MGS 4 coming to 360? (A Horrible, dirty and filthy lie)

[Asknoone]

You didn't answer my question:

How does it feel to know you're very, very wrong?

 

[Irksome]

You didn't answer my question:

Your question is to pompous and presumptuous to take seriously. Maybe if you made your point I'd respond but right now, no thanks.

 

[Pulse]

How could you miss the point in one sentence? Thats impressive.

I never said MGS4 going to the Xbox360 was bad...I said I don't care either way because consoles are killing video games.

...what?

 

[Irksome]

If you want to argue about something, don't say "...what?" or "How does it feel to be wrong?" just list your arguments and have at it instead of dancing around the issue.

 

[knut]

How could you miss the point in one sentence? Thats impressive.

I never said MGS4 going to the Xbox360 was bad...I said I don't care either way because consoles are killing video games.

Miss the point? What point? You come into a thread about a console game going to another console and whine about consoles being the cancer of video gaming? I'm struggling to understand where you are coming from here. A title is coming to two consoles at the opposite end of the spectrum, which is therefore going to appeal to two individual crowds of gamers who prefer either console. That is nothing but a good thing. How... how can that be classed as killing the video game when it is bringing more to the table?

 

[StardogChampion]

If you want to argue about something, don't say "...what?" or "How does it feel to be wrong?" just list your arguments and have at it instead of dancing around the issue.

Just ignore them. Samon and his buddies like Kadayi resort to 5-year-old arguing techniques when they have no way to prove you wrong.

 

[Irksome]

Miss the point? What point? You come into a thread about a console game going to another console and whine about consoles being the cancer of video gaming?

A thread about consoles, hmm seems like a perfect time to talk about how they're killing video gaming. Especially as another huge title is rumored to now be whoring itself onto another console.

I'm struggling to understand where you are coming from here.

Consoles = Cancer that are killing video games. Clear yet or should I put in pretty colors?

A title is coming to two consoles at the opposite end of the spectrum, which is therefore going to appeal to two individual crowds of gamers who prefer either console. That is nothing but a good thing. How... how can that be classed as killing the video game when it is bringing more to the table?

Yes, so now the PS3 trolls and Xbox trolls can argue why it looks better on their respective systems. Hoorary for the future of video games.

 

[Tagaziel]

Compare Deus Ex and Deus Ex Invisible War. How are consoles helping videogames again?

 

[knut]

So wait... the best reason you can come up with for justifying that consoles are killing video games is that 360 and PS3 fans will argue about it? Oh good god, brace for ****ing impact, future! Kids on the Internet... arguing! Witchcraft!

Oh, and by the way: when asked what you might be trying to actually say when questioned ''what do you mean, consoles are the cancer killing video games'', simply putting an equals symbol next to the same damn sentance does not answer the question.

Mikael: I've never played either, so I wouldn't know what the story with those two is. Some people like 'em, others don't.

 

[CrazyHarij]

Consoles = Cancer that are killing video games. Clear yet or should I put in pretty colors?

Yeah man, try the colors. Or if that doesn't work, you could try explaining why you think that, because right now you seem to be pulling it out of your ass. Is it out of mere spite for consoles? Last time I checked, elitism wasn't a valid argument.

Compare Deus Ex and Deus Ex Invisible War. How are consoles helping videogames again?

DE was a poor attempt at making a multiplatform friendly game, it's not relevant today. Lots of multiplatform games are performing great and aren't being dumbed down. The orange box to name one.

Video games are alive and kicking right now, much thanks to the console boom. More people purchase games, more people play games, more games are being developed. How is that a bad thing?

 

[<RJMC>]

Compare Deus Ex and Deus Ex Invisible War. How are consoles helping videogames again?

thats because the "cancer" is the buyers,the buyers that will uy antyhing dont matter how crappy

you know why there wont be another "crash" like the one in 1983 or whaever the time that E.T. game came?
becauze people will buy those "E.T." games,over and over again,just look at halo

 

[Asknoone]

Just ignore them. Samon and his buddies like Kadayi resort to 5-year-old arguing techniques when they have no way to prove you wrong.

Excuse me? "Samon and his buddies like Kadayi"? Do you want to elaborate on that? I agreed with Kadayi on one point and that was that your stance on Episodes and Expansions was obtuse. I then subsequently warned him for dogging your posts. So try again.

What's more, you resort to "I have better taste than you; I am not swayed by fanboyism/hype/graphics/tits" when you have no way to prove people wrong.

Your question is to pompous and presumptuous to take seriously. Maybe if you made your point I'd respond but right now, no thanks.

Your point was inane, ridiculous and entirely untrue. What else do you expect?

Compare Deus Ex and Deus Ex Invisible War. How are consoles helping videogames again?

Irrelevant point.

 

[StardogChampion]

DE was a poor attempt at making a multiplatform friendly game, it's not relevant today. Lots of multiplatform games are performing great and aren't being dumbed down. The orange box to name one.

You'll need to name more than that to convince me. Valve are a primarily PC developer, so their games are probably ported from PC > Console, rather than Console > PC (R6: Vegas, Bioshock, Deus Ex 2, Thief: DS, Oblivion - all "simpler" games due to console development).

 

[Deleted member 56031]

Sounds like bullshit, but either way consoles are the cancer that are killing video games.

but they control 90% of the gaming market. Without them the gaming industry wouldn't be what it is today!

Compare Deus Ex and Deus Ex Invisible War. How are consoles helping videogames again?

True although deus ex 1 was on PS2?

 

[jondy]

Surely market forces dictate cross-platform development anyway? As far as I can see, development costs are so high that developing for one platform is financial anathema, and the PC market just isn't as lucrative. Hell, we're probably lucky these things are ported. We're even luckier to have developers like Valve onside.

If PC gaming is 'dying', and it's not, consoles aren't the problem - it's high development costs that are forcing multiplatform development and console priority, and you'll just have to live with it until the either the market or the product changes.

 

[Teta_Bonita]

This is just a rumor... I wouldn't get your hopes up just yet.

 

[CrazyHarij]

You'll need to name more than that to convince me. Valve are a primarily PC developer, so their games are probably ported from PC > Console, rather than Console > PC (R6: Vegas, Bioshock, Deus Ex 2, Thief: DS, Oblivion - all "simpler" games due to console development).

Why should I convince you? You're free to think whatever the **** you want.
Few multiplatform games, pretty much none, were decent before 2007 I'll agree. But we're not going downhill, rather the opposite. Evolution folks.

Nowadays, console development doesn't facilitate a "simpler" game as you express it. Mass effect, Cod4, halo 3, racing games, etc, those are the types of games that are being prevalent on consoles now. And Bioshock kicked ass, it got a great reception, in what way was it inferior?

 

[KagePrototype]

Compare Deus Ex and Deus Ex Invisible War. How are consoles helping videogames again?

Invisible War failed because of iffy design and a rushed development over multiple platforms. Besides, Deus Ex was ported onto the PS2 with little trouble. And consoles help videogames, if anything. They're a **** load easier to develop on and have a much larger audience than PCs.

I'm not sure your problem is specifically with consoles, but with developers trying to make their franchises more simple and accessible.

 

[Qonfused]

Sigh.

 

[Asknoone]

Developers trying to make their franchises more simple and accessible.

And that, in itself, is not a bad thing.

 

[Tagaziel]

And that, in itself, is not a bad thing.

SIMPLE GAME is BETTER?

Dude.

Just, dude.

 

[Pulse]

SIMPLE GAME is BETTER?

Dude.

Just, dude.

simple and accessible.

No one said anything about console ports being better.

 

[Acepilotf14]

You guys know that Consoles are simply simpler computers? Made of the same parts, just overall better and less expensive, but they go bad quickly, and you can't do as much stuff.

I heard SupCom is going on the 360.
How the shit will that work?

 

[rAdIOhEaD]

Wasn't this thread about MGS4 on the 360? you know, the thread that comes back alive from the ashes every couple of months?

 

[Cole]

Simple Games are awesome.

Blizzard for instance makes very high quality simple games. Starcraft is basically Rock - Paper - Scissors. It's a pretty simple game compared to a lot of other RTS's. It's amazing. Diablo? Could an RPG be simpler?

A game being Simple or Complex doesn't necessarily make it better. Innovation in games doesn't always mean a game is more complex. Simpler games often have very little learning curve and it allows players to jump in and just start playing. That doesn't mean they are easy to master though.

A game being simple or complex does not reflect the quality of the game. I prefer games that are easy to get into but hard to master. A lot of FPS's are this way, easy for anyone to figure out but takes a lot of time to get really good. Some FPS's ruin this experience with poor controls making it much harder to get into the game.

 

[Kadayi]

Just ignore them. Samon and his buddies like Kadayi resort to 5-year-old arguing techniques when they have no way to prove you wrong.

I love it that I'm being trolled in a thread I've not even posting in yet. Pre-emptive strike perhaps? :dozey:

 

[StardogChampion]

Simple Games are awesome.

Blizzard for instance makes very high quality simple games. Starcraft is basically Rock - Paper - Scissors. It's a pretty simple game compared to a lot of other RTS's. It's amazing. Diablo? Could an RPG be simpler?

A game being Simple or Complex doesn't necessarily make it better. Innovation in games doesn't always mean a game is more complex. Simpler games often have very little learning curve and it allows players to jump in and just start playing. That doesn't mean they are easy to master though.

A game being simple or complex does not reflect the quality of the game.

The thing is, with consoles lke the 360 around, this would mean something like Diablo 3 being built for the 360 instead of the PC with less spells/items/weapons than D1/2 with no inventory just so it's "accessible" for 360 users to switch between items with their sucky gamepad.

I wasn't saying simple games suck. I'm just saying consoles are taking well-established series backwards. Next up is Fallout.

 

[ríomhaire]

True although deus ex 1 was on PS2?

Yeah, but I've heard that the port really sucked.

 

[Stigmata]

I'm just saying developers are taking well-established series backwards. Next up is Fallout.

Fixed. Consoles are perfectly fine. You have nobody but the developers to blame for the decline in quality.

 

[Gargantou]

Indeed Stigmata, blaming CONSOLES for DEVELOPERS design choices is like blaming NUCLEAR REACTIONS for HUMANITY'S decision to design the nuclear bomb.

 

[Cole]

The thing is, with consoles lke the 360 around, this would mean something like Diablo 3 being built for the 360 instead of the PC with less spells/items/weapons than D1/2 with no inventory just so it's "accessible" for 360 users to switch between items with their sucky gamepad.

I wasn't saying simple games suck. I'm just saying consoles are taking well-established series backwards. Next up is Fallout.

Thats not the consoles fault. It was the developers option to move to the console market when the developer did not have the ability to devise an innovative method to add enough spells, items, weapons and keep an inventory for the game. It was the developers fault.
Blizzard was smart enough to be able to port Diablo 1 to the playstation without sacrifice. Blizzard was also smart enough to realize Starcraft 64 and Starcraft needed different control schemes.

 

[StardogChampion]

Indeed Stigmata, blaming CONSOLES for DEVELOPERS design choices is like blaming NUCLEAR REACTIONS for HUMANITY'S decision to design the nuclear bomb.

Take away the consoles and the bad design choices wouldn't exist. They exist because of consoles. Consoles are dumbing down the gaming industry.

 

[Stigmata]

Burden of proof, champ.

 

[ericms]

Take away the consoles and the bad design choices wouldn't exist. They exist because of consoles. Consoles are dumbing down the gaming industry.

That is such a piss poor argument.. you're talking as if a chunk of metal is the root cause of "bad" design decisions. So, consoles are no longer tools for developers to put across their visions? No, they're instead an originating source of design choices that dictate themselves to the developers. From you're argument it sounds as if bad design is an incentive for developers. Obviously no one will purposefully seek out such a thing and this holds true for the console market. This is a mistake by designers who have yet to streamline themselves.

 

[Acepilotf14]

Kadayi, I can't take you seriously with that avatar.

 

[KagePrototype]

Take away the consoles and the bad design choices wouldn't exist. They exist because of consoles. Consoles are dumbing down the gaming industry.

...? Bad design choices exist because of bad designers.

(seriously, did you even read what you wrote down?)

 

[VictimOfScience]

No time to read all of the pages, but this is sort of a no-brainer. Still for any info to leak about this or anyone to say anything is EXTREMELY bad behavior.

 

[StardogChampion]

...? Bad design choices exist because of bad designers.

(seriously, did you even read what you wrote down?)

Your argument is going nowhere.

Are you telling me that designers don't make their design choices based on the hardware they're designing for? Some of these designers/developers had great PC games already released previously, they didn't become bad designers that dumb games down overnight. The only new item inserted into the equation is usually consoles (and the casual gamers that come with it) they had to cater for.

 

[DEATHMASTER]

cool. Too bad I don't play MGS

 

[KagePrototype]

Are you telling me that designers don't make their design choices based on the hardware they're designing for? Some of these designers/developers had great PC games already released previously, they didn't become bad designers that dumb games down overnight. The only new item inserted into the equation is usually consoles (and the casual gamers that come with it) they had to cater for.

Sure, hardware can sometimes be a limiting factor when making games released on multiple platforms, but I don't think it's that big a deal. I don't see, for example, how Invisible War on the Xbox couldn't have handled all the things Ion Storm took out of Deus Ex. And on console-only games it shouldn't even be a problem. Like I said to Mikael before, I think your problem is that developers are simplifying well-loved franchises to appeal to more people rather than "console games r dumb".

My argument is that consoles can handle complex games that are well designed, fun to play and still be a success, and that it's the choices a developer makes (targeting larger audiences) that leads to bad console games or multiplatform disasters.