IDF warns UN troops will be attacked if they repair bridges

[CptStern]

roads arent the only way, they can drop them from the airplanes, with shoots attached.

ummm the airport isnt exactly in working order ..why do you think the evacuees all had to be evacuated by boat? (besides the Israeli controlled skies)

 

[MjM]

World to Israel ... say bye bye to any sympathy for your cause, should you bomb the UN. Oh wait they have! And we still tolerate this belligerent like they deserve sympathy ... and we should still feel guilty enough to let them act with impunity. Western guilt. Arab suffering. Deja-vu? What a coup it would be for Hezbollah if Israel was stupid enough to do so. Israel would be playing right into the hands of Hezbollah. Stupid Tragic. I guess it's good to be best friends with the bully.

 

[Fat Tony!]

Geez I didn't realise that some people actually think that bombing civilians was okay, this thread has improved my knowledge. Thankyou, please correct your opinions as soon as possible.

 

[victor]

i dispise terrorist organisations AND resistance organisations (whatever you want to call them) tactics.
Even the World War 2 resistance should have sticked to providing the allies with information. As spies.
Every terror attack, was like a drop of water on a frying pan: it didnt alter the situation, it just made the Wehrmacht commit reprisals killing civilians.
A good portion of civilian casualties might have been avoided...
Its because they piss over every international law, causing so much paranoid behavior that these situations spawn a spiral of downwards violance in which eventually the other side starts committing attrocities.
Then who's the victim? => the regular civilian population.

I despise any groups mingling with civilians, drawing fire to civilians, utilizing 4th generation warfare so to speak, which doesnt serve any purpose but spiral the situation to... terror.

How do you think America got it's independance? Oh, right, what applies to the rest of the world doesn't apply to western countries, because we're not crazy terrorists waving flags, shouting "ALLAH AKBAR" and wearing turbans? Good work dipshit.

You make all these sweeping accusations about Iran funding etc. but you provide no proof. Source your information or stfu.

Stop trying to justify something that's unjustifiable. Both sides are ****ed in the head, there's no "better of two evils" here (this applies to everyone).

 

[Ome_Vince]

lol, Victor try reading a post before replying to it. Makes you look less like a dingdong.
I don’t care if its western or middle-east -> all 4th generation warfare is morally wrong, and is never in the best interest of the country.
And if you actually read up, you'll see America was not just created by "resistance"/"Terrorists". Thats a falcy piece of fiction.
Perhaps for a large part the US has to thank the Frenchies.

O, and lol, Iran funding? => read this
Hows that for a source.

 

[No Limit]

i dispise terrorist organisations AND resistance organisations (whatever you want to call them) tactics.
Even the World War 2 resistance should have sticked to providing the allies with information. As spies.
Every terror attack, was like a drop of water on a frying pan: it didnt alter the situation, it just made the Wehrmacht commit reprisals killing civilians.
A good portion of civilian casualties might have been avoided...

So that justifies Germany's atrocities as they were only responding to people wanting to overthrow a evil goverment run by a ****ing phsycho?

Its because they piss over every international law, causing so much paranoid behavior that these situations spawn a spiral of downwards violance in which eventually the other side starts committing attrocities.
Then who's the victim? => the regular civilian population.

Yeah, the civillians are the victims of all this. That still doesn't justify Israel pissing all over international laws and then being supported by the western world (mainly the US). Hezbollah has one goal as I stated, to get Israel out of lebanon. This is why they were formed and this is why they keep fighting. Israel on the other hand keeps provoking its neighbors on a regular basis from Syria, to lebanon, to Egypt, to Gaza. Also, if you think Israel never used guerrilla (aka terrorist) tacticts to actually gain its independence you are dearly mistaken.

I despise any groups mingling with civilians, drawing fire to civilians, utilizing 4th generation warfare so to speak, which doesnt serve any purpose but spiral the situation to... terror.

So you despise Israel bombing of innocent civillians or in your eyes its justified because we are bombing those dirty arabs? I hate to bring race in to this but I don't see how someone could condamn hezbollah killing innocent civillians saying its terrorism and turn right around and say killing lebanese civillians is self defense.

For whatever "reason" Hezbollah keeps attacking Israel, it not even close justifies the hell they create in the process and the constant wars they provoke.
No 35km of disputed land is worth that its just an excuse.

Its not an excuse, its sacred arab land. As much as I despise the extremists in any religion I do not support someone saying because you do not share their beliefs that land doesn't matter. It matters to the millions (if not billions) of arabs that occupy the middle east.

Its a long downwards spiral with perhaps this crisis being the absolute depth.
I agree though, that maybe Israel is the only country now, that can break that spiral by removing the "excuse".

I know that if Israel refuses to leave that area so they could have an excuse to engage in constant war you will still support them. So your point is mute.

Hmm, it says Hezbollah denies Israel's right to exist as one of its founding "goals", aswell as part of its ideologie.
SOURCE
It also mentions it works with Hamas and share the goal of Israel's pullout of the occupied territories, and eventually Israel.

You are completely ignoring what I am telling you. Every arab state as well as many countries ourside the arab world deny Israel's right to exist. You are again ignoring the history there. However, those countries are not planning to invade Israel, they simply want Israel to pull out of terratories that belong to the arab world.

Strange, i seem to be constantly pulling towards to past to explain the current situation.
Look at how this whole spiral of shit started, way back when our PLO friends first started their campaign from Southern Lebanon.
Ofcourse thats not the complete beginning of the spiral of violance, but the main beginning of it establishing itself in Lebanon.
Its somebody elses war, which was and still is waged inside Lebanon.

The PLO, as far back as the 80s changed its position to recognize israel and to allow Israel to exist. That still meant having Israel pulling out of occupied arab territory.

Yes, that reminds me of Hitler who quotes he would always respect Dutch neutrality in the war.
Few weeks later he invades.
The only comparisson i'm trying to make here, is that first Nasrallah says he vows to anihilate Israel, shares this goal with Hamas and says all that other nasty stuff i quoted, and then he goes along saying "in defence".

You keep repeating this bullshit while you ignore every point I make. Again, all those things he said he said. However, it is not his organization's goal to wipe out Israel. You picking apart his speech, pulling out statements out of context and then using them to make your point. Read the whole speech you got those quotes from (I'm guessing you don't even know where to find that speech, you just got your quotes from pro-israel sources).

I was hoping you'd say that: the reason they killed more soldiers is because Israeli soldiers are now inside Lebanon fighting on Lebanese soil against these militants.
Who by being well equiped and trained by Iran, are very capable of combat.

I am skipping a lot of what you said as its just repeating the same thing over and over. This quote war will never end if we go on like this.
The reference Wikipedia used about Iran support I do not trust. However, I really don't want to get into that right now, this is about Israel breaking international law on a regular basis and people like you from the western world supporting it.

They denounce attacks on civilians? Yet none of their thousands of Katyusha rockets (even before this crisis, the years of bombardment), are aimed at military targets: they're all aimed at civilian towns/cities with the sole purpose to kill civilians.

Because america (nor any other country for that matter) is not arming hezbollah with weapons that could reach any target accurately. Unlike Israel who has the most advanced weapons known to man (supplies to them by yours truely) capable of hitting a square foot of a target precisely from accross the world and yet they still CHOOSE to target civillians.

Imo its all just 1 big excuse, since unlike the Palestinians, the Lebanon wasnt in "despair" or "under occupation" or going through checkpoints etc.

Again, you are repeating yourself while you ignore what I told you. Israel continues to occupy lebanon. You claiming this land is just an excuse doesn't change that fact.

 

[DeusExMachina]

Government needs to send me over there, I'll deal with everything.

"NO MISTER PRIME MINISTER, YOU WILL SHUT THE **** UP. YOU TOO. Now, I have a stockload of nuclear warheads ready to fall on both your countries. If you two do not cut this shit out right now, I will drop those mothers right on top of your heads."

 

[Ome_Vince]

So that justifies Germany's atrocities as they were only responding to people wanting to overthrow a evil goverment run by a ****ing phsycho?

Your missing the point. It doesnt justify anything on Germany's part, but more on the irresponsibility of those tactics; that whoever claims they're fighting in the best interest of a nation is full of crap, since they're not.
4th Generation warfare is never in the best interest of any civilian population, regardless if the reasons are correct or not.
The fact that the media portrays armed Resistance utilizing those methods as "nobel" is a sick left-over from WW2, and only works because we're indoctrinated about how "evil" the Germans were.

Yeah, the civillians are the victims of all this. That still doesn't justify Israel pissing all over international laws and then being supported by the western world (mainly the US). Hezbollah has one goal as I stated, to get Israel out of lebanon. This is why they were formed and this is why they keep fighting. Israel on the other hand keeps provoking its neighbors on a regular basis from Syria, to lebanon, to Egypt, to Gaza. Also, if you think Israel never used guerrilla (aka terrorist) tacticts to actually gain its independence you are dearly mistaken.

What the hell are you talking about? I never said that, nor the fact that Israel's killing is Justified.
And how is Israel provoking its neighbours? Perhaps by giving back Egyptian territory and Gaza strip to the Palestinians, hmmm.
Your right: Israel keeps provoking, by the fact that they're there and exist.

So you despise Israel bombing of innocent civillians or in your eyes its justified because we are bombing those dirty arabs? I hate to bring race in to this but I don't see how someone could condamn hezbollah killing innocent civillians saying its terrorism and turn right around and say killing lebanese civillians is self defense.

Stop putting words into my mouth. I never justified the killing of lebanese, nor Israel's method.
If thats what you think then go reread my posts.

Its not an excuse, its sacred arab land. As much as I despise the extremists in any religion I do not support someone saying because you do not share their beliefs that land doesn't matter. It matters to the millions (if not billions) of arabs that occupy the middle east.

Ah, really, i noticed that, judging how the elections of Lebanon went the last few times. How "many" lebanese voted for Hezbollah, because they're all so offended by that piece of land.
Notice any decline in Hezbollah interest over the years in Lebanon?
The only reason they exist is due to the conflicts they provoke, and the insane sponsoring they get.

I know that if Israel refuses to leave that area so they could have an excuse to engage in constant war you will still support them. So your point is mute.

Really? So you know what i would or would not support aye.
My point is: its an excuse, they'll shove the border more south, and everything i've posted in this topic can explain you why i'm sure of this (including Hezbollah's actions, leaders, speeches and who they're supported by).

You are completely ignoring what I am telling you. Every arab state as well as many countries ourside the arab world deny Israel's right to exist. You are again ignoring the history there. However, those countries are not planning to invade Israel, they simply want Israel to pull out of terratories that belong to the arab world.

-First of all, thats not true, and most of the surrounding states are afraid of signing peace-treaties with Israel, since what happened the last few times: Egyptian leader killed, Lebanese leader killed and country intimidated by Syria to pull out of peace-talks etc etc.

-Second, whether or not Israel has a right to exist is a pointless debate. Its like debating whether or not Belgium has a right to exist, when they split off from Holland.
I'm not comparing the events, just that its "after the fact", and nobody is going to deport the jews, massacre them, or bring them under Islamic rule.

Also, ever take a chance to glance over the surrounding countries, when they were created?
-Jordan 25 May 1946
-Syria January 1, 1944 (recognised in April 17, 1946 )
-Lebanon November 22, 1943
etc

Funny they're all created around the same time period, hmm.
Its all a pile of bullshit, and perhaps a left-over gift from the colonial age.

The PLO, as far back as the 80s changed its position to recognize israel and to allow Israel to exist. That still meant having Israel pulling out of occupied arab territory.

I though you said arabs didnt recognise Israel, does that exclude former terrorist/resistance movements/organisations?
Funny, if i read correctly (i'm gonna find the source) Hamas publically anounced it was planning to recognise Israel, until "unknown terrorists" kidnapped the soldiers and launched a rocket attack resulting in an Israeli invasion. Strange how these things always happen when peace-talks are under way..

Also, I support Israel pulling out of the Palestinian territories, though thats not what this discussion is about.

You keep repeating this bullshit while you ignore every point I make. Again, all those things he said he said. However, it is not his organization's goal to wipe out Israel. You picking apart his speech, pulling out statements out of context and then using them to make your point. Read the whole speech you got those quotes from (I'm guessing you don't even know where to find that speech, you just got your quotes from pro-israel sources).

haha, no actually just from Wiki, but i guess that too is a pro-israeli source.
How can that be pulled out of context? come on..
And read their ideologie, i dont have to say a word.

I am skipping a lot of what you said as its just repeating the same thing over and over. This quote war will never end if we go on like this.
The reference Wikipedia used about Iran support I do not trust. However, I really don't want to get into that right now, this is about Israel breaking international law on a regular basis and people like you from the western world supporting it.

You dont trust Wiki?
Ah, I'm supporing Israel breaking international law? How about fighting organisations funded by countries that take a dump over every international law ever written?
How the hell can there be peace with such people around.

Because america (nor any other country for that matter) is not arming hezbollah with weapons that could reach any target accurately. Unlike Israel who has the most advanced weapons known to man (supplies to them by yours truely) capable of hitting a square foot of a target precisely from accross the world and yet they still CHOOSE to target civillians.

This is pointless, you keep believing that. How Israel targets civilians just because it wants to be... hated or stir up trouble. Or ofcourse for whatever baseless conspiracy theory sucked out of some extremists thumb.

Again, you are repeating yourself while you ignore what I told you. Israel continues to occupy lebanon. You claiming this land is just an excuse doesn't change that fact.

Yes, your right, just as Poland is still occupying Germany, and Belgium is occupying Dutch land, and Taiwan is occupying Chinese land, and the USA is occupying Mexican land etc etc .
It indeed doesnt change that fact, but taking this in broader perspective, its not worth the million wars and the terror-spiral.

Mass demonstrations along with some pressure got the Syrian occupier out. (which Hezbollah interestingly did not support, and counter demonstrated ->thats how much of an resistance they are, lol), how about mass demonstrations over those 35km? The whole world to see, no excuses for Israel or the "supporters" like me whom you so nicely generalise under 1 big hat.
You know why? Perhaps because the majority just wants peace, wants to live, have fun etc etc, and doesnt give a shit to wage wars over that land.
Hezbollah chooses this 4th generation warfare method, because its a full proof system.

All in all, im not saying Israeli occupation is good, nor their methods of fighting these terrorists/resistance.
But you wont get a gram of respect out of me for any party/resistance/terrorist organisation utilizing these methods, killing so many directly and indirectly over bullshit argumentation 60 years old.
And on top of that, i really hope one day people will open their eyes and see the bullshit, the excuses and the media-war which this method is so good at.
Hezbollah, is no good for any country, is the aggressor and bares the majority of the responsibility of this conflict, and several others.
Whether their causes/excuses are technically just or not doesnt change that fact.

Funny enough, we're not too far off in our opinions. To help speed this discussion, and end the quote-wars, perhaps we should stick to the actual points we disagree on, instead of the spree of non-related throwing.
Though now i'll be out of town for a few days, so it'll take a bit of time before i read any responses.

 

[Cole]

How the hell can there be peace with such people around.

There wont ever be real peace...there will always be some people who don't like something and be causing a disturbance. There will always be people who disagree and are willing to fight the other person. There will always be nations that disagree and will be willing to fight the other.

Always.

 

[Bait]

I can picture in my mind a world without war, a world without hate. And I can picture us attacking that world, because they'd never expect it. -Jack Handey

 

[No Limit]

I hate quote wars, do you notice how every post we make gets longer and longer?

Your missing the point. It doesnt justify anything on Germany's part, but more on the irresponsibility of those tactics; that whoever claims they're fighting in the best interest of a nation is full of crap, since they're not.

So what you are saying is if your goverment (or a foreign government) is doing evil you should just sit by and wait for the calvery to rescue you? When a country kills your entire family in the name of fighting terrorism when you nor your family never had contact with any terrorists you should just sit by and take it?

What the hell are you talking about? I never said that, nor the fact that Israel's killing is Justified.

Yes, you did. You tried to rationalize the killing of UN soldiers trying to get aid to innocent civillians. reread your posts.

And how is Israel provoking its neighbours? Perhaps by giving back Egyptian territory and Gaza strip to the Palestinians, hmmm.
Your right: Israel keeps provoking, by the fact that they're there and exist.

Again, you are not looking at the past half century of war that has been going on there. This has nothing to do with Israel's current state. The PLO, hezbollah, and most arab countries have agreed that Israel should have its state at this point. But they disagree with how they got it and how they continue to occupy arab territory that doesn't belong to them.

Stop putting words into my mouth. I never justified the killing of lebanese, nor Israel's method.
If thats what you think then go reread my posts.

Sure, I'll reread your posts. This is what you posted in response to Israel killing UN soldiers that are willing to help innocent victims in all of this. Sure sounds like you are rationalizing all of this:

Perhaps part of these targets wouldnt be targets if weapons werent transported in civilian cars and for instance hospitals didnt function as a weapons storage
Aparantly: Guerilla warfare ftw!

Yet yeah, lets stick to the "terrorist state trying to deliberatly massacre civilians" => that makes more sense.

I love how you even added a smiley face in there, yeah, this is really amusing.

Ah, really, i noticed that, judging how the elections of Lebanon went the last few times. How "many" lebanese voted for Hezbollah, because they're all so offended by that piece of land.

Explain? All you really did there was help show my point which is that the arab world doesn't agree with what Israel is doing.

Really? So you know what i would or would not support aye.
My point is: its an excuse, they'll shove the border more south, and everything i've posted in this topic can explain you why i'm sure of this (including Hezbollah's actions, leaders, speeches and who they're supported by).

So you are saying that if Israel doesn't leave you will never support them? Please, also explain this.

First of all, thats not true, and most of the surrounding states are afraid of signing peace-treaties with Israel, since what happened the last few times: Egyptian leader killed, Lebanese leader killed and country intimidated by Syria to pull out of peace-talks etc etc.

Are you trying to say all these countries deny Israel's right to exist because they are scared? Please.

Second, whether or not Israel has a right to exist is a pointless debate.

I agree, nobody is having that debate. Not Iran, not Israel, not me. You brought it up.

Funny they're all created around the same time period, hmm.

The problem is the land that was there before the british got involved was all arab, a jewish state was not there until zionist guerillas (pretty much terrorists) came into the picture.

Also, I support Israel pulling out of the Palestinian territories, though thats not what this discussion is about.

No its not, this discussion is about how israel is a terrorist nation because they target civillians and foreign soldiers that try to help them and you actually defending those actions.

haha, no actually just from Wiki, but i guess that too is a pro-israeli source.
How can that be pulled out of context? come on..
And read their ideologie, i dont have to say a word.

Wiki is written by regular people that can like you pull things out of context. I am still wating for you to read that whole speech. Maybe you should start by checking the references for what you are actually quoting.

This is pointless, you keep believing that. How Israel targets civilians just because it wants to be... hated or stir up trouble. Or ofcourse for whatever baseless conspiracy theory sucked out of some extremists thumb.

Again, you ignore what I tell you and then claim Im some nut that believes in conspiracy theories. I ask you again, you have never answered this for some reason, why will Israel not release evidance that they have that proves they weren't just targeting civillians. Please don't ignore this like you have in all other threads on this subject.

Funny enough, we're not too far off in our opinions. To help speed this discussion, and end the quote-wars, perhaps we should stick to the actual points we disagree on, instead of the spree of non-related throwing.
Though now i'll be out of town for a few days, so it'll take a bit of time before i read any responses.

Hey, no problem. But I fail to see where we agree on, maybe you can point it out for me .

 

[delusional]

i dont even try to read them... way to long for me

 

[Tr0n]

Same. I hate quote wars.

They just go in circles...