weed..whats the big deal??

[Warbie]

Xtasy0 wrote:

'what exactly, are you doing to your brain when you smoke weed? do you have any type of scientific facts that show weed doing long term brain damage?'

The studies i've read pretty much all say the same thing - that scientists still haven't a clue about the possible long term effects. Infact if anyone has any info to the contrary i'd be very interested.

poseyjmac wrote:

'theres no way we can prove either way which is more harmful to the population beyond a shadow of a doubt, alcohol, or weed, but we can look around in the place we live.'

Agreed. That's what i'm doing. Kids who can't be much older than 11 smoking weed in the streets :/ Older kids smoking weed and abusing random strangers (weed doesn't make you chilled and passive - from experience I believe it can make you selfish and mean)

In all the years i've been smoking i've met many ppl who've develpoed difficulties, some very serious. Sure, it can't be proved that weed was the cause, but these ppl all have one thing in common - long-term, heavy cannabis use. If it wasn't weed then it must just be misfortune that such an unproportionally high number of my friends/acquaintances have developed phsycological problems.

I've only ever known two ppl to have problems with alcohol.

 

[Maskirovka]

Originally posted by poseyjmac
i haven't heard about one violent situation that has been the result of smoking weed.

i haven't heard one story either...news, friends, anything.

Originally posted by pat_thetic
There is a huge difference between slavery and the legalization of pot. Pot is a drug, slavery was forced labor. Pot will never be accepted by the majority in this country.

wow pat, i thought maybe you'd stop posting your random opinions by now. i realized that your posts are one-liners because my screen resolution is 1280x1024. but they're still just your opinion.

saying something will never happen is just wrong. people in those times probably felt like things will never change.

but things DO change because people who believe in causes stand up for what they believe in and try to get things changed...like i just freakin said.

i wasn't comparing slavery to marijuana in their severity...if i sat here long enough i'm sure i could think up some more examples. but i'm not going to waste my time...i made my point...you just chose to pick it apart with technicalities instead of understanding what i was trying to say.

 

[Maskirovka]

warbie: do you know anyone who has quit smoking weed for like say....a year...and still has problems? like real problems, not just that they're stupid cause the dropped out of school or something like that

like...they still have short term memory problems and things like that.

i'll try to find some studies for you...i know there are a few big ones that have been done that showed that you get a buildup in your brain from the marijuana and that it causes the brain-related problems.

but what the study showed was that when you quit, that buildup goes away after a certain amount of time and you don't suffer from those problems anymore.

i'll try and find it.

 

[Maskirovka]

and warbie:

the little button in the bottom right of people's posts

it says "quote" use that to post a reply with a quote.

you can also put "

" and then end the quote with forward slash inside the brackets /quote

whatever you type inside the quote /quote will be set aside like you see everyone doing

i think if i demonstrate fully it'll just actually make a quote.

 

[Warbie]

Come on Maskirovka - you know it's the ppl to blame and not the drug

Of course stoned ppl fight - it's not the reason they're fighting tho.

 

[Warbie]

Maskirovka wrote:

'and warbie:

the little button in the bottom right of people's posts

it says "quote" use that to post a reply with a quote.

you can also put "

" and then end the quote with forward slash and

i think if i demonstrate fully it'll just actually make a quote.'

Not you aswell lol, I've always quoted like this, and am far too opinionated and stubborn to change now

 

[Maskirovka]

oh i agree...but what he's saying is that alcohol is worse than weed in that way...it makes some people get angry.

which is why alcohol is more on par with heroin/crack

i have friends who get really angry when they're drunk and are otherwise completely normal nice people. get a few shots in em or some beer and they just go nuts.

i don't have any friends who go nuts and want to start fights and break stuff when they're smoking.

that same guy...he gets drunk and almost 100% of the time wants to start fights...but if he's smoking he doesn't do that at all...c'mon you know that's what he's pointing out about alcohol/weed

i've never seen people want to start random fights when high...of course if they have another reason to fight, people might fight while high...

i've just never seen someone yell "yeyeyyahahahhahhhhhhh...lets find someone to **** up!!!"

but i see that all the time with alcohol...i went to parties here at my university for my first 2 years, and i saw this kind of stuff all the time :\

but again...i've never seen a bunch of people take a drag off a joint and then go nuts like that.

 

[Maskirovka]

omg just push the button...it does everything for you...lol

it's just hard to read when you do it like that.

 

[Warbie]

Ok, that's true.

Sounds like your friend shouldn't drink

For the amount of ppl who drink the number of violent incidences must be pretty low, it's not one of the stronger arguments for why alcohol is bad - imo.

 

[Xtasy0]

Originally posted by Warbie
Xtasy0 wrote:

'what exactly, are you doing to your brain when you smoke weed? do you have any type of scientific facts that show weed doing long term brain damage?'

The studies i've read pretty much all say the same thing - that scientists still haven't a clue about the possible long term effects. Infact if anyone has any info to the contrary i'd be very interested.

poseyjmac wrote:

'theres no way we can prove either way which is more harmful to the population beyond a shadow of a doubt, alcohol, or weed, but we can look around in the place we live.'

Agreed. That's what i'm doing. Kids who can't be much older than 11 smoking weed in the streets :/ Older kids smoking weed and abusing random strangers (weed doesn't make you chilled and passive - from experience I believe it can make you selfish and mean)

In all the years i've been smoking i've met many ppl who've develpoed difficulties, some very serious. Sure, it can't be proved that weed was the cause, but these ppl all have one thing in common - long-term, heavy cannabis use. If it wasn't weed then it must just be misfortune that such an unproportionally high number of my friends/acquaintances have developed phsycological problems.

I've only ever known two ppl to have problems with alcohol.

http://www.erowid.org/plants/cannabis/cannabis_journal.shtml#health

 

[Maskirovka]

Originally posted by Warbie
Ok, that's true.

Sounds like your friend shouldn't drink

For the amount of ppl who drink the number of violent incidences must be pretty low, it's not one of the stronger arguments for why alcohol is bad - imo.

of course it's low...and that's why alcohol is legal...because "my friend shouldn't drink"

but you're not saying alcohol should be illegal because he has problems!
but you ARE saying that because some people have problems with marijuana that weed should stay illegal...which just isn't right.

i totally agree that drugs should be kept out of kids' hands...but that doesn't happen when it's illegal...kids still get it.

ok sure, some kids probably can't get it, and it being illegal might have something to do with it, (there could be other reasons why they can't get any) but it'd be so much better to have the money from marijuana sales go to educating people about it in an unbiased way.

 

[Warbie]

Maskirovka wrote:

'warbie: do you know anyone who has quit smoking weed for like say....a year...and still has problems? like real problems, not just that they're stupid cause the dropped out of school or something like that

like...they still have short term memory problems and things like that.'


Unoftunately I do. A few who have to take antipsychotics and other drugs everyday, a guy whose too afraid to leave his house, another who was put away 2 years ago, and various ppl who are on anti-depressants. Loads of ppl who're just weird now - unsociable, mean ..... they weren't like that before (not a real 'problem' I know).

Personally I still have troubles with my short term memory .. and gave up weed 2 years ago (walking into a room and then wondering why i'm there, leaving the bath on etc is about as serious as it gets .... luckily, being a bit dopey is often seen as endearing) I know quite a few ppl who're as bad, if not worse .. even after years without cannabis.

 

[MrD]

Originally posted by Warbie
In all the years i've been smoking i've met many ppl who've develpoed difficulties, some very serious. Sure, it can't be proved that weed was the cause, but these ppl all have one thing in common - long-term, heavy cannabis use. If it wasn't weed then it must just be misfortune that such an unproportionally high number of my friends/acquaintances have developed phsycological problems.

Is it not more likely that the phsycological problems were there all along, and it was those problems that caused the "long-term heavy canabis use" rather than the other way round?

 

[Warbie]

Maskirovka wrote:

'but you're not saying alcohol should be illegal because he has problems!
but you ARE saying that because some people have problems with marijuana that weed should stay illegal...which just isn't right.'

Some ppl do coke recreationally/occasionally and have no problems (the old crappy, but valid, argument )

Imagine weed has become legal - and the numbers of smokers has reached that of drinkers ......... do you believe anyone has a accurate idea of the possible repercussions? I certainly don't.

 

[Maskirovka]

are you sure they've never done any other drugs? even once? have you done any other drugs?

how do you know it's the marijuana? that's what i'm asking...your "i know some people who have problems" isn't really all that scientific if ya know what i mean

i walk into rooms and wonder why i'm there all the time...that's just part of being human...it happens to everyone. (could be genetic too...both of my parents have that happen)

and people being on antidepressants is not because of marijuana...i can tell you that being 100% sure. go ask a psychologist...people smoke because they're depressed, not the other way around.

my girlfriend is on antidepressants and she used to smoke marijuana. but if you ask her why she smoked, she says she did it because she felt like crap and wanted to feel good (she didn't smoke much because it didn't make her feel any better, so she stopped)

she says she would've tried heroin if she had the chance. this is because she was suffering from depression and she wanted a way out...drugs were an opportunity to maybe relieve the depression.

please, find a study that says marijuana causes depression...yeah right.
please find a study that says marijuana causes people to need psychoactive drugs...yeah right.

 

[Maskirovka]

Originally posted by MrD
Is it not more likely that the phsycological problems were there all along, and it was those problems that caused the "long-term heavy canabis use" rather than the other way round?

once again, MrD sums it up better than i could have.

 

[Maskirovka]

Originally posted by Warbie
Imagine weed has become legal - and the numbers of smokers has reached that of drinkers ......... do you believe anyone has a accurate idea of the possible repercussions? I certainly don't.

again, you're assuming that droves of people will suddenly start smoking marijuana the minute it becomes legal...or that marijuana use will increase at all.

 

[Warbie]

MrD wrote:

'Is it not more likely that the phsycological problems were there all along, and it was those problems that caused the "long-term heavy canabis use" rather than the other way round?'

I don't know.

Lets assume that's correct - would these problems have arisen if it wasn't for cannabis? Maybe these problems caused them to rely on smoking so much in the first place ....... very possible. Maybe I have a talent for choosing ppl with mental problems as buddies?

Do you think that these ppl would be in the same boat if they hadn't used cannabis so readily?

I really don't know, but don't believe anyone else does either.

 

[Warbie]

Maskirovka wrote:

'again, you're assuming that droves of people will suddenly start smoking marijuana the minute it becomes legal...or that marijuana use will increase at all.'

oh yes - that I certainly am.

 

[Maskirovka]

Originally posted by Warbie
MrD wrote:

'Is it not more likely that the phsycological problems were there all along, and it was those problems that caused the "long-term heavy canabis use" rather than the other way round?'

I don't know.

Lets assume that's correct - would these problems have arisen if it wasn't for cannabis? Maybe these problems caused them to rely on smoking so much in the first place ....... very possible. Maybe I have a talent for choosing ppl with mental problems as buddies?

Do you think that these ppl would be in the same boat if they hadn't used cannabis so readily?

I really don't know, but don't believe anyone else does either.

no...that's the thing. people DO know. depression is one of the reasons people start using drugs. this is a fact. people have studied it to death.

you ask if these problems would have surfaced? they didn't surface because of drugs! the problem was already there! they felt like crap from being depressed (brain not producing enough endorphins and other chemicals) so they tried drugs as a means to feel happier.

 

[Maskirovka]

Originally posted by Warbie
oh yes - that I certainly am.

i don't understand why you think that. i don't think people who don't use it would start trying it....and even if they did, so what? if they're responsible adults doing it in their own home, that's not your problem.

again, if these droves of people start messing up their lives and losing their jobs because of it, then that's their choice. let them learn from that mistake.

then that 19 billion dollars that the USA spends on drug enforcement every year could go 100% to stopping children from smoking instead of stopping responsible adults from doing it.

 

[MrD]

Originally posted by Maskirovka
they felt like crap from being depressed (brain not producing enough endorphins and other chemicals) so they tried drugs as a means to feel happier.

I would suggest they tried it first to see what it was like. This is the reason I tried it (after doing a bit of research first to find out how dangerous it was).

It is then very easy to see why someone might become more dependent if they get depressed, because like you say it might be the only way they can "escape". But if this is the underlying cause, then had it not been hash it would have been alcohol etc. Take your pick.

I have to question the mental state of someone who would knowingly become dependent on something as a method of escape. But then it is that mental state that requires the escape in the first place, so not much can be done there.

 

[Warbie]

'you ask if these problems would have surfaced? they didn't surface because of drugs! the problem was already there! they felt like crap from being depressed (brain not producing enough endorphins and other chemicals) so they tried drugs as a means to feel happier.'

I'm sure that's true - but quite a generalisation.

3 of the ppl I mentioned were in my class at school, good friends of mine. We all did drugs because it was great fun ......... not because we were depressed, or to escape (the way it is for the majority imo)

They had no apparent symptoms, were healthy, bright , sociable. More likely the drugs cause problems that result in depression/paranoia (chicken and egg situation)

I believe smoking cannabis can cause anxiety and confusion in a perfectly healthy person. Once they go down this road there's alot of things that can go wrong.

 

[MrD]

Originally posted by Maskirovka
then that 19 billion dollars that the USA spends on drug enforcement every year could go 100% to stopping children from smoking instead of stopping responsible adults from doing it.

sounds like a plan

 

[Warbie]

Maskirovka wrote:

' don't understand why you think that. i don't think people who don't use it would start trying it....and even if they did, so what? if they're responsible adults doing it in their own home, that's not your problem.

again, if these droves of people start messing up their lives and losing their jobs because of it, then that's their choice. let them learn from that mistake.'


That's where we come full circle - our faith in ppl and society being the decider as to whether this true or would work.


Maskirovka wrote:

'then that 19 billion dollars that the USA spends on drug enforcement every year could go 100% to stopping children from smoking instead of stopping responsible adults from doing it.'


On that day i'll tattoo my face with 'Ok, you were right' and dance for joy at my new found respect for humanity.

 

[Maskirovka]

what the hell...we could do that tomorrow if enough people wanted to. that's the point of this thread...legalize marijuana and then spend that budget on stopping kids from being able to obtain it.

let them make the decision once they're old enough to fully understand what the consequences are.

 

[Warbie]

I don't like to disagree with you on this because deep down I admire ppl who believe they can make a difference, that things are worth trying to change. If everyone did as you said then the world would be a much better place to live in.

The fact is (at least the way I see it) that the things are getting worse every day ...... ppl are more corrupt now than ever before, we're basically all fooked. The drugs problem is a symptom of this, and will continue to spiral downwards. Even if cannabis were legal don't you think it more likely the 19 billion dollars would end up lining some fat cats pockets?, in the military? etc

The thought of putting you, or anyone, off (not saying that I could) isn't a nice one, so this is the last gloomy post u'll see from me \o/

 

[Maskirovka]

i guess i fail to see where your gloomy political view gives you the right to tell other people what they can and can't do

and i don't think marijuana could be legal unless it was with the stipulation that the money from taxing it go to something worthwhile...that seems to be the convincing factor for many people.

they say...well i wouldn't mind it being legal if the tax money from it went to eductating people about it and keeping it away from kids.

 

[Warbie]

omg - think I agree

//edit i've made it from Zombie to Ant Lion just on this thread lol

 

[Maskirovka]

lol...i went through part of ant lion and now i'm hydra...no idea how far thru hydra

 

[pat_thetic]

A new poll from our school shows that 50% of seniors drink on a regular basis. What is this world coming to? About 40% smoke pot to....

 

[pat_thetic]

Originally posted by Maskirovka
what the hell...we could do that tomorrow if enough people wanted to. that's the point of this thread...legalize marijuana and then spend that budget on stopping kids from being able to obtain it.

let them make the decision once they're old enough to fully understand what the consequences are.

This is so dumb, the kids know the consequences now, what makes you think they will care if they are told again?

 

[Maskirovka]

Originally posted by pat_thetic
This is so dumb, the kids know the consequences now, what makes you think they will care if they are told again?

i'm now convinced you're illiterate, pat.

"spend that budget on stopping kids from being able to obtain it"

i don't understand how you can read people's posts and miss their main points. the only explanation (after i've repeatedly told you to read posts before responding with one line crap) is that you can't read...or at least you're not capable of remembering what you just read after you start typing your response.

 

[CyberSh33p]

After reading two pages of this crap, I'm gonna get my two cents in.

Ewok: Your arguments are stupid. Alcohol was illegal once. Prohibition, remember that? Organized crime? Basement brewers? High crime rates? it stops, thinks sort of go down. crime rate lessens, etc. Legalize marijuana, why wouldn't the effects be the same? Marijuana is not an evil, it is just a mild drug. I think it would lessen our crime rates and get our police ready to chase real criminals. Marijuana is not harmful to society any more than morons are.

I have never done a drug in my [at this point still short] life, and I never plan to. I don't like alcohol, or its effects, but I know that alcohol makes people angry and depressed wheras pot makes people happy. I'd rather have a pothead dad than an alcoholic one.

Stop darting around the subject, if you have come to your senses in the last two pages good, if not then please do. Your arguments dodge the questions. All the good points you have not mentioned. Stop avoiding the issue.

and onem ore thing: the same dealer that supplies weed can supply coke. This encourages harder drugs. Not to mention lacing weed with harder drugs, making people need more. Put weed in coffee shops, solve a lot of problems. Get more cops chasing criminals rather than stoners.

 

[Murray_H]

Originally posted by CyberSh33p
.....but I know that alcohol makes people angry and depressed wheras pot makes people happy. I'd rather have a pothead dad than an alcoholic one.

When i'm pissed, i'm happy as larry, not once have i got agressive or threatened to kill anyone, although i see what you mean - i have never seen anyone angry who is on weed, but plenty of people who are pissed up and angry

 

[LoneDeranger]

Originally posted by CyberSh33p
After reading two pages of this crap, I'm gonna get my two cents in.

Ewok: Your arguments are stupid. Alcohol was illegal once. Prohibition, remember that? Organized crime? Basement brewers? High crime rates? it stops, thinks sort of go down. crime rate lessens, etc. Legalize marijuana, why wouldn't the effects be the same? Marijuana is not an evil, it is just a mild drug. I think it would lessen our crime rates and get our police ready to chase real criminals. Marijuana is not harmful to society any more than morons are.

I have never done a drug in my [at this point still short] life, and I never plan to. I don't like alcohol, or its effects, but I know that alcohol makes people angry and depressed wheras pot makes people happy. I'd rather have a pothead dad than an alcoholic one.

Stop darting around the subject, if you have come to your senses in the last two pages good, if not then please do. Your arguments dodge the questions. All the good points you have not mentioned. Stop avoiding the issue.

and onem ore thing: the same dealer that supplies weed can supply coke. This encourages harder drugs. Not to mention lacing weed with harder drugs, making people need more. Put weed in coffee shops, solve a lot of problems. Get more cops chasing criminals rather than stoners.

I'm fascinated how people now claim that legal drugs (alcahol and tobacco) are somehow worse then illegal ones.

P.S. For non-British forum members pissed means drunk, not angry in Britain.

 

[pat_thetic]

Originally posted by Maskirovka
i'm now convinced you're illiterate, pat.

"spend that budget on stopping kids from being able to obtain it"

i don't understand how you can read people's posts and miss their main points. the only explanation (after i've repeatedly told you to read posts before responding with one line crap) is that you can't read...or at least you're not capable of remembering what you just read after you start typing your response.

What did I say that was illiterate in that post? I'm sorry I (get this) have a life and don't have time to write 5 page long essays on why weed should be illegal. Resorting to flaming isn't going to do much.

EDIT: there is no point in argueing so I will not post again unless you decide to flame me.

 

[Xtasy0]

Originally posted by pat_thetic
What did I say that was illiterate in that post? I'm sorry I (get this) have a life and don't have time to write 5 page long essays on why weed should be illegal. Resorting to flaming isn't going to do much.

EDIT: there is no point in argueing so I will not post again unless you decide to flame me.

haha yet again, you do the same thing.

he didn't say you couldn't type, he was refering to your reading skills, you seemed to skip the important part of his post and reply to one sentence which wasn't the sentence he was emphasizing.

it's amazing you can't see/understand what you're doing. we can, and you're coming off as a very ignorant uneducated person.

 

[Maskirovka]

Originally posted by Xtasy0
you seemed to skip the important part of his post and reply to one sentence which wasn't the sentence he was emphasizing.

it's amazing you can't see/understand what you're doing. we can, and you're coming off as a very ignorant uneducated person.

i've been trying to say that in different ways for like 3 days.

i have a life too, pat...i can type 80 words per minute, so it doesn't take me long to make a post. i like spending some time talking about serious issues...i enjoy it.

you make shitloads of posts on these boards, so don't imply i don't have a life...you know nothing about me and you're just being an ass. this is just about the only thread i post in.

 

[MrD]

Originally posted by LoneDeranger
I'm fascinated how people now claim that legal drugs (alcahol and tobacco) are somehow worse then illegal ones.

"alcohol" and "than", now go write them out 10 times ...

Why does this fascinate you exactly? Smoking tobaco is linked with various forms of cancer and it is widely accepted that some people seem to turn violent while under the influence of alcohol.

How is hash any different?