Saddam Hussein executed in iraq

[Solaris]

Nobody in their right mind today, Solaris. Don't get pissy with me because you support an outdated ideology. I can understand the promise of it back in their days, but times have changed and Communism has not withstood their tests.

I know better than to call them dumb. Marx was arguably a genius. But the amount of intelligence and thought put into an idea does not necessarily make it gold. That's not to say there's nothing we can't learn from him. But as a whole, Communism is a failure.

How is a failure?
Where has it failed, how was this the fault of communism?

And finally, why is it outdated?

 

[15357]

Another funny thing. Most nations that found themselves embracing Communism were previously governed by corrupt and oppressive governments, and attempts to to stifle the movements often simply gave it more resolve and social traction.

So if you really want to prevent the "evil cancer" from poisoning your country, you'd be better off not acting like a bunch of authoritarian nutjobs. If your population has no need for communism, then what danger could there possibly ****ing be?

It's like a narcotic. You have no need for it, but you do it anyway, for reasons unknown.

 

[15357]

The point is that Numbers applauds many of the practices that North Korea also employs

?

similarities

/?????

Name some.

 

[repiV]

How is a failure?
Where has it failed, how was this the fault of communism?

And finally, why is it outdated?

You can't figure that out for yourself?
Furthermore, why do you ask the same questions over and over and over again? You always disregard the answers given anyway - then you ask the same question again two weeks later. Yawn.

 

[repiV]

Because an ideology that seeks to establish a classless, stateless social organization, based upon common ownership of the means of production is a disease and must be eliminated.

God-'n-Jesus forbid if the people ever thought that having no classes or states and owning the means of production would be a good thing...

It is a disease, but it doesn't need to be eliminated. Most people are smart enough to laugh at communists.
This whole shit about "owning the means of production" makes me crack up every goddamn time. What production? I don't remember the last time I saw a factory!
It's quite comical. "OHNOES, the poor working class have to work in factories for EIGHT HOURS A DAY for only ?8 an hour, they need communism!"
Yet, hardly anyone works in a factory here and noone is forced to. Under communism, everyone would be working in factories and getting paid even less. Sounds...great?
I'm not sure why your heart bleeds for the poor factory workers, either. I get into the office at 8am and leave at somewhere between 6 and 7:30, constantly working to targets and don't usually take a lunch break. Why don't I get your sympathy? Because I don't have a cockney accent and I wear Armani instead of Adidas to work?

 

[Absinthe]

?



/?????

Name some.

You're both essentially run by dictatorships. You both practice unnecessary censorship. You both subscribe to insane authoritarianism. You're both plagued by mind-numbing propaganda and rhetoric that blasts your neighbor while simultaneously patting yourself on the back for being either capitalist or communist.

But the commies are the evil ones, right? Oh, and you have the internet, so you're super cool by default.

How is a failure?

Please look at any nation that has tried to implement it and then gauge its success against capitalist ones.

Where has it failed, how was this the fault of communism?

Oppression, corruption, the downright theft through collectivization, dead-slow industrial and technological progression? It's a fact that any so-called "communist nation" that's managed to overcome these issues has gradually become more capitalist.

If you really want to argue that there technically hasn't been any real communist nation in history, then I guess that's a testament to how it's either impossible to implement or how people don't actually want it.

And finally, why is it outdated?

It simply doesn't work in heavily industrialized nations. The days in which over half the country works on farmland or in factories are gone. Unless, of course, you'd like us to regress?

 

[repiV]

Is that Benjamin Franklin in your avatar, Absinthe?

 

[Absinthe]

Tom Jenkinson

 

[repiV]

Tom Jenkinson

Oh.

 

[Gargantou]

0_0

 

[15357]

You're both essentially run by dictatorships.

We voted our retard of a president through an election.

You both practice unnecessary censorship.

Unecessary to the enemies of freedom.

You both subscribe to insane authoritarianism.

Insane?

You're both plagued by mind-numbing propaganda and rhetoric that blasts your neighbor while simultaneously patting yourself on the back for being either capitalist or communist.

Hmm, wouldn't call it plagued. There is a huge difference in amount.

But the commies are the evil ones, right?

Duh.

Oh, and you have the internet, so you're super cool by default.

[/QUOTE]

We don't just have the internet, we're the most wired nation in the entire frigging world.

 

[Gargantou]

Mate, censorship goes exactly against freedom, so it's necessary for enemies of freedom, just look at Nazi Germany, Soviet Union and more.. You see, where I live, we have what's called freedom of speech, aslong as you don't directly violate people by for example saying that all jews must die, you have a right to spread your belief, sure, you don't have the right to encourage illegal stuff, say killing people etc, but you do have the right to promote communism or socialism if you want, as well as capitalism etc.
Not having censorship = Gives people everything = Gives people their own right to choose what political system they want to vote for and believe in.

 

[Absinthe]

Unnecessary to the enemies of freedom. You're a genius, Numbers. An absolute genius. I'm sure you're the top of your class when issues of democracy and freedom are broached.

Teacher: How do you protect our freedom from North Korea?
Numbers: KILL FREEDOM
Teacher: EXCELLENT. YOU GET ANOTHER ANTI-COMMIE STICKER.

 

[repiV]

Unnecessary to the enemies of freedom. You're a genius, Numbers. An absolute genius. I'm sure you're the top of your class when issues of democracy and freedom are broached.

Teacher: How do you protect our freedom from North Korea?
Numbers: KILL FREEDOM
Teacher: EXCELLENT. YOU GET ANOTHER ANTI-COMMIE STICKER.

 

[15357]

Unnecessary to the enemies of freedom. You're a genius, Numbers. An absolute genius. I'm sure you're the top of your class when issues of democracy and freedom are broached.

Teacher: How do you protect our freedom from North Korea?
Numbers: KILL FREEDOM
Teacher: EXCELLENT. YOU GET ANOTHER ANTI-COMMIE STICKER.

Actually, we've already done the democratic system in Social Studies. Got full marks for that middle exam, actually.


We practice censorship out of nessecity. There are many people, who can easily swayed by empty promises and the sweet words of inseminators such as Marx or Lenin. Especially among pre-military University students. Take for example, the banned group, Korean Student Federation (Hanchongryun). They have been encouraging the juche idea, North Korea's main philoshophy. However, because the juche ideology declares complete independence of a particular ethnic group, it has been very anti-foreign, especially anti-US. Because of those views, they, in 1996, were declared illegal by the Supreme Court for their role in the Yonsei University demonstrations. Calling the administration at that time, a puppet of the US demonic imperialists, they seized the Science laboratory complex of Yonsei University, holding out in a 9-day violent and illegal occupation. Not one day passed without chlorific acid being thrown at police, and it ended when the police special forces stormed the complex. However, the group blew the oxygen tanks in the chemistry lab, causing 2 floors to collapse. An estimated 9 billion was lost in damages.

However, even after the delaration, they have continued on their illegal activities, and some of their members are being prosecuted on charges of spying, where significant evidence has been found with (somewhat illegal) wiretapping by the Public Security Division of SECPOL.

 

[Flyingdebris]

I am normally against censorship, but seriously, survival of your country always comes first, always. S. Korea, being that it's in a relatively small footold to a primarily communist landmass, is in a very precarious position. They cannot afford to be underminded from within. Because that would mean a military and administrative structure that can become halfway comprimised.

Also, seriously. The whole excuse of "no so called communist governments have been real communist governments," is a bunch of bull. The idea sucks on paper AND its sucks in execution. Communism rewards ineptitude and mediocrity. It tries to make everything the same. And it leaves no room for people who want to be self reliant individual. It requires everyone to be reliant on the givernment for their basic needs. And it relies on even more brainwashing than any of you accuse numbers of having undergone.

 

[Solaris]

I am normally against censorship, but seriously, survival of your country always comes first, always. S. Korea has being that its in a relatively small footold to a primarily communist landmass, is in a very precarious position. They cannot afford to be underminded with within. Because that would mean a military and administrative structure that can become halfway comprimised.

Also, seriously. The whole excuse of "no so called communist governments have been real communist governments," is a bunch of bull. The idea sucks on paper AND its sucks in execution. Communism rewards ineptitude and mediocrity. It tries to make everything the same. And it leaves no room for people who want to be self reliant individual. It requires everyone to be reliant on the givernment for their basic needs. And it relies on even more brainwashing than any of you accuse numbers of having undergone.

Sure, if you say so.

 

[repiV]

I am normally against censorship, but seriously, survival of your country always comes first, always. S. Korea has being that its in a relatively small footold to a primarily communist landmass, is in a very precarious position. They cannot afford to be underminded with within. Because that would mean a military and administrative structure that can become halfway comprimised.

Your argument really hinges on whether or not the toleration of communist ideology would prove a threat to the integrity of the nation. I dispute that it would - if anything, deviant ideologies become more powerful when suppressed. It allows likeminded people to band together and get carried away with themselves. Whereas if things are openly discussed, that allows stupid ideas to be cast aside via discussion and debate.
Although, your point about the survival of the country coming first is well taken.

Also, seriously. The whole excuse of "no so called communist governments have been real communist governments," is a bunch of bull. The idea sucks on paper AND its sucks in execution. Communism rewards ineptitude and mediocrity. It tries to make everything the same. And it leaves no room for people who want to be self reliant individual. It requires everyone to be reliant on the givernment for their basic needs. And it relies on even more brainwashing than any of you accuse numbers of having undergone.

Quite so.

 

[Flyingdebris]

Your argument really hinges on whether or not the toleration of communist ideology would prove a threat to the integrity of the nation. I dispute that it would - if anything, deviant ideologies become more powerful when suppressed. It allows likeminded people to band together and get carried away with themselves. Whereas if things are openly discussed, that allows stupid ideas to be cast aside via discussion and debate.
Although, your point about the survival of the country coming first is well taken.



Quite so.

I think it really would prove a threat to the integrity of the nation, as the communists would like nothing better than to see SK under the NK flag. Remember, their war never officially ended. it just cooled down a whole lot and became a war where the primary ammo is ideologies...and threatening to use nukes at any given oppertunity, at least as far as the north is concerned.

 

[repiV]

I think it really would prove a threat to the integrity of the nation, as the communists would like nothing better than to see SK under the NK flag. Remember, their war never officially ended. it just cooled down a whole lot and became a war where the primary ammo is ideologies...and threatening to use nukes at any given oppertunity, at least as far as the north is concerned.

Don't you think the communists would find it a lot easier to recruit people to their cause if they can use victimhood as a crutch?
People with the victim mentality join groups not necessarily because the ideology matches their own, but because they find solace in being a fellow outcast. I'd wager that's why most Muslim youth in Western countries join extremist groups - IMO it's impossible to be a fully integrated member of British society and a Muslim at the same time, and some of them will not be able to handle this and instead find a place they can be fully accepted, revered even, so long as they tow the line. They can find easy rewards via this path, whereas rewards are difficult to attain in mainstream society.
And there is less chance to instill sense into these people before they turn to the "dark side", as open debate on Islam is suppressed via self-censorship and political correctness.
When it's taboo to explore this subject in anything more than superficial detail, a lot of people can have the mistaken belief that the ideology isn't really all that bad and band together, silently.
Same with communism in South Korea. Same with gangs - although not so much the ideology part, more the identity.

I know I've rambled a bit there...they are slightly different situations in terms of reason for happening, but censorship just drives a movement underground which is ever more dangerous than an enemy you can see and hear.

 

[Flyingdebris]

gaining members through victimization, though, is not nearly as bad as letting a sessionist ideology run rampant.

It impossible to cover all the bases.

Don't get me wrong, in suppressing communism and driving it underground, it will likely lead to SK getting bit in the ass by its own commie underground later down the line. However the alternative would allow the problem to erupt now. So its a matter of buying time and keeping stability.

 

[Absinthe]

What in the **** makes you think it would run rampant?

 

[Flyingdebris]

Because china and NK have vested interest in it running rampant. You do know that countries do send agents into other countries to promote their country's agendas thrugh overt and covert means right? The USA does it, Russia does it, china does it, they all do it.

 

[repiV]

Because china and NK have vested interest in it running rampant. You do know that countries do send agents into other countries to promote their country's agendas thrugh overt and covert means right? The USA does it, Russia does it, china does it, they all do it.

I heard that during the Cold War, Russia had many spies infiltrate our education system to turn the public opinion favourably towards communism. Something that, if true, may or may not be responsible for the general political cluelessness that permeates the nation today.
Of course, I never bothered to verify this assertion because it sounds a bit too much like a conspiracy theory to me. But it's interesting to think about.

Did you read about the MI6 exploits in the USA during WW2? They controlled the media and recruited famous people to oppose Hitler and turn public opinion so that the US would enter the war. Man, that was absolutely fascinating.