Free Health care

[The Monkey]

Yes, I know, there has been threads like this before. But I did not feel like dragging up an old thread, and besides, I want to make this from an international perspective, and not just from an american.

So, would you like free health care to all, to let the taxes pay for the care? Or would you prefer the american motto; every man for himself?

Personally, I do think that all health care should be 100% free, and if high taxes is required to pay it, then so be it! In Sweden most of the health care is free, although sometimes they add charges for transport etc. The very thought that your amount of money should decide the quality of your treatment is sickening to me.

Your thoughts?

 

[Bodacious]

The poll is slanted to a left wing bias.

There should be another option. Something along the lines of, "A welfare system should take care of the needy and ultimatly the system should encourage individuals to seek out means to provide for themselves instead of encouraging a perpetual welfare state."


I would love to have free health care. I would quit my job and do nothing all day, living on welfare checks or flipping burgers 20 some hours a week. Life would be sweet.

As far as america goes, expanding government in this manner is a bad thing, I think. It would encourage laziness and be one step closer to America being socialist.

 

[ALEXDJ]

i wounder, who is that one guy who thinks we should pay for the health

 

[ALEXDJ]

The poll is slanted to a left wing bias.

I would love to have free health care. I would quit my job and do nothing all day, living on welfare checks or flipping burgers 20 some hours a week. Life would be sweet.

It would encourage laziness and be one step closer to America being socialist.

why would you get a welfare check?

if health care is free, it doesn't mean that you will get a check.

start making sence

 

[Bodacious]

i wounder, who is that one guy who thinks we should pay for the health

I did. People pay for their own healthcare in America every day, how am I wrong? It has been that way for hundreds of years.

 

[Bodacious]

why would you get a welfare check?

if health care is free, it doesn't mean that you will get a check.

start making sence

No crap I wouldn't get a check for healthcare. I would get a welfare check if I quit my job and didn't do anything productive all day long.

Start thinking and I bet what I say will start making sense.

 

[^Ben]

Just a quick Q for the Americans, how much do you pay for your health care?

And do you have to pay everytime you visit a doctor?

Personally I think all health care should be free and it will not encourage laziness.

 

[ALEXDJ]

I did. People pay for their own healthcare in America every day, how am I wrong? It has been that way for hundreds of years.

you are not wrong, yes people have been paying for their healthcare in America for a long time, but outside of US, in most places, gov. has been paying for the health care with tax money.

wouldn't you like the same in US, where you don't have to drop couple thousands when u break a finger

personally, i think, US health care is in horrible shape, doctors are greedy drug sellers, insurence companies are way out of line

 

[ALEXDJ]

Just a quick Q for the Americans, how much do you pay for your health care?

And do you have to pay everytime you visit a doctor?

Personally I think all health care should be free and it will not encourage laziness.

yes, you pay for every single thing

 

[ALEXDJ]

No crap I wouldn't get a check for healthcare. I would get a welfare check if I quit my job and didn't do anything productive all day long.

Start thinking and I bet what I say will start making sense.

ok, but what does that have to do with health care, you can get a check right now, we don't have to change anyting for that

 

[The Monkey]

I think that the welfare in Sweden is about $1700 /month. You can live with that, but not more. You can only buy what you need, and nothing more. Nobody wants to life of social allowance, so they really want a job.
Bodacious: Do you think it's right that rich people get a better treatment that poor people?

 

[The Mullinator]

Free health-care does not lead to a welfare state at all. You still need to get a home, get food, pay taxes, etc. Living off of welfare will not give you enough money to be happy at all. Almost everyone on welfare wants to have a proper job.

At least thats how it is in Canada with free health care. Even the rich like the idea of free health care up here, the only reason they also want a private system is because the free health care right has become quite slow and in need of restructuring.

 

[gh0st]

I think that the welfare in Sweden is about $1700 /month. You can live with that, but not more. You can only buy what you need, and nothing more. Nobody wants to life of social allowance, so they really want a job.
Bodacious: Do you think it's right that rich people get a better treatment that poor people?

1700 DOLLARS A MONTH?! Jesus. Thats what you get for you super high taxes. Thing is, I'm happy with what we have in America. I dont have to wait six months for basic medical help, and my employer pays most of my medical fees. The rest I work off myself, because I'm not a slacker lazy leech piece of crap.

 

[^Ben]

How much is it?

I think the problem with the American system in place at the moment is(i've seen this with my own eyes) someone gets something small wrong with them, and is reluctant to-go to the doctor because of costs etc, and it ends up getting much worse.

Now where I live UK, I had to get a quick checkup, so I popped into a General Practice(dunno what you call them in the US, it's like a local mini hospital for general stuff) on thursday booked an appointment for monday because my normal doctor was on holiday, I come in on monday wait for 5 minutes and only need about 5 minutes of the doctors time.

This possibly has prevented much worse implications down the road that I might not have gone to get checked out if I would of had to pay.

And I don't suddenly get the urge to live off social because of that.

gh0st theres a reason why Sweeden is like the second best place in the world to live standard of living wise.

 

[Bodacious]

Just a quick Q for the Americans, how much do you pay for your health care?

And do you have to pay everytime you visit a doctor?

Personally I think all health care should be free and it will not encourage laziness.

Depends on your deductable and your health care providor. If I made a doctors appointment I might pay $40. I split my thumb open and the hospital would have charged me $500 but I paid $130 i think it was.

I don't pay anything for my insurance, my employer does.

 

[gh0st]

gh0st theres a reason why Sweeden is like the second best place in the world to live standard of living wise.

Yeah theres a lot of reasons for that. Part of it is your definition of best. I dont want half my paycheck going to the government. Enough goes to them already. The standard of living in America is as good as you want it to be, its not handed to you as a result of someone elses work. The socialist scandinavian utopias arent all they are cracked up to be.

Edit: It costs me 10 dollars for a doctors visit, the rest is covered by my boss. Specialist operations or whatever would be partially covered by me, my boss, and the government.

 

[^Ben]

So your employer paid the $130?

 

[Bodacious]

you are not wrong, yes people have been paying for their healthcare in America for a long time, but outside of US, in most places, gov. has been paying for the health care with tax money.

wouldn't you like the same in US, where you don't have to drop couple thousands when u break a finger

I didn't and wouldn't. I dropped $130. No big deal, I received quality healthcare and din't have to wait long at all.

 

[^Ben]

What if someone can't pay the $130 for some reason?

 

[Bodacious]

ok, but what does that have to do with health care, you can get a check right now, we don't have to change anyting for that

If I had free healthcare I could quit my job and not have to worry. yah I wouldn't have the finer things, but i would get by and at most only work 20 hours a week.

As it stands, healthcare isn't free, so I work more than 20 hours week and don't qualify for food stamps.

 

[Bodacious]

I think that the welfare in Sweden is about $1700 /month. You can live with that, but not more. You can only buy what you need, and nothing more. Nobody wants to life of social allowance, so they really want a job.
Bodacious: Do you think it's right that rich people get a better treatment that poor people?

Rich people didn't wake up in the lap of luxury. They or their ancestors got there by hard work and determination. I think they should keep the money they earn and whatever else comes along with it.

Preferential treatment doesn't bother me.

 

[^Ben]

I think that's a daft way of thinking about it, "I can get free health care, i'm gonna quit my job"

The UK has a free health care system and has 1 of the lowest unemployment % in Europe, and please correct me if im wrong, it's close to America?

 

[Bodacious]

Free health-care does not lead to a welfare state at all. You still need to get a home, get food, pay taxes, etc. Living off of welfare will not give you enough money to be happy at all. Almost everyone on welfare wants to have a proper job.

Home = HUD, state provided housing
Food = Food stamps
Taxes = No income means no taxes and the lowest brackets actually get paid.

At least thats how it is in Canada with free health care. Even the rich like the idea of free health care up here, the only reason they also want a private system is because the free health care right has become quite slow and in need of restructuring.

That is a big reason for not having it here.

 

[CptStern]

55 million americans without healthcare would disagree with you

 

[Bodacious]

So your employer paid the $130?

No, I did, it was my portion of the bill to pay.

What if someone can't pay the $130 for some reason?

You call your providor and work out a payment plan.

In my wife's case she had 13k in bills when she got sick and the state paid all of it because she was jobless.

I think that's a daft way of thinking about it, "I can get free health care, i'm gonna quit my job"

The UK has a free health care system and has 1 of the lowest unemployment % in Europe, and please correct me if im wrong, it's close to America?

People have different needs. If I so desired I could get by with as little effort as possible and free healthcare would make it that much easier. It is just a matter of how much you desire to have in life.

More welfare encourages laziness like passing out condoms encourages promescuity. It is a big grey area that is very controversial.

 

[Bodacious]

55 million americans without healthcare would disagree with you

Another one of your "facts" ?

 

[The Monkey]

Yeah theres a lot of reasons for that. Part of it is your definition of best. I dont want half my paycheck going to the government. Enough goes to them already. The standard of living in America is as good as you want it to be, its not handed to you as a result of someone elses work. The socialist scandinavian utopias arent all they are cracked up to be.

If you got a good idea in the US, you really can do something with it. Sure, you can do that in Sweden too, but the politicians here want to lay all the responcebility on employers. I think that an employer with many employed pays 60% tax. What I'm trying to say is that you get things more easily done in the US, but but doing that you also have to sacrifice things in education, health care etc.

Just a question; how much parental leave do you got in the US? Here we got 1½ years after the baby was born, with 80% of salary paid.

 

[The Mullinator]

Home = HUD, state provided housing
Food = Food stamps
Taxes = No income means no taxes and the lowest brackets actually get paid.

Yet they still want an actual job. Very few people are happy living with the bear-minimum.

That is a big reason for not having it here.

Because our current system has grown flawed and in need of restructuring? Free health care is not naturally slower than private you know. Like I said, all Canada needs is for it to be restructured.

 

[CptStern]

Another one of your "facts" ?

well admittedly I misconstrued the numbers (took it from memory) ..it's actually 44 million and another 30 million that are "under-insured" ...more than a third of the population ..the 55 million figure is what is expected by the end of the decade

source


oh btw people living under the poverty line: 35.9 million


btw I found this interesting:

"Lack of Insurance Among Non-Poor is Rising More Rapidly Than Among Poor"

 

[willyd]

I think basic care should be free, but I don't want to have to pay for all the obese people who choose to be obese (not saying ones who eat normally but just have something wrong) clogging up the system, or the cigarette smokers. But if a poor person has made an effort to keep his or her health, they should be cared to.


edit: actually the best idea is to give all the americans fake canadian IDs (yes from the chapelle show)

 

[jondy]

The socialist scandinavian utopias arent all they are cracked up to be.

How the hell would you know?

 

[gh0st]

How the hell would you know?

How the hell do you know what healthcare is like in the US? I can read and draw conclusoins myself, I dont have to live somewhere to understand that countries problems. Thats like saying I shouldnt study history since I wasent there.

 

[Gray Fox]

Why haven't you voted Ghost?

 

[gh0st]

Why haven't you voted Ghost?

I knew I forgot something :rolling:

 

[jondy]

How the hell do you know what healthcare is like in the US? I can read and draw conclusoins myself, I dont have to live somewhere to understand that countries problems. Thats like saying I shouldnt study history since I wasent there.

Your answer didn't sound particularly well-informed is all. Hence the smiley. > And slow down typing, it's worth its weight in legibility.

 

[gh0st]

Your answer didn't sound particularly well-informed is all. Hence the smiley. > And slow down typing, it's worth its weight in legibility.

Words I spelled incorrectly: 1
Typos made: 1

If you couldnt understand what I wrote because of that one typo, then you seriously should just kill yourself. Anything else you'd like to bitch about? By all means point out the grievous error of my ill-informed comment, I'd be happy to discuss it with you.

 

[jondy]

Seriously, gh0st, this isn't a pissing contest, we're both reasonable blokes - quit with the flaming. Seeing as your last post had nothing to do with the thread, I'll leave it at that.

 

[gh0st]

Seriously, gh0st, this isn't a pissing contest, we're both reasonable blokes - quit with the flaming. Seeing as your last post had nothing to do with the thread, I'll leave it at that.

Your answer didn't sound particularly well-informed is all. Hence the smiley. > And slow down typing, it's worth its weight in legibility.

Tell me please, how this personal insult against 1) my knowledge, and 2) my legibility, relate to this threads topic? I'm eager to know. You're just bitter than you've been caught in a rediculous statement and cant weasel your way out of it.

 

[^Ben]

Take a time out guys, your getting well too "into this" and it's gonna derail the whole thread, and has basically become the bane of the whole politics forum.

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

People who can take care of themselves should do so, simple as that. No nanny states or robbing Peter to pay Paul.