Why do you have faith?

[PortalStormzzzz]

no, I like to see how others react to new things I hear on the nets. If most people think it's crazy, I ask why. If they don't, I ask why. Debate, is it not?

 

[Stigmata]

If you're just doing it for your own enjoyment while everyone else is attempting to have serious discussions, then it ends up being a waste of everyone's time. I like the Politics section because intelligent debate occurs here, but if you're just saying random or crazy things to gauge our reactions, then that means less intelligent debate is occurring.

 

[Feath]

I like the Politics section because intelligent debate occurs here

Hahahahhahahaahhahahahahahahahhahahaahahhaa

*deep breath*

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahaha

Good one.

 

[PortalStormzzzz]

I endorse that statement.^

 

[Saturos]

I like the Politics section because intelligent debate occurs here, but if you're just saying random or crazy things to gauge our reactions, then that means less intelligent debate is occurring.

Since when has there ever been any intelligent discussions in the politics forum? I quit posting in politics for that reason. In fact, I feel dirty for even posting in politics now. This forum is like the lice-infected ghetto of HL2.net. I just had to get this one out though. It was too good an opportunity to pass up.

 

[Pesmerga]

I'm not even sure if I'm posting in the politics section. I just click on New Posts and spam.

 

[Saturos]

I'm not even sure if I'm posting in the politics section. I just click on New Posts and spam.

You must be the juggalo type who doesn't care what your about to see, or maybe you just don't give a shit. I kind of admire that. I have to know what I'm dealing with when posting myself.

 

[PortalStormzzzz]

isn't that like a troll? then everyone in this section is one, which doesn't change much actually.


anyhow, to get this back on topic after 5 pages of bitterly long shit, I have faith because I fell content in knowing that someone is helping me. It seems so thus far, but really all I can say is if I'm right, then good, if not, oh well it was worth it. I just don't imagine myself "ending" as an entity of conscience.

 

[Atomic_Piggy]

Wait, this is what you guys meant right? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Awakening

 

[Llama]

Llama. The old testament bible was followed more in the 1600s. As reform movements grew, people became distasteful to the corrupt and evil sounding messages, so they made their own faith and their own churches and abandoned the fear-mongering. The took the new testament more.

Sorry buddy, but then they arn't Christians. The new testament means jack all if it contradicts the old testament, which it does on several occasions.

 

[Avoidist]

Sorry buddy, but then they arn't Christians. The new testament means jack all if it contradicts the old testament, which it does on several occasions.

Perhaps they aren't Christians by strict definition, but they call themselves that anyway. The entire religion is so malleable and prone to multiple interpretations that such things are permissible (internally at least). For example, there is nowhere near a unanimous definition on the nature of God, it ranges from a non-interventionist ethereal creator at the start of time to a "man" (God's image thing) ruling on a cloud literally speaking to prophets and punishing the wicked.

To me that's a weakness of the religion itself, in that it lacks definition to the extent that nobody really knows what anyone's going on about until they quote scripture and use it to impose their beliefs on others, especially the young.

 

[Asknoone]

have you considered I may just be passing the time with conspiracy talk as sections of my half life movie are rendered? I don't mean alot of what i say, just want to see the reaction to new ideas.

That falls under the definition of trolling. Continue, and I'll ban you from this section. Or the site. Or maybe just limit your access to a new forum called "Moron", so we can all poke and laugh. I'm up for suggestions.

 

[Solaris]

Please, he ruins every thread he's in.

 

[Kyorisu]

no, I like to see how others react to new things I hear on the nets. If most people think it's crazy, I ask why. If they don't, I ask why. Debate, is it not?

You need to find a new hobby. May I suggest fishing? Or flower arranging?

I only mention it because it goes on the same logic of a person flying a plane into a building and bringing it down...

But have you seen it happen?

 

[theotherguy]

Sorry buddy, but then they arn't Christians. The new testament means jack all if it contradicts the old testament, which it does on several occasions.

No True Scotsman fallacy... :angel:

 

[.Wolf.]

just kill him.
kill him with fire.

 

[Kadayi]

nope...i wasn't talking about genetic engineering.

i was talking about uploading the mind. as in transferring the mind to a computer. which means everything then could be monitored and all connections in the mind will be know, documented and possibly controlled.

then we probably wont think like we do now. we will just see religion as something irrelevant to our existence. it's not necessarily that someone will cut our religious center off, but we will do it ourself since it wont present anything logical,explainable and will drain processing power.

The mind is not a separate entity from the body, the function of the body, or whatever influences the function of the body, it's part of an integrated evolved system. Sure on paper it might be considered 'the processor', but without the motherboard to control input/output and a power supply it's nothing. We've evolved over millions of years as a resultant of stimulus/response motivators, you really think we as a species are going to give that up? I can see the queues now of people going, 'sign me up so I live forever on a microchip, but never get blown again', get real. :dozey:

 

[Cole]

God was a way of explaining what we couldn't explain because some people were to stubborn to say "I have no fricken idea".

Then once we can finally explain something some people are still to stubborn to accept the fact that they were wrong.

 

[repiV]

The mind is not a separate entity from the body, the function of the body, or whatever influences the function of the body, it's part of an integrated evolved system. Sure on paper it might be considered 'the processor', but without the motherboard to control input/output and a power supply it's nothing. We've evolved over millions of years as a resultant of stimulus/response motivators, you really think we as a species are going to give that up? I can see the queues now of people going, 'sign me up so I live forever on a microchip, but never get blown again', get real. :dozey:

Still, I think it's inevitable that we will be able to separate the mind from the body - sooner or later. Whether that means swapping bodies, existing within a virtual reality or using a synthetic body for eg. military applications it's only a matter of time.
We can already harness brainwaves to control realistic prosthetic limbs as naturally as real ones - granted, they cost a million a piece, and haven't hit the mass market yet, but they exist.

 

[Llama]

No True Scotsman fallacy... :angel:

Sorry, I was under the impression you actually know what you're talking about. I must have been mistaken.

Don't try and act like a smartarse when it just makes you seem stupid. Read the damn bible for yourself.

 

[Kadayi]

Still, I think it's inevitable that we will be able to separate the mind from the body - sooner or later. Whether that means swapping bodies, existing within a virtual reality or using a synthetic body for eg. military applications it's only a matter of time.
We can already harness brainwaves to control realistic prosthetic limbs as naturally as real ones - granted, they cost a million a piece, and haven't hit the mass market yet, but they exist.

The human mind contains so much data that would be irrelevant to a machine life form existence that there is no sense in putting a mind into a machine, better to write the AI from the beginning. In all seriousness if you woke up tomorrow in an artificial body and couldn't touch or taste, just see & hear how long do you think it would be before you ended up terminated yourself? We as a species live for input, and without it we suffer. Sure we can compensate for a degree of sensual loss, but presently we aren't scientifically capable of creating devices that can provide as rich a range of sensual input as our bodies can.

 

[Sedako]

People have faith so they can have an excuse to be stupid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jZld8Zg1aA

Not saying everyone falls in this category, but going by that video, I fear for the future of our species.

 

[repiV]

The human mind contains so much data that would be irrelevant to a machine life form existence that there is no sense in putting a mind into a machine, better to write the AI from the beginning. In all seriousness if you woke up tomorrow in an artificial body and couldn't touch or taste, just see & hear how long do you think it would be before you ended up terminated yourself? We as a species live for input, and without it we suffer. Sure we can compensate for a degree of sensual loss, but presently we aren't scientifically capable of creating devices that can provide as rich a range of sensual input as our bodies can.

Presently we aren't - but these prosthetic limbs I mentioned do have a low resolution sense of touch.
There are many possible applications - if you could digitise your mind and swap bodies, you could theoretically live forever. Perhaps we would all have little implants with swappable chips that house our experiences and fuse with the brain.
Biotech companies could genetically engineer bodies - human or otherwise - that are suited to certain tasks. Would certainly have applications in space travel and military work, sports, dangerous or demanding activities...
Super-strong soldiers that don't need to eat or drink anywhere near as often as a normal human, have bullet-resistant bodies, the ability to ignore pain and to call up superhuman endurance or concentration when necessary?
Super-intelligent detectives with a genetically enhanced brain - perfect memory, ramped up intuition, the ability to make connections where others would not see anything?
Bodies that can survive in low gravity without the devastating after-effects we currently suffer would be a huge thing. Astronauts back from space often need to be carried off the shuttle, and need months of physiotherapy to be able to walk again. Not to mention the sickness and dysfunction that occurs while operating in those conditions. Space travel is really bad for you.

It would mean that the very nature of existence is something that we ourselves define.

 

[Kadayi]

I really wish MechaGodzilla was still around. I can't handle all this frustration.

Almost missed this one, but had to comment. Sorry Stigmata but that guy was an utter asshole and the forum is a much better place without him and his fundamentalist opinions. His anally retentive logical approach was beyond narrow minded, and his utter refusal to acknowledge context in discussions was frankly laughable. I've never encountered a more weaselly and duplicitous poster in my life and I'm glad he is gone. :dozey:

 

[Nemesis6]

yout0be.com/watch?v=5jZld8Zg1aA

IDOLATORS!!!!! :flame:

 

[repiV]

He's also very immature, nose-breakingly arrogant and a corrupt mod. My only regret is that some other poor bastards will have to put up with him instead...

He seemed to believe he was on a higher plane of existence than the rest of humanity.

 

[Orestes]

I am sorry to have to use this quote, but:

"To those that believe no explanation is necessary, to those that do not believe no explanation is possible." St Thomas Aquinas

Back me up if this is quoted wrong.

Belief is entirely voluntary. It will never be fully understood. There is just an urge to known the unknown...that which is greater than what we see and feel or what some call the 'supernatural'. Oh, You can google 'Catholicism Vatican'. There may be things to answer your question. Don't lose your inquisitive nature, it will only help you.

 

[Stigmata]

His anally retentive logical approach was beyond narrow minded

So you would have preferred if he had used emotional and ethical arguments instead of logical ones? Because ethical and emotional appeals are currently the reason why no actual productive debate goes on in this forum.

and his utter refusal to acknowledge context in discussions was frankly laughable.

All I ever saw was him ignoring context when the context was either flawed or irrelevant.

 

[Nemesis6]

Don't lose your inquisitive nature, it will only help you.

But going overboard is a one-way ticket to this guy:

 

[Orestes]

Childishness is not inquisitiveness.

 

[theotherguy]

I am sorry to have to use this quote, but:

"To those that believe no explanation is necessary, to those that do not believe no explanation is possible." St Thomas Aquinas

Back me up if this is quoted wrong.

Belief is entirely voluntary. It will never be fully understood. There is just an urge to known the unknown...that which is greater than what we see and feel or what some call the 'supernatural'. Oh, You can google 'Catholicism Vatican'. There may be things to answer your question. Don't lose your inquisitive nature, it will only help you.

I agree that people should be inquisitive and desire to learn more. They should understand the reasons behind their faith.

I believe if people thought critically about what they believed in, we wouldn't have such ridiculous beliefs floating around.

 

[Kadayi]

He seemed to believe he was on a higher plane of existence than the rest of humanity.

QFT. he made the mistake of assuming that just because he'd been fortunate enough to be made a mod that everything he uttered was made of gold. I know he wasn't that popular amongst his peers.

So you would have preferred if he had used emotional and ethical arguments instead of logical ones? Because ethical and emotional appeals are currently the reason why no actual productive debate goes on in this forum.

Not at all, I'm all for logical process, but only when it's tied to broader reason, not when it's used to deny it in an anally retentive manner ('it says this, therefore it must be so'). More often than not he who is not worth being named used it in the latter manner rather than the former, because his incendiary arguments fell down under proper scrutiny.

All I ever saw was him ignoring context when the context was either flawed or irrelevant.

Well not to put too fine a point on it Stig, if I recall correctly you've as much of a hard on for pointless religion bashing as he had, so I don't put much faith or value in your judgment calls regarding how 'upright' he was in his arguments. I'll quite happily dig up some choice slabs of denial of both pertinent and relevant context for you if you wish though. I've a good recollection of what happened when I dared to question his assertion that 'All Christians are obliged to kill non-Christians because God commands it' and witnessed the narrowness of his thinking as to how he concluded that. Even The Dawkins wouldn't use arguments that far fetched. Still feel free to continue to idolize a guy barely a year older than yourself, it matters not to me. :dozey:

 

[repiV]

QFT. he made the mistake of assuming that just because he'd been fortunate enough to be made a mod that everything he uttered was made of gold. I know he wasn't that popular amongst his peers.

I couldn't stand him even before he became a mod. He writes some conceited ****ing essay on every single subject, always laced with a holier than thou tone that just makes you want to strangle the son of a bitch.

Actually, I've just figured it out. He spent so much time dissing Christianity because he's actually the second coming of Christ, but he wanted to lull the world into complacency and then enslave it.

Having said that, I thought everyone else worshipped the ground he walks on. It's news to me that he was disliked by others.

 

[Saturos]

Not at all, I'm all for logical process, but only when it's tied to broader reason, not when it's used to deny it in an anally retentive manner ('it says this, therefore it must be so'). More often than not he who is not worth being named used it in the latter manner rather than the former, because his incendiary arguments fell down under proper scrutiny.

I agree here. While I never knew the guy, I can say that he sounded very ridged minded and was not open for debate. It's also true that the most influential minds were not even recognized until after their death. (i.e. Einstein, Picasso, Da Vinci, etc.) In fact, they were scorned for their findings and accomplishments during their lifetime. Just goes to show what fools people like MechaGodzilla are.:dozey: and frankly, it's this same narrow-mindedness that prevents each generation from benefitting from the fruits of each inventor's creations. We as humans will never achieve greatness as long as the existing generations are still alive becuase all we know how to do is argue, just like in this stupid thread. D'oh!

 

[CptStern]

I am sorry to have to use this quote, but:

"To those that believe no explanation is necessary, to those that do not believe no explanation is possible." St Thomas Aquinas

Back me up if this is quoted wrong.

Belief is entirely voluntary. It will never be fully understood. There is just an urge to known the unknown...that which is greater than what we see and feel or what some call the 'supernatural'.

I find religious people to be the exact opposite ..they have NO desire to seek the unknown except through the limits of their own faith ..if they truely sought answers they wouldnt limit themsselves to one ideology, one way of thinking, they'd take everything into account and judge accordingly ..religious people do not
I find the more inquisitive you are the less religious you are

 

[Solaris]

Mechagodzilla was the best thing that ever happened to politics.

 

[Tyguy]

I find religious people to be the exact opposite ..they have NO desire to seek the unknown except through the limits of their own faith ..if they truely sought answers they wouldnt limit themsselves to one ideology, one way of thinking, they'd take everything into account and judge accordingly ..religious people do not
I find the more inquisitive you are the less religious you are

Thats my main agenda with this thread, trying to understand the thought process and legitimacy behind such beliefs. I cant stand another "I dont know, i just believe" response. Think for yourself, you have the right!

 

[repiV]

Mechagodzilla was the best thing that ever happened to politics.

If you like petty, arrogant, self-absorbed boring ****s with a god complex, sure.