Noones making ragdoll worthwhile...

[ShinRa]

I'm still waiting for an SP mod where ragdoll is a reason alone for replay value. Games like goldeneye, perfectdark, and the old rainbow six games would be the ideal setting for ragdoll. Nowadays ragdoll means nothing because the only place npc's are falling is on the nice flat terrain. Wheres all the buildings to shoot npc's through glass windows and over office desks and off of balconies? Seriously...I'm rather let down over it. :x

edit - oh..and im SICK of shooting the COMBINE.

 

[BetaMaster]

I wish this were hl2 world, so I could post :iv81:
But on a serious note, I don't understand what you mean by a mod where ragdoll is the reason for replay value. There were plenty of times in HL2 when you shot a soldier off a balcony, or through a window.

As for being sick of the Combine..mods are coming. Just be patient.

 

[ShinRa]

I'm talking about a game where the enemies arent wearing a goddamn air helmet, army helmet, space mask, etc. where the enemies are normal human beings, and capping them in the head is actually satisfying. shooting people out of windows and dragging bodies around (deus ex 2 style) and giving npcs something to interact with at the time of death. noones doing anything like that. everything seems to be about wide open spaces or the future or the past. wheres the good old 5 years into the future shooters like pd and rainbow six?

 

[Vegeta897]

It would be really awesome if the ragdolls had a techonology like Endorphin, where they had some AI in them. Like when they get shot, they'll stumble back or try to stay balanced for a while before they are officially dead and natural ragdoll takes over.

If you don't know what Endorphin is, try looking up some videos. It basically can give a behavior to what is essentially a ragdoll. For example, behaviors can include keeping balance, protecting the head, etc. Ragdolls in games with this would be awesome, if you shot someone he would stumble back, hopefully tripping over something or falling off a ledge

Possibilities are really endless.

 

[ShinRa]

Now thats what I'm talking about. The whole tripping thing I dont see happening, but I like where your thinking is. Noones putting any emphasis on the satisfaction of defeating your enemy. Its getting so boring shooting either nazis, allies, combine, SEAL6, or the occasional resistance soldier.

 

[Vegeta897]

Tripping as in, the guy get's shot, he's holding his neck or something, while stepping backwards, and there's like a chair there, so he trips over it. All in all it would just make it more interesting, I was just giving an example

Well, on the matter of who we are killing, I must admit I would love to see some gory kills, but I don't think Valve would want to go the SOF route... It's just too violent for the public, you know? Gives it a bad rep. A deep red blood sprite is fine for me, like HL2 has.

 

[Tollbooth Willie]

I'd like to be able to shoot a guy and watch him roll down 60 flights of stairs, instead of watching the ragdoll just fall over on it and start sloooooooowly sliding or rolling over down the stairs and eventually stopping for no reason.. That would make my day.......... Dammit I'm gonna go and play some Smod.

 

[ShinRa]

You all get the idea. Interaction with the npcs. Making it fun to kill them...as sick as that may sound. There doesn't have to be gibs (they never look real anyway, even the zombies in hl2)...but little things like a guy rolling down a pack of stairs, grabbing the proper body part when shot(like they used to in the n64 days of ge and pd), being able to shoot a guy standing by a window and watching him go flying out (yes thats possible but theres no scenarios that allow for it), regular human baddies to actually feel satisfied shooting the ****er lol.

 

[Roland Deschain]

*cough* Max Payne 2 *cough*. This is the the game that makes the best use of rag dolls. It has its problems, mostly concerning that the ragdolls appear too light. Nothing more satisfying that going into slow motion with your shotgun and killing three guys so quickly that they are all in the air at the same time (that feat requires skill, don't think you'll pull it off every fight). Of course, all three land on different targets (one trough a window, another down the stairs, the last one on a heavily cluttered table) just to show off the Havok physics engine. Did I mention this was happening all in slow motion?

PS: I still don't understand why they simply didn't lisence the Max Payne 2 engine for Path of Neo, that would have saved the game.

 

[Tollbooth Willie]

I liked how Psi - Ops made pretty good use of ragdolls, even though youd see the same death pose, even though it's ragdoll, a couple of times. Shoot a dude in the head and he grabs his neck, steps back, and falls over dead. TK lift a dude and toss him into a wall (splattering blood everywhere) and then tossing him into a cargo container, watching him flop was fun. Then, lifting a barrel, and tossing it at a dude's head would cause him to bend his knees and fall straight back. The shotgun would usually send a dude spinning sideways through the air,usually landing on something and realistically falling over it.

Then comes cranes/ wrecking balls/ pulleys. You could take a wrecking ball, toss it into a dude, and they would just do the best impression of a dude flying through the air. Or just dropping something huge and watching them become nothing more than a giant bloodstain on the ground, limbs flying from the smashed corpse. We need more interaction.

 

[sinkoman]

I'm talking about a game where the enemies arent wearing a goddamn air helmet, army helmet, space mask, etc. where the enemies are normal human beings, and capping them in the head is actually satisfying. shooting people out of windows and dragging bodies around (deus ex 2 style) and giving npcs something to interact with at the time of death. noones doing anything like that. everything seems to be about wide open spaces or the future or the past. wheres the good old 5 years into the future shooters like pd and rainbow six?

Play FEAR.

You still shoot guys with helmets, but no battle ever plays out exactly the same way.

Like, that guy might run over there instead, or maybe that ragdoll will go flying and hit that other guy in the face.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

It would be really awesome if the ragdolls had a techonology like Endorphin, where they had some AI in them. Like when they get shot, they'll stumble back or try to stay balanced for a while before they are officially dead and natural ragdoll takes over.

If you don't know what Endorphin is, try looking up some videos. It basically can give a behavior to what is essentially a ragdoll. For example, behaviors can include keeping balance, protecting the head, etc. Ragdolls in games with this would be awesome, if you shot someone he would stumble back, hopefully tripping over something or falling off a ledge

Possibilities are really endless.

Except Endorphin is a preprocessor used for creating animations. It doesn't work in realtime.

 

[Asuka]

Now thats what I'm talking about. The whole tripping thing I dont see happening, but I like where your thinking is. Noones putting any emphasis on the satisfaction of defeating your enemy. Its getting so boring shooting either nazis, allies, combine, SEAL6, or the occasional resistance soldier.

In FEAR enemies can trip. FEAR has some insane ragdolls.

 

[Drackard]

Yeah i love the rag-dolls in FEAR and Max Payne 2 also.

 

[Loke]

Yeah, the ragdoll in F.E.A.R. is pretty impressive. One of the coolest things to do is to go into slow-mo, take out the pump-action shotgun and run towards an enemy. Shoot the leg and he'll either fly backwards or loose his leg while blood spray all over the place. Or even better, do a round-house kick in his face like Chuck Norris and see him fly 15 feet.

F.E.A.R. and Max Payne 2 is games that makes ragdolls satisfying to watch while they fly into the air, get blown into pieces etc. all in slow-mo.

 

[Beerdude26]

Except Endorphin is a preprocessor used for creating animations. It doesn't work in realtime.

Lol that's what I was thinking

Medal Of Honor : Pacific Assault did great in mixing animations and natural ragdolls imho. Too bad the game crashed every 2 hours :hmph:

*cough* Max Payne 2 *cough*. This is the the game that makes the best use of rag dolls. It has its problems, mostly concerning that the ragdolls appear too light. Nothing more satisfying that going into slow motion with your shotgun and killing three guys so quickly that they are all in the air at the same time (that feat requires skill, don't think you'll pull it off every fight). Of course, all three land on different targets (one trough a window, another down the stairs, the last one on a heavily cluttered table) just to show off the Havok physics engine. Did I mention this was happening all in slow motion?

PS: I still don't understand why they simply didn't lisence the Max Payne 2 engine for Path of Neo, that would have saved the game.

I can

 

[Vegeta897]

Except Endorphin is a preprocessor used for creating animations. It doesn't work in realtime.

Which is why I said technology like Endorphin, you silly goose.

 

[Naudian]

mmmmm...realtime Endorphin-like technology...mmmmmm

 

[Vegeta897]

Endorphin actually does do it's stuff in real time, unless ofcourse you are rendering a scene.

I'm sure Endorphin could work with a game company to incorperate intelligent ragdolls into a game real-time.

 

[comoxer]

wow, that endorphin stuff is pretty amazing. Id love to see that technology incorporated in sports games, american football and the likes.

Call of duty had decent ragdoll, the enemies would have a death animation then fall into a "sort of" ragdoll pose depending on the surface.

 

[Bull Goose Loony]

swapping css physics for the hl2 ones makes cs pretty entertaining. especially the gren kills.

 

[Toprem]

Play FEAR.

You still shoot guys with helmets, but no battle ever plays out exactly the same way.

Like, that guy might run over there instead, or maybe that ragdoll will go flying and hit that other guy in the face.

I would disagree. F.E.A.R. is the most repetative FPS ever made.

 

[Finger]

I would disagree. F.E.A.R. is the most repetative FPS ever made.

And I would disagree with your disagreement. F.E.A.R. takes the mechanic of shooting and killing guys, and makes it so sweet that repeating it throughout the game never boring. I loved F.E.A.R.

 

[Toprem]

And I would disagree with your disagreement. F.E.A.R. takes the mechanic of shooting and killing guys, and makes it so sweet that repeating it throughout the game never boring. I loved F.E.A.R.

SMOD for HL2 completely destroys F.E.A.R. I wish I could get the time I wasted downloading F.E.A.R. back, I would have been pissed had I actually paid money for that game.

 

[Solver]

SWAT4 is a game where the enemies are simply humans, and it has ragdolls, although it doesn't use them in such an awesome way that some other games do.

Also, Hitman:Blood Money is out soon. You can have plenty of killing and corpse dragging there.

 

[MultiVaC]

I would disagree. F.E.A.R. is the most repetative FPS ever made.

Ever heard of a game called Halo? The one with the copy-pasted corridors? I didn't think FEAR was nearly as repetitive as that.

Anyway, MOH: PA made an attempt at mixing ragdolls and animations, but the ragdolls were just so horrible that it didn't work.

 

[Toprem]

Ever heard of a game called Halo? The one with the copy-pasted corridors? I didn't think FEAR was nearly as repetitive as that.

Anyway, MOH: PA made an attempt at mixing ragdolls and animations, but the ragdolls were just so horrible that it didn't work.

Ive heard of it, but I had enough sense in me to not play it on the computer, and as Im not some XBox sackrider fanboy I don't even own an XBox.

 

[Drackard]

And I would disagree with your disagreement. F.E.A.R. takes the mechanic of shooting and killing guys, and makes it so sweet that repeating it throughout the game never boring. I loved F.E.A.R.

Such lies, has to be one of the least repetitive games i've played in a long time. Each time i play a section over again something differen't happens, i find a new route maybe, enemies react differently etc etc ... not many other games i have played recently have done that.

 

[RabidJester]

About the helmeted bad guys, there's a number of things that factor into that reasoning. First, it means we aren't shooting bad guys with the same five or six faces throughout the whole game.

Secondly, these are the badguys. We are supposed to be gunning them down without consideration or remorse. As sane human beings, we aren't generally equipped to be in that mindset. So the enemy becomes faceless, like propaganda posters in WWII that always showed German soldiers in gas masks, and Stormtroopers in Star Wars, and so on and so on. The thought is that humans are, in most cases, against savagery towards other people, so cultures on a whole have attempted to dehumanize the enemy as much as possible to make it a touch more edible.

Of course, here are some of you guys, crying out that you want them to be more human as you slaughter them?

Sometimes, every now and again, I wonder if Jack Thompson isn't actually on to something.

 

[Jintor]

Waitwaitwaitwaitwait. Are you talking about implementing it so that the living AI are in ragdolls? Because, what I can see now, is that HL2 has the living AI, in a weird character thingy, that isn't in a ragdoll because it is bound by its AI to only have certain animations. Which is why, when falling, they simply look around, and land feet-first (and still standing).