Who has more sex Atheists or Religious people?

[No Limit]

No, not at all? Let's try again: Yeah, that sounds exactly right! Oh, but uh, you seem pretty hung up on this whole 'matter of faith' thing, so I should probably remind you that your beliefs are also a matter of faith. Didn't I cover this with my last response? Also, people generally have an easier time escaping traps when you point out to them where they're set up.

I have absolutely no clue as to what you are talking about at this point. You originally said that religious views are ok because they are a matter of faith. That means the view of some muslims that they will get 72 virgins for killing infidels isn't ****ing retarded because it is a matter of faith. That's your argument, its absolutely insane.

Finding inconsistencies in the Bible, Quran, Torah, or any other religious text does not prove that all religion and religious ideals are retarded and that religion is stupid. Not all religion is represented by any single passage in any single religious belief. This is rather obvious.

Many religious people I know respect much of the moral code in these texts but also agree with modern scientific facts. Obviously, science and thought has come a long way in 2,000 years, 1,600 years, or however old whichever religious text you want to quote is. But religious content is also about human morality and may still apply. Priests and rabbis can still get across really valuable life lessons, advice, and a point of view valuable to people. Some of these people might consider themselves religious.

You can continue quoting sections of religious text that have scientific fallacies or which break modern moral code, and yes, it is disturbing that people still follow these teachings. But once again, this does not represent all religion by any means, and this is an obvious point that I should not have to make.

except I am because forum debating is so much fun hehehehhehe

I also have no clue as to what you are talking about. These are pretty big inconsistencies. Why would you live your life by a book that says the earth is flat. Can you please explain that to me?

 

[Sheepo]

I have absolutely no clue as to what you are talking about at this point. You originally said that religious views are ok because they are a matter of faith. That means the view of some muslims that they will get 72 virgins for killing infidels isn't ****ing retarded because it is a matter of faith. That's your argument, its absolutely insane.

All I've done is explain the core defense of religious people, faith. I never said anything about how I feel about any religious views. Yeah, insane radical Muslims could be right in their faith. Do I think that's even slightly likely? No. Would I care if it was? No. I care about humanity first, Earth second, and the universe third. If there was a god it would probably be best for everyone if he just ****ed off. You can't get over the fact that there's just as little evidence for nothing as there is for something so you're just throwing out the craziest sounding examples because hey, maybe I'll get overloaded by just how '****ing retarded' they are and make what I'm saying magically implode. I'm 'okay' with this statement: "There's a chance there's a god and he wants me to blow myself up near innocent people." Not this one: "I'm going to go blow myself up near innocent people."

I also have no clue as to what you are talking about. These are pretty big inconsistencies. Why would you live your life by a book that says the earth is flat. Can you please explain that to me?

As he said, the people he's talking about don't 'live their life' by the bible.

 

[Yuri]

I also have no clue as to what you are talking about. These are pretty big inconsistencies. Why would you live your life by a book that says the earth is flat. Can you please explain that to me?

Since you clearly prefer picking out Christianity in your "religion is retarded" statement, the Bible is a collection of many texts written by different authors. It is not really a single book. So yes, it includes things that are indeed factually wrong, but this does not reflect upon the content of other sections of the book. And once again, religion as a whole is not represented by the Bible. You are completely ignoring this simple fact.

I'm sure many ancient philosophers still revered today also believed the Earth was flat, as well, due to the lack of scientific knowledge. Do you also think that this should invalidate any of their teachings?

 

[No Limit]

All I've done is explain the core defense of religious people, faith. I never said anything about how I feel about any religious views. Yeah, insane radical Muslims could be right in their faith. Do I think that's even slightly likely? No. Would I care if it was? No. I care about humanity first, Earth second, and the universe third. If there was a god it would probably be best for everyone if he just ****ed off. You can't get over the fact that there's just as little evidence for nothing as there is for something so you're just throwing out the craziest sounding examples because hey, maybe I'll get overloaded by just how '****ing retarded' they are and make what I'm saying magically implode. I'm 'okay' with this statement: "There's a chance there's a god and he wants me to blow myself up near innocent people." Not this one: "I'm going to go blow myself up near innocent people."

You are defending beliefs that are ****ing retarded so that you don't have to admit your original argument was absurd (that it's all about faith). Come on bro, a religion that says you will get 72 virgins for blowing up infidels is ****ing retarded. Just as a religion that says God created the earth in 7 days is ****ing retarded.

As he said, the people he's talking about don't 'live their life' by the bible.

They are christians, therefore they believe by the bible.

Since you clearly prefer picking out Christianity in your "religion is retarded" statement, the Bible is a collection of many texts written by different authors. It is not really a single book. So yes, it includes things that are indeed factually wrong, but this does not reflect upon the content of other sections of the book. And once again, religion as a whole is not represented by the Bible. You are completely ignoring this simple fact.

I'm sure many ancient philosophers still revered today also believed the Earth was flat, as well, due to the lack of scientific knowledge. Do you also think that this should invalidate any of their teachings?

I don't prefer picking on religions, they are all ****ing retarded to me. There is that victim card again, I don't know where you got that idea.

Christianity as a whole is based on the bible. Right? That bible includes things that are totally factually wrong as you just said. So who gets to decide what is factionally correct and what isn't? You say all those stuff that turned out to be untrue (earth is flat) wasn't meant to be taken seriously. Then you turn around and say those things that can't be disproven (proving a negative) are true? It is not logical.

You say it's about morallity. What in the world does that even mean? I don't believe in a God, at the same time I have morals. And you are missing the point, I have no problem with people that think there might be some higher being out there. But I do have a problem with people that think there is a sky god that tells you where you can and can not stick your penis in because of some book written 2,000 years ago. Or because of that same book there is a sky god that watches your every move. All of this is also known as religion. Which is ****ing retarded.

 

[Sheepo]

You are defending beliefs that are ****ing retarded so that you don't have to admit your original argument was absurd (that it's all about faith). Come on bro, a religion that says you will get 72 virgins for blowing up infidels is ****ing retarded. Just as a religion that says God created the earth in 7 days is ****ing retarded.

There are ideas that can be scientifically disproven. Whether a god exists and whether or not he wants you to explode can't. Maybe if you say '****ing retarded' just one more time, it'll magically mean something.

They are christians, therefore they believe by the bible.

Every person who calls them self Christian is absolutely exactly the same and believes everything the bible says. Who are you kidding?

I don't prefer picking on religions, they are all ****ing retarded to me. There is that victim card again, I don't know where you got that idea.

Christianity as a whole is based on the bible. Right? That bible includes things that are totally factually wrong as you just said. So who gets to decide what is factionally correct and what isn't? You say all those stuff that turned out to be untrue (earth is flat) wasn't meant to be taken seriously. Then you turn around and say those things that can't be disproven (proving a negative) are true? It is not logical.

I think your problem is you seem to be unable to disconnect the idea of a person and a religion. If someone believes in Christian ideas they don't have to accept every little thing in the bible or the Catholic big book o' rules.
"There are intelligent people who pick and choose what they believe from the bible and other sources."
"Yeah, but do they call themselves Christian? Well Christianity is based off of the bible so like who is it that gets to pick out whatever they want from it and believe in that?"
We are. We're people. We have different views, different beliefs. There is not a bone in my body that cares about god but I'd be kidding myself if I thought there weren't some aspects of my life built around Christian principles. He didn't say the flat earth wasn't meant to be taken seriously. He said that they don't take it seriously. Because people can't be pigeonholed into your easily definable 'Christian' category. And I don't know what has you on the proving a negative thing? Sorry, you can't prove they're wrong and you can't prove you're right (weirdly, it works the other way too, perhaps a connection?). Get over it.

You say it's about morallity. What in the world does that even mean? I don't believe in a God, at the same time I have morals. And you are missing the point, I have no problem with people that think there might be some higher being out there. But I do have a problem with people that think there is a sky god that tells you where you can and can not stick your penis in because of some book written 2,000 years ago. Or because of that same book there is a sky god that watches your every move. All of this is also known as religion. Which is ****ing retarded.

This just in: Morality isn't a magical thing you get inoculated with when you're born. Without your parents, you'd have different morals. Without Christianity, many people would have different morals. No one is saying morals are dependent on religion or they have some sort of mystical copyright on it. Frankly, I don't think you have much of a point. Congratulations, you've graduated from "All Christians are the same" to "All religious people are the same." That's quite an absurd generalization, you should be very proud.

 

[Viperidae]

Erestheux and Sheepo are my new heroes.

 

[Tyguy]

But "religion" as an idea is not represented only by the extremists and fundamentalists. It is a sense of community, relationships, and moral code that are followed and respected by huge groups of people.

If you can't see the problem with the invocation of religious morality in a secular society you need to reexamine your argument. It worries me that "huge groups of people" need to reference the truculent teachings of the bible to discern right from wrong.

Nothing personal, but you don't strike me as someone who understands the arguments presented by most atheists.

 

[blackout]

how can it be a perversion of god's plan if that would imply the animals chose to be gay! so it cant be a perversion of god's plan because that would mean animals consciously went against god's plan. therefore it's not against god's plan therefore homosexuality is NOT a sin therefore I've just fixed christianity to accept gays and you'll all be open armed towards the gays from now on ..right? ....except no, despite the logic, HATERS ARE GONNA HATE





that sex is a sin under certain circumstances?

yeah might be a little late but.

A) yes you've proved your point and I've already said yes.

B) WTF?? I seriously cannot understand your logic. I think your just so obsessively anti-religious (how sad) that you'll cobble any random words together and try and make it make sense to hack away at religion.

 

[blackout]

So let me get this straight, blackout. You're a gay-hating christian who thinks homosexuality is a "perversion on god's will" (if there even is a god)?

there's a difference between gay hating and believing homosexuality is wrong.

sorry for the double post but I've got a lot to catch up on

oh and before this is mentioned again, atheists: God is no 'magical sky daddy' as some like to put it, no religion has ever taught that God is an invisible old man living in the sky as that total idiot george carlin seems to think.

 

[blackout]

Just as a religion that says God created the earth in 7 days is ****ing retarded.

why is there this^ stereotype that you have to take the bible literally to be a christian?

 

[Sheepo]

as that total idiot george carlin seems to think.

I'm on your side right now. Don't push your luck.

 

[blackout]

The point is it is clear you don't even know what it is you are defending. You believe something just because you were taught to believe that way. You don't know why, you don't fully understand it, but you are convinced of it no matter how much evidance exists to the contrary. Like Stephen Colbert you think with your gut and not with your head when it comes to this issue.

And to any religious people that got their panties in a bunch over my comment. If you want to have a serious discussion about your belief system then I will show you nothing but respect. The problem with you people is you are too scared to have such a discussion because we all know it's all total bullshit (you do too). You use excuses such as "well it will just turn in to a flamewar" or "you'll never convince me and I wont convince you" or "you guys are way too mean when it comes to religion" and other idiotic excuses not to have this discussion. And this, in my opinion, is ****ing retarded (no offense).

But by all means, prove me wrong.

and don't judge me! I know what I'm defending. and I wasn't brought up to believe this way, how would you know? my parents were agnostics/atheists.
I became christian when I was 13. just because you don't believe it doesn't mean that we who do believe 'think with our gut'. and I'm not scared about having this discussion, I'm happy to have a serious one, but when offensive/judgemental things are said, there will be anger.

Edit: thank you sheepo.

 

[Tyguy]

there's a difference between gay hating and believing homosexuality is wrong.

Yet those who hate homosexuals all seem to believe it's wrong. I wonder if there is any correlation. :|

no religion has ever taught that God is an invisible old man living in the sky

Because that would be ridiculous.

that total idiot george carlin seems to think.

You just made some enemies, boy...

 

[Yuri]

You say all those stuff that turned out to be untrue (earth is flat) wasn't meant to be taken seriously. Then you turn around and say those things that can't be disproven (proving a negative) are true? It is not logical.

I didn't say any of that, actually, I said that it was written in a time where they believed it was true and has since been disproven. I'm not sure what you are trying to say with the second sentence, are you thinking of Sheepo?

I have no problem with people that think there might be some higher being out there.

All I am saying is this: if you thought that, you wouldn't say "religion is retarded." What you would say is that extremist Christians that wish to deny basic human rights are retarded, which is totally true.

If you can't see the problem with the invocation of religious morality in a secular society you need to reexamine your argument. It worries me that "huge groups of people" need to reference the truculent teachings of the bible to discern right from wrong.

Nothing personal, but you don't strike me as someone who understands the arguments presented by most atheists.

There exist truculent, violent teachings in the Bible as you say. I'm not religious, so I can't defend on a specific level. Still, I know that the Bible, like other religious texts, also includes legitimate philosophies and morality. I have heard very powerful sermons and I understand that for some people, religion is a form of community and a code to base their personal beliefs and morals. Everyone learns right from wrong from someone in their community; some people look to religion. They might not literally interpret tales about sky wizards and minotaurs, but instead derive morals from metaphors.

What are these supposed arguments by atheists which I would not understand, and why didn't you mention them? So far I have seen people state two reasons that all religion is stupid:
-Scientific Inaccuracies (The Earth is flat)
-Truculent teachings (Murder gay people)

My point from the beginning is that this only represents some, awful or incorrect, aspects of religion. There exist people who derive personal enlightenment through religion while rejecting the malicious and ignorant aspects associated with it. Therefore, saying religion is retarded is intolerant and bigoted.

 

[blackout]

this^ also:

Yet those who hate homosexuals all seem to believe it's wrong. I wonder if there is any correlation. :|

well of course they would. but that doesn't mean people like me hate them.

Because that would be ridiculous.

what are you insinuating?

You just made some enemies, boy...

I hope I did. george carlin is a pillock.

 

[Sheepo]

You are aware he passed away right? This would almost be forgivable if you didn't know that. Almost.

 

[15357]

Wait, he's dead?

Oh god no.

 

[blackout]

lol.

actually come to think of it I did know that from a WBCast. you're right, what am I talking about?

well at least now he's been shown the error of his ways I'm sure.

 

[15357]

well at least now he's been shown the error of his ways I'm sure.

Ok, now, what?

 

[Sheepo]

And now I'm just going to stay out of this thread. PLEASE NOTE: Just because the one religious person on this forum is half retard, half asshole doesn't mean anything for the rest of them. Generalization = bad.

 

[blackout]

Ok, now, what?

http://www.rense.com/general69/obj.htm

the very manifestation of ignorance.

 

[MultiVaC]

I like how Sheepo and Erestheux make a valiant effort to emphasize that not all religious people are batshit insane and turn the debate in a slightly more respectful direction. And then a religious person comes in and acts completely batshit insane.

 

[blackout]

ok, maybe I'm overreacting, I'm sorry. I just hate all the judgemental anti-religious sentiment, and "religion is bullshit", and equating religious extremists with the everyday religious person.

 

[Polaris]

Something tells me that fundamentalist Christians have homosexual intercourse even more often...

 

[blackout]

may be true.

 

[15357]

http://www.rense.com/general69/obj.htm

the very manifestation of ignorance.

But explain how that has "shown him the error of his ways"...

 

[blackout]

he's dead.

 

[15357]

I don't understand you.


He wasn't shown the error of his ways, he was "deaded".

 

[Jintor]

Dying isn't 'being shown the error of your ways'. Dying is dying. Your attitude, Blackout, strikes me as very similar to the kind of person who says "It's alright for people not to believe in my religion, because they will all go to hell while I ascend to heaven".

 

[Yuri]

I like how Sheepo and Erestheux make a valiant effort to emphasize that not all religious people are batshit insane and turn the debate in a slightly more respectful direction. And then a religious person comes in and acts completely batshit insane.

sigh :|

 

[Eejit]

If a religious person can dismiss every possible god other than their own preference as fictional how can they not see that their own belief is just as false?

 

[blackout]

let me get something straight, not all religious people think that they believe in different Gods. for me there is just God and you either believe in him or not, there's no difference between Allah and Yahweh as far as I see it, there is a difference between God and what man says about God.

Dying isn't 'being shown the error of your ways'. Dying is dying. Your attitude, Blackout, strikes me as very similar to the kind of person who says "It's alright for people not to believe in my religion, because they will all go to hell while I ascend to heaven".

not necessarily people who don't follow my religion. people who spread lies and stereotypes and naivety and judgementalness without seeking forgiveness, like george carlin.

and I'm not happy about the fact that people choose to go to hell.

 

[Sheepo]

not necessarily people who don't follow my religion. people who spread lies and stereotypes and naivety and judgementalness.

I'd find some of your quotes in this thread that might make you look hypocritical for saying this, but frankly, I don't think it'd be worth the effort.

 

[Eejit]

let me get something straight, not all religious people think that they believe in different Gods. for me there is just God and you either believe in him or not, there's no difference between Allah and Yahweh as far as I see it, there is a difference between God and what man says about God.

It's the same principle. Replace "god" with "beliefs about god's nature" and it's just as relevant.

I conflate the two because I see no reason to differentiate between them.

 

[blackout]

I'd find some of your quotes in this thread that might make you look hypocritical for saying this, but frankly, I don't think it'd be worth the effort.

no, go on, I'm prepared to listen.

It's the same principle. Replace "god" with "beliefs about god's nature" and it's just as relevant.
I conflate the two because I see no reason to differentiate between them.

I'm confused as to what you mean?

 

[Jintor]

not necessarily people who don't follow my religion. people who spread lies and stereotypes and naivety and judgementalness without seeking forgiveness, like george carlin.

and I'm not happy about the fact that people choose to go to hell.

By definition people who don't follow your religion (I'll expand this term a little and just go for Abrahamic religions) are spreading lies and stereotypes and naivety and judgementalness, right? By refusing to accept God into their lives?

 

[blackout]

By definition people who don't follow your religion (I'll expand this term a little and just go for Abrahamic religions) are spreading lies and stereotypes and naivety and judgementalness, right? By refusing to accept God into their lives?

not necessarily. george carlin spread lies and naivety by stereotyping religion in general (e.g.

"think about it, religion has actually convinced people that ther is an invisible man!! living in the sky!!. . . etc"

) besides, there are non abrahamic religions who worship God e.g. Sikhism, Baha'i faith, Zoroastrianism, & Hinduism (yes, Hindus do believe in God, their other deities are aspects of the same thing.

 

[15357]

besides, there are non abrahamic religions who worship God e.g. Sikhism, Hinduism (yes, Hindus do believe in God, their other deities are aspects of the same thing.

I'm confused, then, how you can believe that your beliefs are truer than the others?

 

[Eejit]

I'm confused as to what you mean?

How can one person believe one thing about god while rejecting what millions of others believe? What makes him right (or at least closer to the 'truth') and them wrong? Why does he believe what he does and them what they do?

 

[blackout]

A person believes what they believe because of his or her experience of God. they're not necessarily wrong, just less aware of the truth.

I'm confused, then, how you can believe that your beliefs are truer than the others?

well, Christianity, As fas as my beliefs go, has the truest revelation of God because of our awareness that Jesus is the son of God and the Christ, like I said other religions are not wholly incorrect as far as I see it, they just have an incomplete revelation.