction is useful. It frees the Combine up to invade other worlds and keeps Xen under their control.

Severing the link between Xen and the Combine does not turn everything into fishy coincidences, because the similarities between the Combine MO and Xen are no way near as similar as you make out. Again, I'll say what's been said many times - the fact that they appear in the same game franchise is not enough to link them story-wise, without clear evidence linking them in HL2. Saying otherwise involves extra speculation, which people are free to make, but let's not act as if Combine-not-on-Xen is a weak, awkward theory, thanks.

Xen is a BORDERWORLD that Mark Laidlaw specificly said that you have to go through to get to other places. The population is ENSLAVED (Again, direct quote from the Nihilanth and the names of the Alien "Slaves"), and the big powerful entity in the Hivemind that is enslaved has cybernetic implants. While at the same time there's the Combine, who travel to other dimensions, assimilating and enslaving what they find useful, utilizing cybernetics. Really, look at the facts (FACTS) on this one. Are you telling me that it's a coincidence? Let also not act like Valve would be stupid enough to set up similar scenerio's twice.

(btw, I didn't address your other points because they are unsupported speculation, but feel free to take it as having "corrected" me)

Everything we're doing is either barely supported or completely unsupported. Anywho, I felt I made some of the best points there, including a quite blatent reason why your Breen comment is a non-issue and how just because Xen is under someone's control, it doesn't mean the relay tech is going to be immediatly, if ever, available to them. That isn't unsupported speculation; that's common sense. Like I said, just because they have control of something doesn't mean they're going to automatically know everything about it.

 

[jimmyjam]

For a start, the Nihilanth still has all it's faculties and self-awareness. "We are slaves" - is anything modified by the Combine in HL2 capable of saying that, do you think? The Nihilanth isn't de-limbed like the stalkers, hasn't had guns grafted on or hasn't been mechanised like the synth, hasn't got a logo (present on everything Combine) and isn't wearing a gas-mask. Also, why modify Nihilanth then leave him to his own devices, fully self-aware as he is, when everything they have modified in HL2, they take to be used in other worlds? Where have they used anything from Xen?

xen is to earth as nihilanth is to breen
Dr. Breen isn't delimbed, doesn't have guns, hasn't been mechanised, has no logo, isn't wearing a gas mask, and has his faculties and self-awareness.

 

[Ravioli]

Great post Undeadscottman, i couldnt have said it better myself. I think that the Garguanta are one of the orginal creature from the combine homeworld. They invade planets with their own armys, then slave the population, then combine themself, and leaver it to the new combination. I think that Striders are the same, also for the Synth. See it like they are being reported to serve in the army on Earth for 5 years, then head back to the combine homeworld (not going to happen but just explaining the situation)

Sence Breen isnt enslaved, i think he has a plan. As he says, he wants to promote the HUMAN combine to the Union, to let the human combines do the invasion and lead. If he get his wish done, he will turn the switch AGAINST the orginal Combines, and boom, hes the boss of the Union, he will free earth. THAT is his purpose, i think that is what hes doing "you need me" he says at the end of half-life2, and Gordon Freeman blew his plan, basecly Gordon just ****ed up the human rase and planet earth, if my theory is correct. I mean, why would breen want to kill all the humans? And be the last human in the...in the everything?

 

[Laivasse]

xen is to earth as nihilanth is to breen
Dr. Breen isn't delimbed, doesn't have guns, hasn't been mechanised, has no logo, isn't wearing a gas mask, and has his faculties and self-awareness.

Breen isn't comparable to the Nihilanth. The Combine could control humanity without Breen, he's more of a PR exercise. He doesn't have any of those things because he hasn't been modified by the Combine at all - some people are trying to argue that the Nihilanth has been, despite the fact that there are some big differences between whatever happened to the Nihilanth and what the Combine do in HL2.

That's assuming that just because the combine had control of Xen, that it would be covered in Combine tech, or even have any influence of Combine tech beyond what they use to control the Hivemind.

In order to come to that conclusion, you have to assume that
A. The Combine needed that stuff there to take over Xen in the first place, B. That the Combine would just leave it laying around Xen after it was taken over, when it could be put to use elsewhere,
C. That the Combine tech would be better suited to be on Xen than the Vort's own methods and
D. That there was enough stuff on Xen in the first place to leave a detectable imprint when Freeman, Shephard and Calhoun visited.

Plus, it's not like the Combine have shown any evidence of going mad-crazy and converting everything they come across, right down to every single plant and critter; Eath is reletivly untouched in that regard; only the human population really got the Combine's attention as far as we can tell. The only piece technology the Combine would need on Xen is the cybernetics implanted in the Nihilanth. If they control him, they control the Xen race, and thusly have the best possible army for keeping Xen under their control, which means they're free to move on to other words.

As for the Garg situation, barring the fact that the Combine probably lost direct control of anything from Xen once the Nihilanth died, that situation requires the assumption that a Gargantua is a superior tool to, say, a Strider or a Motar Synth.

That whole section is basically saying "why assume that the Combine would operate this way...?" when we have no reason to assume that they would operate any other way due to what we're shown in HL2. That's what is meant by the extra speculation required on the Combine-on-Xen side of the argument. Also, what's the more natural assumption to make when you see that the Combine don't control any Xen forces in HL2 - they don't have any, or they have some, but aren't using them? Why would the Combine create a system on Xen so frail that they lost all control with the death of one lifeform? Even if they lost control of Earth in future they would still be able to use the transhumans they had assimilated. all things you have to speculate overtime for on that theory.


You also keep saying that the Combine want Xen because it's "important" and that it's the dimensional borderworld, but you don't say why it would be important or why the Combine would be bothered controlling this world when their own teleportation doesn't make use of it at all. Again, speculate at will. At least with Earth there are 2 very obvious potential goals, with other goals possible if you speculate - 1) incorporation of mankind into their interplanetary invasion force, 2) nabbing that point to point technology. And no, they wouldn't have needed to be in control of Xen to know that that tech existed. Again, saying that Xenians were "enslaved" and that the Combine are a "race of slavers" is to oversimplify. "Slaves" under the Combine fight on their front line, toil in their citadel, or die.

They also have their biogenetics screwed around and physically cease to be what they once were. And if Valve had wanted the Overwatch to seem as if they were acting against their will, I'm sure they would have made it appear that way. Lobotomised people make great troops if you've just cut away the instinct to rebel and destroyed their fear.

Anywho, I felt I made some of the best points there, including a quite blatent reason why your Breen comment is a non-issue and how just because Xen is under someone's control, it doesn't mean the relay tech is going to be immediatly, if ever, available to them.

Breen on their side is not a non-issue with the teleportation tech. What scenario is more or less likely:

1) Combine never controlled Xen
2) They learn of local teleportation tech (before arrival on Earth or afterwards through Breen), without fine details
3) Combine still can't accomplish it because they don't know where Xen is/what it is/don't have any Xen materials

OR

1) Combine controlled Xen however long without ever noticing the potential for Xen teleportation (remember you're the one saying they were there because they knew it was an important borderworld)
2) They learn of local teleport tech, maybe as early as HL1, without fine details
3) Even with Breen on their side, filling in a few gaps, thicky Combine still don't get it because they're just thick "ourh tleerprotershun is dur BUUUUUUHST!!"


Let's go to the main points because frankly I'm getting doubly bored with the issue. To deal with your points I'm being forced to retype points I've made many times in the past, and I'm thinking that it isn't the greatest use of my time. The main points remain unchanged - the heart of the evidence for the non-Combine-on-Xen side is in fact a wealth of *missing* evidence for the Combine-on-Xen side. To make up for that missing evidence you need to practically write a novel:
eg, no space on Xen for Combine buildings/ground too soft
Combine too stupid to figure out Xen teleportation
Combine don't have Xen forces in their armies because they don't feel like it
All Combine trademarks in HL2 are Earth specific and ONLY occur on Earth
...and so on. It doesn't end there by a long shot.

On the Combine-on-Xen side there are 2 quotes, one metal arse, and what you call a logical assumption, but what I call an oversimplification.

 

[pomegranate]

I like to think that the alien factory on Xen was made by the Combine. Or at least made by the Xenians at the Combine's behest. We really didn't see that much of Xen anyway.

If the Combine had control of Nihilanth, they wouldn't neccessarily have been in that much of a hurry to develop it for themselves, especially if they needed N to keep control of the Vorts. Like I said before, perhaps they were getting there before Gordon killed Nihilanth.

We can't know for certain what are and what aren't Combine trademarks - what about headcrabs and zombies? The Combine use headcrabs as weapons on Earth, how do we know they didn't introduce them to Xen as well (acknowledging Gonarch)?

If you're bored of the argument, please, stop arguing. Don't keep moaning.

 

[Laivasse]

I like to think that the alien factory on Xen was made by the Combine. Or at least made by the Xenians at the Combine's behest. We really didn't see that much of Xen anyway.

If the Combine had control of Nihilanth, they wouldn't neccessarily have been in that much of a hurry to develop it for themselves, especially if they needed N to keep control of the Vorts. Like I said before, perhaps they were getting there before Gordon killed Nihilanth.

We can't know for certain what are and what aren't Combine trademarks - what about headcrabs and zombies? The Combine use headcrabs as weapons on Earth, how do we know they didn't introduce them to Xen as well (acknowledging Gonarch)?

Valid ideas, but please realise the difference between reasons for believing something, and ways you can fit it in.

If you're bored of the argument, please, stop arguing.

Well, I did, but the response I got was "ah, you're not arguing! I must be right, then!" Barring people trying to claim that their theory is the One True God of HL2 theories, I'll gladly put this issue in the bin.

 

[Jandor]

If I was a mod I would have locked this thread and banned your sorry ass's. Because what the hell does the Combine on Xen/Independant Xen theory have to do with: "for you who want Adrian or 7-hour war. (Spoilers) " ?? Absolutely nothing. Theres a whole thread in Rumours and Speculation that you're neglecting to use.

Combine-on-Xen argument to date: 2 vague quotes, 1 metal arse.

Hahaha.

 

[pomegranate]

Valid ideas, but please realise the difference between reasons for believing something, and ways you can fit it in.

Absolutely. I read the first post (Pai Mei's) in the other thread you linked to, and I like that explanation almost as much as the Combine-on-Xen theory, so I am, as ever, just arguing for argument's sake... Well, I do prefer the C-o-X theory a bit more, just cos of the neatness, so I admit I'd prefer that the evidence would add up to support it... but I'm open minded...

 

[UndeadScottsman]

Breen isn't comparable to the Nihilanth. The Combine could control humanity without Breen, he's more of a PR exercise. He doesn't have any of those things because he hasn't been modified by the Combine at all - some people are trying to argue that the Nihilanth has been, despite the fact that there are some big differences between whatever happened to the Nihilanth and what the Combine do in HL2.

I actually agree with this; but simply because Breen ain't Mr. Hivemind. He just puts a happy face on the Combine and kept the population placid until Gordon starting stirring things up; and he’s ultimately replaceable. As far as what the Combine do, they use Cybernetics to take control of alien races; Thanks to Mr. Hivemind, they got the Vorts in one go whereas the human had to be taken one by one. Sounds to me to be similar aims achieved with different methods.

That whole section is basically saying "why assume that the Combine would operate this way...?" when we have no reason to assume that they would operate any other way due to what we're shown in HL2.

When you ask "Where is the Combine influence on Xen" I immediately think "There's some on the Nihilanth; would they need any more influence?" That's the basic question you need to answer. We've seen nothing that says the Combine waste resources (they even go so far as to utilize the resources on the planets they control), nor have we seen anything to say the Combine even needed to expend said resources to take Xen in the first place; Once Xen is in their control, any invasion force becomes is unnecessary, so why would they leave stuff that isn't needed lying around, especially when it's better put to use elsewhere.

That's what is meant by the extra speculation required on the Combine-on-Xen side of the argument. Also, what's the more natural assumption to make when you see that the Combine don't control any Xen forces in HL2 - they don't have any, or they have some, but aren't using them?

Again, without the Nihilanth, the Combine no longer have their direct hold over the Vorts or anything else in Xen like the used to have. Any forces pressed into their service would have had the opportunity to rebel finally (Especially if that’s the current buzz on the Hivemind). Though, we do see a few here and there (ie: the street sweeper) under highly supervised positions. Also, why don’t we see the Combine using Antlions or any Earth animals? I highly doubt they would assimilate things soley because it’s there. As we see with the Transhuman forces, the Combine are extremely picky.

Why would the Combine create a system on Xen so frail that they lost all control with the death of one lifeform?

Because they really didn't expect one man to fight past all of Xen's defensives and break into the Nihilanth's chamber and defeat him in single combat; especially not within a day or two of the Nihilanth attack some random planet. Seriously; you'd think that the big N could handle things on his own. Had there of been a giant war raging, I’m sure the Combine would have dropped what they were doing and make sure the war didn’t spill over into their homeworld or any other planet they had control of but that’s not what happened. It was a single entity that fought through Xen and destroyed the Nihilanth. (After all, why didn’t the Nihilanth have more forces (Which we SAW he had) guarding his ass? Probably for the same reason; it’s just one creature. Xen had already killed dozens of them in their own dimension and hundreds more on Earth)

Even if they lost control of Earth in future they would still be able to use the transhumans they had assimilated. all things you have to speculate overtime for on that theory.

How do we know they didn't export Xen troops elsewhere? The thing is, the Combine ARE going to put the Xen forces where they'd be most useful. Being especially suited to Xen (Which is an extremely bizarre environment) makes them a good force to keeping Xen under Combine control. They could have been others who were transported to Earth or other dimensions, but they would have had the opportunity to rebel just like all the others.

Again, without the Nihilanth the Combine lose their big way of controlling the Vort population (They still have shackles, as seen on the street sweeper and the vort in prison but those probably can be removed now that the Nihilanth isn’t exerting his influence, so long as the Vort can get away from the local Combine presence) We've only seen the Combine on Earth, and on Earth we've only seen converted humans and mass-produced Synth; not a single Combine and not a single critter from any other race.

You also keep saying that the Combine want Xen because it's "important" and that it's the dimensional borderworld, but you don't say why it would be important

Yes I did. I did several times. " Xen is a Borderworld--a place you have to go through to get to other places." As Laidlaw said. That makes it tactically advantageous. If every race stops by the Borderworld before being able to go elsewhere, that makes Xen a buffer zone for the Combine homeworld. Not only that, it allows the Combine to keep tabs on inte-rdimensional traffic.

or why the Combine would be bothered controlling this world when their own teleportation doesn't make use of it at all. Again, speculate at will.

It's speculation that their teleportation doesn't make use of Xen, actually. Mossman said "their universe" not "the combine homeworld," which honestly sounds like a generic point of origin rather than a specific local. Speculation based on common sense: It’s highly likely that none of the rebellion even have a clue where the Combine even come from, specifically.

At least with Earth there are 2 very obvious potential goals, with other goals possible if you speculate - 1) incorporation of mankind into their interplanetary invasion force, 2) nabbing that point to point technology. And no, they wouldn't have needed to be in control of Xen to know that that tech existed.

I never said they would need to be in control of Xen to get the tech (Obviously, Earth didn't need to be); I did say that being in control of Xen wouldn’t deliver that tech to them automatically. With Xen, there is at least one potential goal; control of the Borderworld; plus they got control over the natives to keep watch over the dimension along with whatever export worth they have. Xen neither looks extremely hospitable nor extremely well suited to what we’ve seen of the Combine.

Again, saying that Xenians were "enslaved" and that the Combine are a "race of slavers" is to oversimplify. "Slaves" under the Combine fight on their front line, toil in their citadel, or die.

Actually, it’s your assumption that’s what the Combine do with their slaves. As far as any of us know, slaves do what they're told; and if they're told to keep Xen under check because that’s what the Combine feels they’re most useful at, then that’s what they’ll do. (Keep in mind they were also building an army and mining some sort of resources, so it probably wasn’t the only thing they were doing for the Combine)

Also, how much detail do I need to go into before it's no longer an oversimplification even though I showed the direct correlation between what the Combine do a likely scenario derived from facts about the Xen race? What magical piece of detail makes the correlation disappear?

The Combine use Cybernetics and Surgical alterations to take control of worlds and their populations, right? You'd agree with that because that's as much as we've seen in Half-Life. They did it on Earth one-by-one until almost the entire population was either part of the Transhuman forces or lobotomized into a Stalker. All of that we pretty much KNOW.

We ALSO know that the Nihilanth considered himself to be enslaved and that the Vorts are referred to as Alien Slaves.
We ALSO know that the Nihilanth and the Vorts are part of a hive mind,.
We, finally, also know that the Nihilanth has had extensive surgery and cybernetic implants.

Is it really impossible to draw a connection there? Can you even say it’s the unlikely choice rather that a bunch of odd coincidences? Do you really think Valve is incapable of making a plot like that?

They also have their biogenetics screwed around and physically cease to be what they once were. And if Valve had wanted the Overwatch to seem as if they were acting against their will, I'm sure they would have made it appear that way. Lobotomized people make great troops if you've just cut away the instinct to rebel and destroyed their fear.

As an aside, there is ZERO evidence that the Combine messed with their genetics of either the Stalkers or the Overwatch. (Messing with genetics is better left to as of yet uncreated entities; not full grown humans)

Secondly, again, there’s nothing to say that the Overwatch doesn’t have as much free will as the Nihilanth. The Overwatch just didn’t have a plot device of speaking vague quotes to you at the start of every new level. Being able to know and speak about being a slave, and being able to act upon it aren’t necessarily linked.

Breen on their side is not a non-issue with the teleportation tech. What scenario is more or less likely:

1) Combine never controlled Xen
2) They learn of local teleportation tech (before arrival on Earth or afterwards through Breen), without fine details
3) Combine still can't accomplish it because they don't know where Xen is/what it is/don't have any Xen materials

So Breen isn’t capable of telling them where Xen is (Which Earth stumbled across in their first teleporter experiments), but he’s capable of filling in enough details so that the Combine can figure out the scientific procedure of aiming a Xen teleport to slingshot? “One of these things is not as complex as the other.” Especially when the Combine already have the capability to travel to other dimensions.

1) Combine controlled Xen however long without ever noticing the potential for Xen teleportation (remember you're the one saying they were there because they knew it was an important borderworld)
2) They learn of local teleport tech, maybe as early as HL1, without fine details
3) Even with Breen on their side, filling in a few gaps, thicky Combine still don't get it because they're just thick "ourh tleerprotershun is dur BUUUUUUHST!!"

Like I said, they had to have known about Xen after they invaded Earth, especially with Breen under their thumb. If they couldn’t develop the relay tech then, I don’t see why it’s unlikely they wouldn’t have developed the tech before that time, especially if they just plum didn’t think of it. Again, they seem big on converting tech, not inventing it on their own.

Let's go to the main points because frankly I'm getting doubly bored with the issue. To deal with your points I'm being forced to retype points I've made many times in the past, and I'm thinking that it isn't the greatest use of my time.

It’s your dime But to be fair; I'll try and avoid provoking you if you choose to stop arguing like what happened last time.

The main points remain unchanged - the heart of the evidence for the non-Combine-on-Xen side is in fact a wealth of *missing* evidence for the Combine-on-Xen side. To make up for that missing evidence you need to practically write a novel:

eg, no space on Xen for Combine buildings/ground too soft

As we’ve seen, there’s more than a few places on Xen big enough for a citadel (in theory at least. Heh, maybe the combine thought so too and sent in a few citadels only to watch them pummet to the bottom of Xen ), the question here is “Would they just leave that crap lying around when they can use it to invade other dimensions?”

Combine too stupid to figure out Xen teleportation

A bit of a over exaggeration of my point. (Chang “too stupid” to “not as clever as humans AKA the main characters”)

Combine don't have Xen forces in their armies because they don't feel like it

Never said that. Again, we don’t know if they had any Xen forces in their armies prior to the Nihilanth’s death. (But again, this requires that the Xen forces be superior to the Combine’s own forces or to be worth more on other planets then on Xen; otherwise the Combine would just go with their own stuff. We know they at least use one shackled Vortigaunt as slave labor post-Nihilanth, which probably means they are more) Additionally, once the Nihilanth went boom, the Vorts aren’t under the same kind of control as they once were. That’s theorize on the garg for a second.

With the Nihilanth still alive: You tell the Nihilanth to have the garg attack wherever.
With the Nihilanth dead: You find a garg, capture it, try to surgically alter it into a slave and then loose it where ever you want it OR you send a Strider, who are also more mobile and have better range and are mass produced.

All Combine trademarks in HL2 are Earth specific and ONLY occur on Earth

Or amoung any culture that identifies with visual symbols as much as Humans do. And again, notice how the Stalkers, who aren’t meant to ever bee seen by humans, do not have logo’s of any kind. So much for branding your cattle.

[qyote]...and so on. It doesn't end there by a long shot.

They way I look at it is that you try and dig up all this reasoning as why it CAN’T BE POSSIBLE!!!!1111 but just about every one of those questions can itself be questioned. In the end, we still have two quotes, one creature designation, an EXTREMLY logical assumption (Inter-dimensional cybernetic enslavement!) and a satellite hoob-a-joob up an aliens butt. Not a lot of evidence, no, but there’s never been anything in game that specifically contradicts it, just a lot of analysis which itself can be analyzed. Why you continue to rag on the validity of it is beyond me.

On the Combine-on-Xen side there are 2 quotes, one metal arse, and what you call a logical assumption, but what I call an oversimplification.

Again, how are they an oversimplification? One correlation and that’s just the way the universe works; two correlations and it’s a coincidence, but three correlations and things start to get fishy. On top of that, we have the two quotes which mesh with the correlations.

Well, I did, but the response I got was "ah, you're not arguing! I must be right, then!" Barring people trying to claim that their theory is the One True God of HL2 theories, I'll gladly put this issue in the bin.

Well, it more along the lines of "Each consequtive post kept dropping more and more of the argument while bring up new stuff so it appears that he's scrambling." And as I've said many times before; I may be wrong. It's possible. Valve changes the story to suit what they think will make good games (Take Breen for instance, originally he was going to be titled "The Consul" and have nothing to do with Black Mesa; Newell later thought it would be cool to make him the Administrator of Black Mesa and so they changed it, probably to the dismay of whoever was the administrator beforehand. ) so for all we know I could be wrong now but right later, or vice versa. Currently, I think things point to a Xen-Combine connection, with no direct stab through the heart on the theory as of yet. Doesn't mean there won't be a key piece of information later that changes it, of course. If you felt I was portraying the Xen-Combine theory as the only valid one, I apologize; in the face of the rather "venomous" opposition to it I guess I felt that I needed to come on equally strong. Again I apoligize.

 

[r2000]

The only way a Combine Xen connection can be, is that the Nihilanth and the Vorts, had been used by the combine, and left to be. The combine no longer had a use in Xen, because they had acheived peace, couldn't find new land or something on that order. But we found them. How do we know Xen didn't actually win? I mean looking at the end cinematic of HL1, i see burning tanks and dead marines, not dead gargs or dead vorts.

 

[jimmyjam]

Breen isn't comparable to the Nihilanth. The Combine could control humanity without Breen, he's more of a PR exercise. He doesn't have any of those things because he hasn't been modified by the Combine at all - some people are trying to argue that the Nihilanth has been, despite the fact that there are some big differences between whatever happened to the Nihilanth and what the Combine do in HL2.

humans are not a hivemind, of course there will be differences when enslaving us

 

[Jandor]

After enslaving the race that knows how to do it, making a giant version of the race that knows how to do it, and using the technology to invade Earth via Xen forces. They suddenly got mass amnesia?

You can't even use the argument that it was a natural ability, the Xenians had built teleporters. Gordon uses one or two when on Xen. He even activates one in a rudimentary puzzle.

A race that has evolved massive brains and mental powers at the expense of there bodies are so thick that they can't emulate it even when its sat there staring you in the face.

Also, how does Nihilanth stay in contact with the Advisors? There are no screens anywhere on Xen.

Infact, there is no Combine technology on Xen, whatsoever.

 

[UndeadScottsman]

You can't even use the argument that it was a natural ability, the Xenians had built teleporters. Gordon uses one or two when on Xen. He even activates one in a rudimentary puzzle.

A race that has evolved massive brains and mental powers at the expense of there bodies are so thick that they can't emulate it even when its sat there staring you in the face.

Also, how does Nihilanth stay in contact with the Advisors? There are no screens anywhere on Xen.

Infact, there is no Combine technology on Xen, whatsoever.

Aside from the cybernetics the Nihilanth has (Along with possibly the collars/shackles of the Vortigaunts). The cybenetics would have to be the way the Combine keep the nihlanth under control which would probably also account for how the Nihilanth keeps in touch with the Combine if the Nihilanth has no other means of contacting them. (Telepathy; using teleport technology, whatever)

And again; the only race that's shown the ability to use Xen as a relay are the humans. The natives Xen race were only ever shown to teleport between Xen and Earth and from one point in Xen to another.

 

[Asknoone]

Wrong thread for the xen/combine argument

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?t=72731

 

[Jandor]

And again; the only race that's shown the ability to use Xen as a relay are the humans. The natives Xen race were only ever shown to teleport between Xen and Earth and from one point in Xen to another.

How does that make my point invalid? I say if the Combine where on Xen they would copy the local teleportation technology and you say, "The natives Xen race were only ever shown to teleport between Xen and Earth and from one point in Xen to another."
Which means they know how to locally teleport.
and it dosn't even use a massive dark energy reactor like Combine teleports, it just uses a few crystals. Surely, even from planet to planet its more efficient.
Especially for use, say, when Breen is doing his escape at the end.