Half Life 2 multiplayer - Was it always CSS?

[Shuzer]

do you have any proof you can present as proof? otherwise your claim holds no water.

I still have it on my computer? Do you want screens or something?

The version of CS:S that got stolen with HL2 was as follows..

One map, de_piranesi. Nothing was updated, except the water. Most of the guns were the USP Match from HL2. There were few gun models, and the one that worked was the AK. There were two models, one for each team. Both were early workings of today's two CS:S models. Alot of the VGUI icons/etc were directly from HL2, except for a couple quick (ie. buy and bomb icons) which were clearly done in a program akin to mspaint, as they were hand drawn, and very poorly at that.

If azz0r checks back to this topic, even HE can confirm this.


Edit: Furthermore, what do you think HL2World was editing and adding on to when they were working on that "updated CS:S port?"

 

[poseyjmac]

I remember seeing some CS:S stuff in the source code leak, though I don't remember any actual content i.e. just code. All I remember is the hl2 content.

was it CS:S or was it CS? big difference there. if you have any proof that it is indeed CS:S, such as mention of physics objects like bananas on italy, then that would be proof.

but people also said that there was proof of hl2 MP in the works with the leak, but that turned out to be false, as all it was, was the ability to connect to someone else. something built into the engine already. no evidence of hl2 themed mp maps, or models.

 

[MetalliMyers]

I don't understand why people are so twisted up about there not being any straight multiplayer.

It's possible Valve made the decision to have MP, then decided not to due to any number of unknown reasons (probably to focus fully on the single player).
now they've replaced it with CS because they knew there would be people who just can't see passed their own selfish wants and think that MP is the only good thing about any game.

It is Valve's game, they didn't lie about there being a multiplayer, they just changed their minds and didn't tell us, if they had done what people wanted then they'd be creating mediocre MP and mediocre SP, they're trying to create something people haven't seen in this way before and it's quite possible that they thought that the MP they'd made, while fun, was just like every other MP except with the source engine (but then they redid CS which is just like old CS so go figure).

BTW everything i've said is my opinion, just because it's different than yours doesn't make it any less of an opinion.

Because fanboys are like that. They have to bitch about something.

 

[poseyjmac]

Because fanboys are like that. They have to bitch about something.

whether it be lack of hl2 MP, or the fact that they are bitching at people bitching for lack of hl2 mp. all fanboys.

 

[poseyjmac]

I still have it on my computer? Do you want screens or something?

The version of CS:S that got stolen with HL2 was as follows..

One map, de_piranesi. Nothing was updated, except the water. Most of the guns were the USP Match from HL2. There were few gun models, and the one that worked was the AK. There were two models, one for each team. Both were early workings of today's two CS:S models. Alot of the VGUI icons/etc were directly from HL2, except for a couple quick (ie. buy and bomb icons) which were clearly done in a program akin to mspaint, as they were hand drawn, and very poorly at that.

If azz0r checks back to this topic, even HE can confirm this.


Edit: Furthermore, what do you think HL2World was editing and adding on to when they were working on that "updated CS:S port?"

screens would be nice.

 

[exoeight]

but people also said that there was proof of hl2 MP in the works with the leak, but that turned out to be false,

you're wrong, want to play right now? download the leak off of any p2p network, we can directly connect to a mp game right now and i'm not BSing.

can't post screenshots, get banned.

 

[MetalliMyers]

whether it be lack of hl2 MP, or the fact that they are bitching at people bitching for lack of hl2 mp. all fanboys.

That doesn't make sense. If you were bitching about people bitching about a lack of HL2 mp, then what are you a fanboy of?

Sorry for ending with a preposition

 

[poseyjmac]

you're wrong, want to play right now? download the leak off of any p2p network, we can direct IP right now and i'm not BSing.

did you read the rest of my post? i stated that connecting to each other was possible, but thats not proof that there was an actual hl2 mp mode in the works. it was just built into the engine.

 

[iamaelephant]

poseyjmac, I can confirm there was an early build of CS:S with the stolen leak. I have seen it with my own eyes. This confirms that Valve did in fact mislead us when they told us CS:S only began production early this year. In my opinion, Valve have been planning CS:S to be the MP for a very long time. They expected the community to go gah-gah over their fancy graphics in a game we're all long sick of, and when they didn't get the reaction they expected, they shut their mouths for a long time concerning HL2 MP. This of course led to the dozens of arguments on various forums about whether or not HL2 would have it's own MP mode, or if it was just CS:S.

This is all speculation, of course, so feel free to pick it apart all you want.

 

[Shuzer]

Okay. Just took some screens posey, obviously I'm not allowed to link them here. I'll drop you an e-mail real quick with links to the screens right now.

Edit: nm, I'll just PM them to you.

 

[poseyjmac]

That doesn't make sense. If you were bitching about people bitching about a lack of HL2 mp, then what are you a fanboy of?

Sorry for ending with a preposition

they would be a fanboy of hl2 still, but more specifically a valve fanboy. defending every move they make. you've been on this forum for a while, you should know this by now.

 

[exoeight]

people made mp maps on hl2 world,

 

[MetalliMyers]

they would be a fanboy of hl2 still, but more specifically a valve fanboy. defending every move they make. you've been on this forum for a while, you should know this by now.

Yes, you are right, Valve definitely has some fanboys here. LOL

 

[poseyjmac]

ok ill be awaiting the email.

still though, even if it was being made at the time of the leak, its yet another fib valve has told. this is ultimately what many are complaining about.

 

[mayro]

Guys, im going to take a long shot on this....

Valve has said their is no multiplayer for Half-Life 2 beyond CSS.
Valve has said they dont plan on makeing it.

Could valve had made a MOD to SOURCE as some sort of multiplayer?
I mean, if it isnt a deathmatch based on Half-Life 2 then halflife2 wouldnt be the game with the deathmatch support. It would be standalone kinda like CSS. CSS is considerd to be part of Halflife 2 becuase A:it does come with it and B:Halflife has CS.

Valve could have possibly made something for source and instead of telling us straight what they are up to, seeing as we are asking the wrong questions, they keep giving us the run around.

Thoughts?

 

[Shuzer]

ok ill be awaiting the email.

still though, even if it was being made at the time of the leak, its yet another fib valve has told. this is ultimately what many are complaining about.

I couldn't e-mail them to you, so I PMed you. Check your PMs

And yes, I agree. I've always loathed the BS that is "we didn't start work on CS:S until February of '04"

 

[MetalliMyers]

I couldn't e-mail them to you, so I PMed you. Check your PMs

And yes, I agree. I've always loathed the BS that is "we didn't start work on CS:S until February of '04"

Can you PM them to me too, I want to peak.

 

[Shuzer]

kay. Check quick, I'm taking them down in a few minutes

 

[poseyjmac]

thx, thats proof enough.

maybe they were testing some ideas with source engine and CS at the time of the leak, but didn't officially begin seriously developing it till februrary, then that would be no lie. see, im not as anti-valve as you might think!

 

[Paintballer]

Those hl and cs ports that came with the leak were just hl and cs directly ported to the source engine. This was not Valve's work... anon or someone related with anon made those ports, they ARE NOT VALVE's WORK. So, CS:S could have just started this year.

 

[MetalliMyers]

Those hl and cs ports that came with the leak were just hl and cs directly ported to the source engine. This was not Valve's work... anon or someone related with anon made those ports, they ARE NOT VALVE's WORK. So, CS:S could have just started this year.

Does seem kinda crappy

 

[iamaelephant]

Those hl and cs ports that came with the leak were just hl and cs directly ported to the source engine. This was not Valve's work... anon or someone related with anon made those ports, they ARE NOT VALVE's WORK. So, CS:S could have just started this year.

Got any proof? As far as I know Anon released what he had, he didn't add anything to it.

 

[Shuzer]

Those hl and cs ports that came with the leak were just hl and cs directly ported to the source engine. This was not Valve's work... anon or someone related with anon made those ports, they ARE NOT VALVE's WORK. So, CS:S could have just started this year.

The ONLY POSSIBLE WAY for people to port CS and HL THEMSELVES would to be actually having HL and the CS source code, which nobody does.

What was stolen was VALVe's work. This is EXTREMELY apparent in the HL:S port, for it's as we've seen it TODAY, it was just about 1/10th of the game done.

Plus, you can tell by the style of the placeholder models in the stolen CS:S port that they just directly updated them to what we see today.

 

[Logic]

Got any proof? As far as I know Anon released what he had, he didn't add anything to it.

I find it pretty crazy that (throughout the entire leak fiasco) people are more willing to believe the word of a thief and criminal than the word of Gabe and others at Valve. Besides, it is likely that Valve tried porting CS to the engine as a test, and didn't decide to start revamping the game until later. In that case, development may very well have started when they said it did.

Most of you need to learn something about objectivity - Keep an open mind, be open to every possibility, and give people the benefit of the doubt until there's some kind of proof that they're wrong - you would expect others to give you the same chance. Some of you guys are just plain mean, basing your hatred of Valve on narrow minded assumptions and wildly ignorant statements that you could not possibly know to be true for a fact. I'm yet to hear ONE anti-valve statement that can't be argued with a list of alternative possibilities. You guys are making assumptions, and as a result, coming across like idiots.

 

[Shuzer]

Most of you need to learn something about objectivity - Keep an open mind, be open to every possibility, and give people the benefit of the doubt until there's some kind of proof that they're wrong - you would expect others to give you the same chance. Some of you guys are just plain mean, basing your hatred of Valve on narrow minded assumptions and wildly ignorant statements that you could not possibly know to be true for a fact. I'm yet to hear ONE anti-valve statement that can't be argued with a list of alternative possibilities. You guys are making assumptions, and as a result, coming across like idiots.

Proof, such as CS:S being stolen BEFORE VALVe claimed they started work on it?

Anyhow.. I'm not sure who's coming off as a VALVe hater here.. I didn't read the whole topic. I, by no means, hate VALVe. I dislike some of what they do, but for the most part, I have nothing but respect for them.

 

[Edcrab]

Well, in the defence of myself and my fellow whiners you'd actually find much of this thread's content recognising alternate scenarios.

And as stated assumptions are rife but that's only to be expected when discussing a topic where the facts are unavailable to the public despite being so coveted.

Interesting idea- CS being ported, originally, purely to act as a "test". I wonder at what stage they decided to upgrade it to a full-blown conversion to be shipped with Half-Life 2 itself...

 

[Logic]

Proof, such as CS:S being stolen BEFORE VALVe claimed they started work on it?

Read the first part of my post. CS's inclusion in the leak proves nothing. To think so would be ignoring other possibilities, which is the very thing I was condemning.

 

[Shuzer]

Read the first part of my post. CS's inclusion in the leak proves nothing. To think so would be ignoring other possibilities, which is the very thing I was condemning.

The first part of your post is irrelevant. I'd of believed VALVe over anon if they didn' say that only 1/3rd of the source code got stolen (yeah, sure..) and that which was stolen wasn't a recent version of HL2 had it not taken them a year to finish what they claimed was already done.

My initial reaction? Anon lied. My reaction, over a year later? Anon was telling the truth.

 

[Logic]

The first part of your post is irrelevant. I'd of believed VALVe over anon if they didn' say that only 1/3rd of the source code got stolen (yeah, sure..) and that which was stolen wasn't a recent version of HL2 had it not taken them a year to finish what they claimed was already done.

My initial reaction? Anon lied. My reaction, over a year later? Anon was telling the truth.

Actually, I was referring to this:

Besides, it is likely that Valve tried porting CS to the engine as a test, and didn't decide to start revamping the game until later. In that case, development may very well have started when they said it did.

I'm not at all interested in what anon said and whether or not it was true. The fact of the matter is, nothing PROVES that Valve have lied, or anything of the sort, and the only way anyone can come to the conclusion that they did is by making assumptions and ignoring other possibilities. There is no PROOF of anything, since we simply don't know anything about what goes on behind closed doors at Valve. All I'm asking of people is to remain open minded.

 

[iamaelephant]

Most of you need to learn something about objectivity - Keep an open mind, be open to every possibility, and give people the benefit of the doubt until there's some kind of proof that they're wrong - you would expect others to give you the same chance. Some of you guys are just plain mean, basing your hatred of Valve on narrow minded assumptions and wildly ignorant statements that you could not possibly know to be true for a fact. I'm yet to hear ONE anti-valve statement that can't be argued with a list of alternative possibilities. You guys are making assumptions, and as a result, coming across like idiots.

I gave Valve the benefit of the doubt all the way up to September 30th last year. I'm sick of putting faith into Valve and having them shit all over it.

 

[Soundwave]

Of course, logic seems to be in short supply around here.

I agree, just look at the ****ing idiot fanboys defending this bullshit.

WHY would they drop the MP if it was so "unique" and good enough to be played daily? Man you fanboys can defend just about anything if you try hard enough huh.

 

[The Mullinator]

I gave Valve the benefit of the doubt all the way up to September 30th last year. I'm sick of putting faith into Valve and having them shit all over it.

If you are so dissapointed then you put far more faith into them than I would put into any single company. Delays always happen, I knew that when I first heard about this game and I was always willing to accept that if the game was delayed then it probably needed it.

Valve didn't want to "shit" all over your hopes, but they probably didn't have much choice once it was too late. They thought they could make a September 30th release and they were wrong. I accept that they were wrong and I move on. I don't sit there whining and complaining that they lied to me and stay grumpy and angry at them for the rest of the time they exist.

I agree, just look at the ****ing idiot fanboys defending this bullshit.

WHY would they drop the MP if it was so "unique" and good enough to be played daily? Man you fanboys can defend just about anything if you try hard enough huh.

lol, I don't see you giving any answers. Now tell me, since you seem to be all knowing about how "evil" Valve is then you tell me why Valve dropped it. Go ahead, you tell me the reasoning you have for why Valve dropped the multiplayer.

 

[Logic]

I gave Valve the benefit of the doubt all the way up to September 30th last year. I'm sick of putting faith into Valve and having them shit all over it.

I'm not even going to try to argue with you. Obviously, you've made up your mind, and you're so deep into your bitterness, there's just no way back. All I'll say is that Valve "shitting all over" us is simply your interpretation of what's happened. I've been a fan as long as anyone else, and have awaited HL2 eagerly since long before it was announced. I've kept up on all the news.. read every announcement and interview, read thousands of forum threads... and nothing has suggested to me that Valve are in any way screwing us over. I pity you, that you've lost your cool, and haven't had a joyous experience of being a fan. You're doing it to yourself, though.

 

[tokin]

I find it pretty crazy that (throughout the entire leak fiasco) people are more willing to believe the word of a thief and criminal than the word of Gabe and others at Valve. Besides, it is likely that Valve tried porting CS to the engine as a test, and didn't decide to start revamping the game until later. In that case, development may very well have started when they said it did.

Most of you need to learn something about objectivity - Keep an open mind, be open to every possibility, and give people the benefit of the doubt until there's some kind of proof that they're wrong - you would expect others to give you the same chance. Some of you guys are just plain mean, basing your hatred of Valve on narrow minded assumptions and wildly ignorant statements that you could not possibly know to be true for a fact. I'm yet to hear ONE anti-valve statement that can't be argued with a list of alternative possibilities. You guys are making assumptions, and as a result, coming across like idiots.

Most intelligent person in this thread.

 

[iamaelephant]

Actually, I was referring to this:

I'm not at all interested in what anon said and whether or not it was true. The fact of the matter is, nothing PROVES that Valve have lied, or anything of the sort, and the only way anyone can come to the conclusion that they did is by making assumptions and ignoring other possibilities. There is no PROOF of anything, since we simply don't know anything about what goes on behind closed doors at Valve. All I'm asking of people is to remain open minded.

You want proof? Go download the anon leak. There are CS:S files in that leak. If you honestly believe that anon put those files in there, then you are the one making stupid assumptions. something tells me he didn't bother to port over one map (and only one map), transfer all the CS code into the Source engine, create new models for the players and port in some of the guns. No. Valve began work on CS:S long before February. It seems fairly obvious to me that CS:S was always going to be included with HL2.

Whether or not there was ever going to be a HL2 themed MP remains to be seen, and hopefully the Raising the Bar book will shed some light on the situation. But please, when you read that book, take it with a grain of salt. Valve are not exactly renouned for their honesty.

 

[Logic]

WHY would they drop the MP if it was so "unique" and good enough to be played daily?

The fact that you're too stupid to think of a reason doesn't mean there isn't one. Sorry to be blunt, and I don't normally flame people, but some of you need some sense slapped into you.

 

[poseyjmac]

logic, we've all given valve the benefit of the doubt at one time or another. but after all that has happened, they don't deserve it anymore.

 

[Edcrab]

Oh, I wouldn't question Valve's honesty- I'd just say they encounter (admittedly massive) hiccups in their procedures, just like every other artist in history. And they don't like backing down from statements or clarifying decisions or errors to people outside their business loop- but who else would?

Renowned for being a normal instant-classic-game developer, perhaps. They're ten a penny these days...

 

[The Mullinator]

You want proof? Go download the anon leak. There are CS:S files in that leak. If you honestly believe that anon put those files in there, then you are the one making stupid assumptions. something tells me he didn't bother to port over one map (and only one map), transfer all the CS code into the Source engine, create new models for the players and port in some of the guns. No. Valve began work on CS:S long before February. It seems fairly obvious to me that CS:S was always going to be included with HL2.

Whether or not there was ever going to be a HL2 themed MP remains to be seen, and hopefully the Raising the Bar book will shed some light on the situation. But please, when you read that book, take it with a grain of salt. Valve are not exactly renouned for their honesty.

Valve had stated that they had been experimenting with porting things over to Source long before the leak occured. Does it not seem likely that they may have ported CS:S as an experiment to see if it could be done and then didn't really begin actual official work on it until the date that they say they started working on it?

 

[Logic]

You want proof? Go download the anon leak. There are CS:S files in that leak. If you honestly believe that anon put those files in there, then you are the one making stupid assumptions. something tells me he didn't bother to port over one map (and only one map), transfer all the CS code into the Source engine, create new models for the players and port in some of the guns. No. Valve began work on CS:S long before February. It seems fairly obvious to me that CS:S was always going to be included with HL2.

*sigh*.. I'll re-quote myself AGAIN.

Besides, it is likely that Valve tried porting CS to the engine as a test, and didn't decide to start revamping the game until later. In that case, development may very well have started when they said it did.

I have actually played the leak, and I did see the counter-strike port. Once again, it proves nothing. Assuming Valve were the ones to port it, how do you know they actually had plans to revamp it at that point? You are ASSUMING that is the case. You're demonstrating exactly the kind of ignorance my post is all about.