Half Life 2 multiplayer - Was it always CSS?

[Edcrab]

Heh... bit of a lose/lose situation for Valve here.

Either Gabe made something up on the spur of the moment or Cliffe was inaccurate in his schedule. Only one of them is right, unless you subscribe to the "dropped MP" theory that's being considered.

 

[Logic]

logic, we've all given valve the benefit of the doubt at one time or another. but after all that has happened, they don't deserve it anymore.

That's a pretty tough call, without knowing what goes on at Valve, none of us can actually know what they 'deserve'.. we don't know just how much they pulled their hair out trying to make everything go smoothly.. we don't know how many sleepless nights they had trying to make unrealistic deadlines.. sure, they've made mistakes, but the very nature of mistakes is that they are not intended, nor are they malicious. I think a lot of people here are too quick to judge Valve based on what little information is available, and a lot of harsh assumptions.

 

[Edcrab]

Whatever, but you have to admit the forums wouldn't be so interesting if people didn't vent their spleen so often. If everyone was a calm, collected individual who always maintained a neutral stance and never forwarded ideas or downright speculation, we'd have nothing to talk about.

Logic: Let's be nice. Don't assume things, every theory is equally viable.
Ed: 'k
imaelephant: 'k.
*thread dies*

It's far better when everyone desperately tries to thrust their opinions on the masses; makes for better discussion and analysis of what little information we do possess.

Hmm, I noticed that the thread title has been edited. A lot less extreme now- should stop instant flaming, at least.

 

[bam23]

I remember they said they were going to ship versions of HL2 that included singleplayer only, multiplayer only, or both.

 

[tokin]

In an interview at 10/01/03 Gabe (developer interview 2) said he plays Half Life 2's mulitplayer daily and its something unique and really cool.

The delay comes and goes and then in an interview after CSS was announced (the infamous video with Cliffe talking with clips of italy and the table being pushed in the door way) Cliffe states they started work on CSS around February.

Last monthish we found out that Half Life 2 does not have a multiplayer.

Thus how can Gabe have played something daily that doesnt exist?

It'd be nice if a valve employee clarified this for us and explained!

 

[Edcrab]

I don't recall a MP only pack ever being made available- just SP only, or SP with MP. Recently, the SP only release plan was scrapped; it's now either basic retail or the Collector's edition.

tokin- that's precisely the position so many of us have brought to the fore.

It's all very well to condemn speculation and assumption, but without cold hard facts that's inevitable and, more to the point, understandable.

 

[The Mullinator]

It'd be nice if a valve employee clarified this for us and explained!

It probably will be clarified once the book is released. Very few video game companies reveal anything about design decisions and changes until after the game is released.

Heck, Nintendo is arguably more secretive than Valve.

 

[Logic]

Whatever, but you have to admit the forums wouldn't be so interesting if people didn't vent their spleen so often. If everyone was a calm, collected individual who always maintained a neutral stance and never forwarded ideas or downright speculation, we'd have nothing to talk about.

Logic: Let's be nice. Don't assume things, every theory is equally viable.
Ed: 'k
imaelephant: 'k.
*thread dies*

It's far better when everyone desperately tries to thrust their opinions on the masses; makes for better discussion and analysis of what little information we do possess.

I'd never try to stop anyone putting ideas forward, or speculating.. both of those things are extremely valuable, and neccessary. I'll always promote open mindedness, though. Ignorance may make for some interesting forum reading at times, but it's the biggest problem in the world today, and I'll never support anyone for demonstrating it. Consequently, not getting through to ignorant people is extremely frustrating.

 

[poseyjmac]

That's a pretty tough call, without knowing what goes on at Valve, none of us can actually know what they 'deserve'.. we don't know just how much they pulled their hair out trying to make everything go smoothly.. we don't know how many sleepless nights they had trying to make unrealistic deadlines.. sure, they've made mistakes, but the very nature of mistakes is that they are not intended, nor are they malicious. I think a lot of people here are too quick to judge Valve based on what little information is available, and a lot of harsh assumptions.

personally i never stated valve had any malicious intent, thats absurd. it really doesn't matter if they were close or far away to their mark thoguh. although its proven that they were nowhere near completion on sep 30th. the point is, they were off the mark, and many times more than 1, which is why they don't deserve our trust.

you know, its possible to be a fan of valve and halflife, and still not be content with and blind of valve's shortcomings, contrary to what you might think.

 

[hero]

Yeah the Manipulator would be a nightmare for the server. Physics demand alot from the server when moved around to much, which is why we get the repelling effect on physics in CS:S. Can you imagine the lag caused by 10+ players with a Manipulator push/dragging crap around the map.

well i dont see what would be that big of a deal with the manipulator in hl2dm compared to a map that i was playing on css. i wont say the name but it was this long street with like 40 cars placed on it, and the admin turned up the physics REALLY high so that if u shot a car once it would go flying across the map. now imagine about 25 guys shooting cars at eachother across the map trying to smash eachother. and you know what was the best part?

ABSOLUTELY NO LAGGGGGGDGHOGDUGG!

if their was no lag in this situation im sure it would be easy shmeazy to have no lag with about 40 guys with manipulators.

therefore
the manipulator would not be the problem in a hl2dm game

 

[The Mullinator]

personally i never stated valve had any malicious intent, thats absurd. it really doesn't matter if they were close or far away to their mark thoguh. although its proven that they were nowhere near completion on sep 30th. the point is, they were off the mark, and many times more than 1, which is why they don't deserve our trust.

you know, its possible to be a fan of valve and halflife, and still not be content with and blind of valve's shortcomings, contrary to what you might think.

The only thing I can agree with you on is the September 30th release. Everything else they have done are mistakes that all game development companies commonly make. If you throw out trust for Valve on those issues then I don't see how you could possibly trust any other software development company ever.

 

[Edcrab]

For the record, that post was meant to be taken semi-jokingly, just in case someone reads it and thinks otherwise...

The thing is, ignorance, stubborness and steadfast belief in an opinion are near-indistinguishable, or one and the same. Let's face it, to the casual reader you are saying "every theory is equally viable", and despite everyone's best efforts people just don't change their stance regardless of what facts/theories are brought up. I'm just saying that, as awful a problem as "ignorance" is, it's probably not best for an online discussion forum about a popular in-development game for posters to concentrate on fairness and recognition of alternate possibilities.

That said, there's no chance of any clarification before the release of the RTB book- so, arguably, we'll all just keep touching on the same points until it arrives. And then people will label it a pack of lies and we'll discuss that instead.

 

[poseyjmac]

The only thing I can agree with you on is the September 30th release. Everything else they have done are mistakes that all game development companies commonly make. If you throw out trust for Valve on those issues then I don't see how you could possibly trust any other software development company ever.

exactly! nowadays im not even trusting screenshots 100%, because cool things can be taken out down the road. weve seen games early in development that look much better than the finished product. thankfully its been the opposite for hl2.

 

[Logic]

you know, its possible to be a fan of valve and halflife, and still not be content with and blind of valve's shortcomings, contrary to what you might think.

I'm quite aware of that, I'm not blind to Valve's failings, nor am I overjoyed by them. My understanding of morality, though, is that one's intentions determine one's guilt, and therefore if Valve have acted without malice, they are no less deserving of our support, or at least acceptance.

 

[Logic]

For the record, that post was meant to be taken semi-jokingly, just in case someone reads it and thinks otherwise...

The thing is, ignorance, stubborness and steadfast belief in an opinion are near-indistinguishable, or one and the same. Let's face it, to the casual reader you are saying "every theory is equally viable", and despite everyone's best efforts people just don't change their stance regardless of what facts/theories are brought up. I'm just saying that, as awful a problem as "ignorance" is, it's probably not best for an online discussion forum about a popular in-development game for posters to concentrate on fairness and recognition of alternate possibilities.

That said, there's no chance of any clarification before the release of the RTB book- so, arguably, we'll all just keep touching on the same points until it arrives. And then people will label it a pack of lies and we'll discuss that instead.

I'm aware of the futility in asking people on an internet forum to be reasonable That won't stop me from trying, though. Someone's gotta do it

 

[Edcrab]

Fair enough- it's commendable to strive to make all forums fair places of enlightened, topical examination. It's just impossible

I've always considered myself a Valve fanboy, and I refuse to consider that an insult when it's used against me. It's no slur in my eyes; I've always believed that HL2 would be better than Doom III or Far Cry, even when none of those games were out. Same goes for Stalker and Halo 2, neither of which I've experienced first hand.

Criticising a developer's decisions and ridiculing them/hating them for their mistakes is about as constructive as a demolition ball swinging towards a national treasure, but I still admit to being a little amazed by the events of September 30th.

 

[wonkers]

What's this about? Who really reads long posts anyway? Your just a bunch of geeks who love the sound of your own thoughts typed out.

Multiplayer this Biotches ----------> <--------------

 

[Logic]

Criticising a developer's decisions and ridiculing them/hating them for their mistakes is about as constructive as a demolition ball swinging towards a national treasure, but I still admit to being a little amazed by the events of September 30th.

I was quite disapointed myself when it was delayed.. but I was glad, in a way. I wanted more than anything for the sequel to my favorite game to live up to it's predecessor, to blow me away like the first one did. The delay hinted that Valve would do what was neccessary to make that happen, even if it meant developing long past projected release dates. I'm very grateful that they didn't cave to publisher pressure and rush the game out.

 

[ViolenceJack]

Maybe Gabe was just playing TF2, maybe valve consider it HL2 multiplayer because they hope its out close to HL2, it may even contain HL2 elements. I think there is some rumours about where TF2 may be based in HL2 universe.

Also what happened to that suprises or somin, there was even the poll on these forums about it and the majority went for HL2 MP announced and then i think TF2 was after that. Either we still aint heard it or it wasnt that big and i missed it. I thought we were gonner find out about the time the reviews came out and if the suprises was the review scores that was a pretty weak suprise. Most people thought HL2 was gonner be good and the reviews just reasured them.

The way MP is atm, unless TF2 is not too far away, seems very cheap. I mean leaving up to the community, can you get any more cheap than that and also these Source ports. The main reason for doing these was too see and show how easy it is to port your current HL mod over to Source. Valve using that to try get everyone to move over to HL2/Source and then continue on with there work from there. I mean you could port to source with current HL based maps and models and still play with the benefits of physics etc. You can then expand from there with bigger, better maps, models and gameplay.

I thought at E3 Valve said that the source ports and everything would be stand alone as well, as in you buy them seperate including CS:S. Wasnt there also abit of confusing with this as well, people thinking it was with the game but then it wasnt, some news sites also said that it wasnt with the game. Although later on some one said it was.

This SDK MP sample as well. I take it it will have like weapons on it or it will take like 5 secs to put em on and then like a map. Hell you have your bloody DM, just slam on a few more maps. Why wouldnt have valve done that to make so many people happy.

Why doesnt some one send an email or why doesnt everyone send one, at least one has to get a reply unless there still hiding somthing. Someone could have gave the question in an interview instead of asking the same crap everyone knows. Mainly so they can say, look we got a valve interview

 

[Bastion]

fine someone make a poll and lets see what the community wants.

#1] Im mad there is no HL2 MP [dm , tdm , ctf , cthc<capture the head crab ]

#2] Im happy with no HL2 MP.

#3] I could careless couse Valve is so cool ill do what they tell me.

#4] I wonna pay for a book to tell me why they didnt make a HL2 MP.

 

[poseyjmac]

the ones that don't care about hl2 having its own MP are just not as big of fans of halflife2 as those who do. true hl2 fans want more of hl2.

 

[tokin]

the ones that don't care about hl2 having its own MP are just not as big of fans of halflife2 as those who do. true hl2 fans want more of hl2.

Or they are counter strike junkies and their lives revovle enitrelly around cs, and only purchasing HL2 for it. Of course it would be all of the young kids too..10-16. Lombardi did sound a little clueless about TF2 saying stuff like yeah we will announce more after HL2 is released and will continue work on it. I mean i hope TF2 isnt to far away, months ago gabe said it was in finishing stages. Although, working to convert CS:S, DOD:S, TFC:S?, HL2, plus all of their other problems lately, how in the hell could of they made time for TF2...i bet it's been IDLE for a very long time.

 

[Soundwave]

lol, I don't see you giving any answers. Now tell me, since you seem to be all knowing about how "evil" Valve is then you tell me why Valve dropped it. Go ahead, you tell me the reasoning you have for why Valve dropped the multiplayer.

I never said Valve was evil, and I never said they dropped it. I personally think Gabe didn't want to say "well we don't have an MP working yet..." so he threw something out.

Also I find it funny that certain people here are calling ME stupid, considering I'm one of the few people here that doesn't blindly asskiss Valve at every given opportunity. I don't hate Valve, I don't hate Gabe, I don't think they are evil, they are like any other company, AND THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT. They do the same shit any company does, and a lot of people here do not like that to be pointed out.

 

[Dr. Freeman]

i think the one point that has been made on most pages of this thread and ironically gets overlooked is the one about Gabe's comments on HL2's MP.. in his own words as "unique" and "i play it daily"

i think what upsets those who wanted a HL2 themed MP the most is that word "unique" because truthfully... there isn't too much uniqueness to CS:Source.. and while Gabe & company "playing it daily" wasn't their aim.. well someone can correct me on this

some pple feel they were played as fools with that "unique" comment and thats part of why pple are still upset.. at least thats my take on it.

 

[tokin]

Well if it wasn't CS, it could possible be TF2. That doesnt necessarily mean it's coming with HL2, but possibly not long after. I still think there are a few suprises valve will bring us in the next month. I'm quite curious as to if they are a really awesome company and will suprise us with something really innovative and fun. I mean wouldn't that be cool if they hid stuff the entire time? We will wait and see. Don't flame me, thanks have a nice day.

 

[iamaelephant]

I have actually played the leak, and I did see the counter-strike port. Once again, it proves nothing. Assuming Valve were the ones to port it, how do you know they actually had plans to revamp it at that point? You are ASSUMING that is the case. You're demonstrating exactly the kind of ignorance my post is all about.

So at a time (pre-September 30) when Valve must have been working franticly to meet an impossible date, they still had time to play around experimenting with third party mods without the slightest intention of using it? You are the ignorant one here. You are so busy defending Valve you can't see the obvious lies a bullshit they are feeding us.

 

[Logic]

the ones that don't care about hl2 having its own MP are just not as big of fans of halflife2 as those who do. true hl2 fans want more of hl2.

I have to say, I strongly disagree. I'm as big a fan of HL as you could possibly get... I love the Half-Life universe, and the events that take place within it... the thing is, in HLDM (or HL2DM if there was one)... so you've got a few scientists, some grunts, the G-man, two or three Gordons, all running around shooting each other... now how exactly does that fit in with the HL universe? Is it consistant with the game's storyline? Does it add anything to the universe at all? Should it even be physically possible to have more than one of the same person in the same room, blowing each other to bits? No. HLDM is a bit of fun on the side, a diversion. It's not what made Half-Life great, nor does it fit into any part of the Half-Life universe's timeline. I actually dislike HLDM for those reasons.. I want to be immersed in the world, not reminded constantly that I'm just playing a game by the fact that two Gordons just fragged me with a rocket launcher. You can say that makes me less of a fan than you, but I will always disagree. Personally, I'm glad that Valve's multiplayer component\s all exist in their own plausable worlds. (CS and DOD, and eventually TF2 for example). I guess Valve feel the same way.

 

[Logic]

So at a time (pre-September 30) when Valve must have been working franticly to meet an impossible date, they still had time to play around experimenting with third party mods without the slightest intention of using it? You are the ignorant one here. You are so busy defending Valve you can't see the obvious lies a bullshit they are feeding us.

I'm not blindly defending Valve. I'm not telling you to love Valve and want to have their babies. I'm simply asking you to be OPEN MINDED and consider all the possibilities.

Valve were working on the game how long... over five years? During that time, while they were developing the source engine, they would have had to test the netcode out with something, right? For all we know, the CS port that was found in the leak was done by Valve back in 2000 to test the netcode, and not touched until very recently. Edit: (toned down flamey comment) You're being very narrow minded and one sided about this whole thing, you have no justification for calling me ignorant.

 

[koopa]

Lombardi did sound a little clueless about TF2 saying stuff like yeah we will announce more after HL2 is released and will continue work on it. I mean i hope TF2 isnt to far away, months ago gabe said it was in finishing stages. Although, working to convert CS:S, DOD:S, TFC:S?, HL2, plus all of their other problems lately, how in the hell could of they made time for TF2...i bet it's been IDLE for a very long time.

Lombardi sounds a little clueless all the time to me. I bet he hasn't played HL1 for more than about 10 minutes, let alone HL2.

I have two thoughts on the TF2 thing you mention. First is that they've had... what, 6 years? I think that's a hell of a long time to develop just one game. Admittedly I don't know when they started. CS:S/DOD:S/HL:S are little more than artist time at the moment, all quick ports. The second is that I'm not sure I even believe they're working on TF2 - they've been claiming that for years now and no-one has seen a damn thing. They're flat out liars on TF2. Plus TF2 on its own would probably look pretty dated after BF1942/UT2004 ONS/etc stole its thunder.

 

[Logic]

The second is that I'm not sure I even believe they're working on TF2 - they've been claiming that for years now and no-one has seen a damn thing. They're flat out liars on TF2.

One moment you say you're "not sure" you believe they're working on it... next minute you proclaim that they are flat out liars about it, simply because they haven't shown us anything. Not very sound reasoning.

 

[poseyjmac]

I have to say, I strongly disagree. I'm as big a fan of HL as you could possibly get... I love the Half-Life universe, and the events that take place within it... the thing is, in HLDM (or HL2DM if there was one)... so you've got a few scientists, some grunts, the G-man, two or three Gordons, all running around shooting each other... now how exactly does that fit in with the HL universe? Is it consistant with the game's storyline? Does it add anything to the universe at all? Should it even be physically possible to have more than one of the same person in the same room, blowing each other to bits? No. HLDM is a bit of fun on the side, a diversion. It's not what made Half-Life great, nor does it fit into any part of the Half-Life universe's timeline. I actually dislike HLDM for those reasons.. I want to be immersed in the world, not reminded constantly that I'm just playing a game by the fact that two Gordons just fragged me with a rocket launcher. You can say that makes me less of a fan than you, but I will always disagree. Personally, I'm glad that Valve's multiplayer component\s all exist in their own plausable worlds. (CS and DOD, and eventually TF2 for example). I guess Valve feel the same way.

i knew you were going to say something to this effect. just been waiting to paste this:

notice that im not talking about HL or HLDM. notice that its not implied anywhere that if hl2 had its themed MP that it would be just like HLDM.

now in my statement i didn't say: true HL2 fans would want a DM mode like HLDM for hl2, BUT i said true hl2 fans would want more of hl2. the problem with you and others is your scope is too small, you're not thinking creatively enough. stop assuming that if hl2mp existed that all it would be was vanilla deathmatch.

if you don't want more of hl2 in a unique and fun themed MP component, you really aren't much of a fan. period. thats what great about that statement, there is no hl2mp in existence, so i can assume that it could have been the next best thing since sliced bread. my statement stands.

the ones that don't care about hl2 having its own MP are just not as big of fans of halflife2 as those who do. true hl2 fans want more of hl2.

 

[koopa]

One moment you say you're "not sure" you believe they're working on it... next minute you proclaim that they are flat out liars about it, simply because they haven't shown us anything. Not very sound reasoning.

Incorrect. I'm "not sure" I believe they're working on it. I do believe they've flat out lied in the past about how and when they're working on it, because it's been promised about a gajillion times.. 'TF2? Yeah...uhh...Robin's working on that, it'll be out in 6 months!'. Those are not inconsistent positions.

Having said that, it could be out next week and then I'll look like a chump

BTW:

BUT i said true hl2 fans would want more of hl2

If I offered you 30 awful HL2 levels or 20 great ones, which would you take? I'd love HL2M but I can understand Logic's position.

 

[Logic]

i knew you were going to say something to this effect. just been waiting to paste this:

notice that im not talking about HL or HLDM. notice that its not implied anywhere that if hl2 had its themed MP that it would be just like HLDM.

now in my statement i didn't say: true HL2 fans would want a DM mode like HLDM for hl2, BUT i said true hl2 fans would want more of hl2. the problem with you and others is your scope is too small, you're not thinking creatively enough. stop assuming that if hl2mp existed that all it would be was vanilla deathmatch.

if you don't want more of hl2 in a unique and fun themed MP component, you really aren't much of a fan. period. thats what great about that statement, there is no hl2mp in existence, so i can assume that it could have been the next best thing since sliced bread. my statement stands.

I dislike the way you are happy to renounce someone from being a fan, if they aren't into multiplayer. What if someone doesn't have the internet, or doesn't play well enough to enjoy online play? Are they allowed to be a fan? Otherwise, though, I agree with some of what you've said, and I'll admit to limiting my thinking in my last post to a HLDM type affair. The multitude of "No HL2DM??" posts around the forums in recent times has certainly contributed to that. If Valve created some kind of HL2 universe teamplay scenario that fit into the universe, I would love to play it. You wouldn't be able to keep me off it, most probably.

What I still disagree with, though, is the sentiment that "if you don't want more of HL2, you're not much of a fan"... can one not enjoy HL2 for what it is and still be a fan? You're wanting it to be something it's not (even though it could have been), and as a result, from a certain point of view, you could be seen to be less of a fan than someone who simply loves everything about HL2 exactly how it's released.

 

[poseyjmac]

BTW:If I offered you 30 awful HL2 levels or 20 great ones, which would you take? I'd love HL2M but I can understand Logic's position.

20 great ones. if i offered you 30 great levels or 20 great ones which would YOU take? remember hl2mp doesn't exist, so it can theoeretically be as great as i want it to in my statements.

 

[poseyjmac]

I dislike the way you are happy to renounce someone from being a fan, if they aren't into multiplayer. What if someone doesn't have the internet, or doesn't play well enough to enjoy online play? Are they allowed to be a fan? Otherwise, though, I agree with some of what you've said, and I'll admit to limiting my thinking in my last post to a HLDM type affair. The multitude of "No HL2DM??" posts around the forums in recent times has certainly contributed to that. If Valve created some kind of HL2 universe teamplay scenario that fit into the universe, I would love to play it. You wouldn't be able to keep me off it, most probably..

well then you dislike something that doesn't exist. i didn't say they weren't fans, i said they weren't as big of fans as those who would.

What I still disagree with, though, is the sentiment that "if you don't want more of HL2, you're not much of a fan"... can one not enjoy HL2 for what it is and still be a fan?

Yes

You're wanting it to be something it's not (even though it could have been), and as a result, from a certain point of view, you could be seen to be less of a fan than someone who simply loves everything about the way HL2 is at release.

no, im wanting something that doesn't exist. ill still enjoy hl2 for what it is.

 

[koopa]

20 great ones. if i offered you 30 great levels or 20 great ones which would YOU take? remember hl2mp doesn't exist, so it can theoeretically be as great as i want it to in my statements.

Well this is precisely Logic's point. You and I want hl2mp because we think it'd be great. Logic doesn't really think it fits in the world and doesn't think it's that great, so he doesn't. So it all comes down to if people think it'd be great or not, which is just a matter of preference.

 

[Logic]

well then you dislike something that doesn't exist. i didn't say they weren't fans, i said they weren't as big of fans as those who would.

Semantics. You knew what I meant.. just replace "can they not be fans" with "can they not be as big a fan", etc etc.

no, im wanting something that doesn't exist. ill still enjoy hl2 for what it is.

Semantics again, I say you're wanting HL2 to be something it's not, by including something it doesn't have. I'm not going to argue with you over the definitions of sentences, you're intelligent enough to know exactly what points I'm trying to make.

 

[Logic]

Well this is precisely Logic's point. You and I want hl2mp because we think it'd be great. Logic doesn't really think it fits in the world and doesn't think it's that great, so he doesn't. So it all comes down to if people think it'd be great or not, which is just a matter of preference.

That was definately my point when I was talking about HL2DM As far as different possible HL2MP goes, I believe it COULD have been great, but things didn't work out that way. The fact that they omitted it would suggest that it wasn't great, in which case I'm glad not to have it, and I'm no less of a fan for not wanting something less than great to be tacked onto HL2.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

For all those people pointing out that CS:S was in the stolen build, I'll remind you of this:

Valve said that HL:S and CS:S started out as a way of testing how easy it was to port HL mods over to Source. What you saw in the stolen build was the fruits of those efforts. It was not what you now know as CS:Source.
Obviously, the decision to turn that into the shipping MP mode came later.

 

[Mr-Fusion]

/inhales from the J

Haha debates of true fans. Someone go on the metallica forums and say St Anger sucks. You'll be accused of not being a true fan. As a true fan you must accept EVERYTHING the artist throws at you. Never question any creative decision because you will not be a true fan. "Why is Lars playing a tin trash can instead of a drum kit?"

After following several games and movies it's a huge mistake to create expectations from little or no information. The idea that Half-Life 2 mp was going to be some revolutionary and original game was based off nothing...NoTHiNG. It all started in peoples minds. Valve never mentioned 1 tiny detail about it. You only have yourselves to blame for having creative minds. Now sit in the dunce corner.

Now excuse me while i listen to Joshua KAddison music ...ROFL!!! AHAHAHAHAA. Michael Bolton can only quiver in fear at Kaddisons horribly shit music. That's right Bolton, eat crud.

"Jesse paint ya pictures bout how it's gonna be"
AHAHAHHA

Half-Life 2 will indeed have multiplayer features out of the box. The bad news, for now, is that Valve won't elaborate any further. More details on multiplayer Half-Life 2 are forthcoming, but it has been confirmed that Half-Life 2 is being built--or rather, the proprietary technology powering the game was built--with the mod community in mind

OMG There's gonng be Resistance vs Combine MP MODE WITH GRAVITY GUNS AND STARSHIP TROOPERS. No. Don't have any expectations. They didn't say anything. THEY SAID NOTHING cease thinking. See that last point, with the mod community? Anyone ever consider Valve want to purposely AVOID stealing the thunder of mod makers. Our first exposure to REAL source MP will be through mods. Easy for Valve, they just buy them out with a ready made game they didn't create and start selling as their own like CS and DOD. It's a good idea. Sell-out mod teams can provide instant cash flow for Valve.

Gabe Newell: Well, for the first time we're talking about what we're going to be doing for multiplayer for Half-Life 2, and what we've done is, we've taken all the original Half-Life 1 content.. so Half-Life 1 single player, Counter-Strike, Team Fortress Classic, DeathMatch, Day of Defeat, and we moved them over to source

From that quote it sounds like that's all they ever had planned.

A mp for Half-Life 2 would have to be created seperately as an expansion, after the game is released. It's just too much ****ing work to do it properly in unison with creating a great sp experience. Look at Doom 3 and Far Cry, shit mp...SHIT SHIT SHIT mp (and shit sp ironically..). KOTOR NO MP , great sp! Yeah they could slap some shitty piece of crap mp mode with cut out maps from the single player ala MOHAA etc but that is just so cheap and tacky it's not worth the effort. Do it properly with classes, a huge array of new vehicles, new weapons, player models, maps, sounds and game dynamics. It's too much work to create something worthwhile.

I just wish some people around here would realise that. You can't please everyone and while Valve is giving us a SHITLOAD Of value for money with Half-Life 2 and everything that comes with it people still want more. The value added features were supposed to shut up the hl2mp crowd, it clearly hasn't. Now Valve have an angry minority voicing the anger on message boards, people who'll still buy half-life 2 and most likely play CS:S or other mods a lot. Despite having a lot of fun with the various source mp modes nothing will fill that void of no hl2mp , something that never existed. Something these people imagined themselves.

It's like walking up to a bunch of alien believers and saying "There are no aliens here's the proof". Those poor people imagined it all and now they become angry and despair. Curse the powers. CURSE THE POWERS THAT BE! Perhaps they destroyed the aliens?

I have no ****ing idea what i'm talking about now. Absolutely no ****ing idea.

Oh wait yeah. There's lots of possible reasons why there's no hl2mp.....or something. But the main problem here is people thinking for themselves, i thought western school systems were supposed to eliminate creative thinking? Willy was right...they should remove the coloured chalk.

I'm sorry if you took the time to read this entire post.