The current machine gun model.

  • Thread starter Mr.Magnetichead
  • Start date
well, this is not designed to be a swat style 'breach and enter' type weapon, that's what SMG's are for. But a soldier or a marnine needs to have a gun effective in nearly any environment, and that's what this bun (Edit: er, gun. no combat buns in HL2 (or the army), please!) was desinged for...

-Phision
 
i think the M4 and the M16 are perfect weapons for there times. If you can aim, shoot, and kill theres no need for a standerd foot soldier to have an OICW. Even though i think the OICW has some unneccassary functions, a regular foot soldier dosnt need it. Maybe navy seals or green barreghs(spelling)
 
Yeah, but the OICW is good for taking down long range targets without a sniper rifle since it has a scope.
 
Crap this thread moved fast. Everyone go back and look at my post now... Yes, the OICW does have unnecessary functions, the optics don't even need to be there because at the average engagement range of 100 yds or less all that's needed is iron sights. The grenade launcher adds too much bulk to be used effectively and quickly. Besides, the OICW project is as good as dead.
 
Since editing my posts take too long... The 5.56mm is not a very effective sniping round as it loses too much of its velocity after 250yds to be very effective against soft targets. That is why they still employ the larger and slower moving 7.62mm round in sniper platforms.
 
Phisionary: no, it's not designed to be a swat style gun, which it's not
now, your comment about any environment: any environment includes urban combat, which is becoming an increasingly familiar setting to U.S. infantry

i'm sorry, but the xm-29 just does not seem to be able to excell in urban combat, or other short range combat, where most of combat takes place, less than 200 yards

also, feedback from the troops testing it has made it quite clear that this weapon would not be suitable as a standard combat rifle at all, and if used at all, would best be suited to maybe 1 to 2 people per squad, used as a specialty weapon instead
 
Ridic, no, special forces would most definitely shy away from th xm-29

special forces tend to shy away from any excess weight or reliance on technology, and although they aren't too afraid to use technology where it proves beneficial (read: GPS and comm gear), they always have a backup, going back to standard radio gear and maps and compasses. the xm-29 leaves no such backup, being too bulky, even if not too heavy, it's far too bulky, and it also has no iron sites, this fact alone, i guarantee you, would keep the weapon out of the hands of special forces

also, it's not very water proof or resistant
 
Originally posted by Doobz
Ridic, no, special forces would most definitely shy away from th xm-29

special forces tend to shy away from any excess weight or reliance on technology, and although they aren't too afraid to use technology where it proves beneficial (read: GPS and comm gear), they always have a backup, going back to standard radio gear and maps and compasses. the xm-29 leaves no such backup, being too bulky, even if not too heavy, it's far too bulky, and it also has no iron sites, this fact alone, i guarantee you, would keep the weapon out of the hands of special forces

also, it's not very water proof or resistant
Click to expand...

i wasnt thinking about the weight or size, i was reffering to itz special enhancments like NV and infared.

hell, Navy Seals use Aks-74u sometimes. (silenced AK-74)
 
some quokes from my last link. from an article at the end of the page.
[about the 20mm explosive round] ...the weapons accuracy far exceeded customer expectations, he said. We tested at ranges out to 500 meters, and the OICW consistently delivered airbursts within a very tight pattern.

...Currently, plans call for the weapon to weigh no more than 17.5 pounds when production of block I begins in 2007, she said. In block II, scheduled for 2010, the OICWs weight is scheduled to drop to 15.5 pounds.

...The current M-4/M-16 system is modular, allowing soldiers to attach only those accessories that they need at the moment, Muldowney said. The OICW, by comparison, operates as a single piece in its present design. Eventually, the Army plans to redesign the OICW to allow the rifle and grenade launcher portions to be detached and operated separately, Muldowney explained. But that wont happen until block III, sometime after 2010, she said.

...Still, Muldowney points out, the Army doesn't plan to issue an OICW to every soldier. Only four members of every nine-member infantry squad will get one. The others will retain their M-4s or M-16s, she said.

...At present, the marine corps has no plans to adopt the OICW, said Diehl. Were pretty much taking a wait and see attitude, he told National Defense.
My personal opinion is that the Army needs to focus more on the ergonomics of the weapon, he said. You need to be able to handle that thing with one hand, and you can't now. Im convinced until they address that issue, they're not going to get the interest of the marine corps.
Click to expand...
well. I'm not saying it's the perfect gun, by any means. but it might be the right direction.

-Phision
 
true, this will probably be a design lesson

also, what weights the weapon plans and hopes to achieve have no bearing on the realistic weights of the weapon. latest news right now, is that they cannot reduce the weapon to it's designed combat size and weight and it looks very likely right now that the program will be canceled shortly

the 20 milimeter grenade right now conflicts with the standards grenade that the m-25, the addon launcher for the m-8, the weapon system that the army has on priority at the moment, with the 25 mm grenade to be used by the next heavy machine gun. it would be far more cost effective to employ the m-8/m-25 weapon system than the xm-29, and probably far more combat effective as well

link to current m-8 info: http://world.guns***/assault/as61-e.htm
 
and there's never going to be a computer game (or at least a fun one) that accurately simulates military combat, or the weapons used. it's all about gameplay, and most of the weapons are faked anyway...

but it terms of the gun AS a game weapon, sure... anyone played that game here? opinions?? to be OT, how do the models compare??

-Phision
 
lol, hell, even as a game weapon the thing is complicated to use, in SOFII anyway
 
Yeah, using the OICW from SoF II was a really, really dumb way to try and prove its an effective and ergonomic gun. Really.

Doesn't matter as this is a game anyways! Even if they're being factually incorrect which most games do anyways, it doesn't matter as long as it is fun to play with.
 
Originally posted by Tredoslop
K, play a little of SoF II. Test out the OICW, see if you like it or not...
Click to expand...
I hated it. Way too many buttons to push and figure out. Got very confusing, never used anything except the rifle part of it.
 
the OICW grenade launcher has no needs to comply with standards as it is designed. It's HE round launcher a is integrated with the rangefinding targeting system to allow the air-burst capabilities, and the circuitry of this system means it will doubtfully be required by any standards for a very long time.

Edit: besides, a larger projectile may make the weapon unusable to launch an explosive round at long distances, such as at a 300m range. The gains in esplosive power may be offset by the weight of the projectiles, and even more the range and recoil of the weapon. Of course, at 15-20 lbs. a significant amount of power should be capable, Id think.

-Phison
 
The 25mm system which is now in development to replace the OICW's grenade launcher system uses the same timed fuse from the OICW, so it wasn't a complete waste of money. Oh, and the 25mm launcher will be able to switch to shotgun style ammunition.

Edited to remove a stupid grammar error
 
yeah, but the thing is that it is much more cost effective and efficient to comply with standards

i mean, the m-8 even has the ability to fire ak-47 ammo, 7.62 mm, which is very useful in areas with large ammounts of that type of ammo

also, how efficient could it be if they had to order seperate ammo for the xm-29's nade launcher when every other weapon in the arsenal uses their standard of 25mm? you could have a giant stockpile of 25mm grenades for your m312 (new hmg being developed to replace the m2, LONG LIVE "MA DEUCE!"), and you wouldn't be able to use a one of them, and that would certainly suck if you were running low on the ammo for your xm-29

also, most engagements take place at ranges of less than 200 yards
and another thing, the 25mm could easily come close to the range of the 20mm if the luancher were designed nicely
 
perhaps. but there are already dozens of ammunition calibers being used in military weapons. if one has an advantage over another, the lesser will be eliminated. but if each has advantages, then both wil remain...

i'm not saying that it's a bad idea, i'm saying there are always trade-offs.

-Phision [edit ack i cant spell my bloody sig right :x]
 
I have also posted that most engagements are under 200 yds so right now I don't know if you replied to me or someone else. Anyways, the 20mm standard is being dropped, gone, no longer around. One of the drawbacks to the M-8 is that it needs tools to change barrels, something the M-16s do not. Also I was under the impression that the M-25 grenade launcher was to be man portable? Or is the M-312 a crew serviced MG replacement? If so, we don't need it, the .50 is more than enough when it comes to killing things.
 
There are three calibers currently being widely used in the armed forces of Great Britain and the USA. They are 5.56mm, 7.62mm, and for the USA .50 cal. Not that many, unless you feel like adding the standard size tank round of 120mm. Oh, and the 25mm Bushwacker cannon on the Bradley troop carrier. 20mm Vulcan cannons for the Air Force boys, 30mm for Apaches, Cobras and A-10s. Oh yes, all those calibers are likely to stay, the slow and heavy ones, the fast and heavy, and the light and fast ones all have their own mission. I personally think we should standardize the .30-06 like we did back in WW2 for most guns as it has the power needed for most any job.
 
there is none-the-less, an advantage to having a longer effective range for a weapon, especially if that range is longer than your enemy. It's great if you can see something coming, even better if you can do something about it before they see you coming.

well, stalker. I'd respond but i'm too confused... :cheese: what are the m-8, the m-25, the m-135, and what .50 are you talking about? if none of these are directed at me, then nm.

-Phison
 
Not specifically directed at you, over using the knowledge I've collected about firearms and the current military though. I don't know much beyond basic tactics for platoons though so don't ask me about how to move troops :)
 
m-8: http://world.guns***/assault/as61-e.htm

the m-25 is the grenade launcher attachment to it

i know not of this m-135 though

and no, the m-8 does not need to change barrels to fit the m-25, it's just an added feature that it can be changed into several different guns, lmg, smaller commando style weapon, long rifle, and standard assault rifle with the change of a barrel
 
Sorry, my brain managed to bastardize M-25 and M-312 into M-125... oops.

They should include the F-2000 as bullpup is the wave of the future and they fixed the brass ejecting into leftie people's faces problem. Not only that but the optics can be removed AFAIK and all types of crap can be added.
 
i always thought the g-36 (the hk gun the xm-8 was derived from) was ugly. the xm-8 is only slightly better.

i always thought the m4a1 was one of teh coolest (and most military-ish) weapons around. i guess not perfect though. heres a bit i found at world.guns***

"From the first sight, the M4A1 SOPMOD is an ideal Special Operations weapon - handy, flexible, with good firepower. But the latest experience in the Afghanistan showed that the M4 has some flaws. First of all, the shorter barrel commands the lower bullet velocities, and this significantly decreased the effective range of the 5.56mm bullet. Second, the M4 barrel and the forend rapidly overheats. Third, the shortened barrel resulted in the shortened gas system, which works under greater pressures, than in M16A2 rifle. This increases the rate of fire and produces more stress on the moving parts, decreasing the reliability. While adequate as a Personal Defense Weapon for the non-infantry troops (vehicle crews, clerks, staff officers etc), M4A1 is, by some accounts, less than ideal for the Special Operations troops, at least in its present state. The idea of the complete re-arming of the US Army with the M4 as a money-saving measure, also is somewhat dubious."

Edit: I cant find the m-312 anywhere?? any help? different names?

-Phision
 
well i think the gun model is okay, but i really really like the sounds, i think noises make atleast half of the gun.
 
there was a guy a few pages back who said he couldn't stand the sounds, said they sounded like ripping paper or something

guys, what do you think rifle fire sounds like? it sounds like a very loud and distinct crack, i think he was expecting some sort of booming thunder though
 
personally i really like the good ol weapons, like bolt action rifles (w/o scopes) and revolvers :)
 
yes, the m1 garand kicks

and the m2, long live "ma deuce!"
 
i wanna 30.40 with no scope, any play the game Outlaws, ever use the rifle without a scope, now that was a sweet gun
 
In the movie Wild Wild West, I saw a girl holding a nice rifle.
I also love those lever guns.
 
yah, i also like girls holding guns, those are my favorite
 
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