Minnesota school shooting! (10 dead)

lePobz said:
Not the UK, although we do have armed police, they leave their guns at work under lock and key.
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Police gun safety in the UK is very high, Guns are rarely carried around just "for the hell of it" i have only ever seen one armed officer in my life with a glock 17 and even he looked like he was doing something.

The holsters are sown closed with stitching that means if a person tries to snatch the gun it wont come out the holster, it has to be taken out by it being tilted to break the stitching or something (not entirely sure because im not an armed cop)

The Armed response vehicles have the guns locked in an armoured box that can only be opened with 2 keys or something.


........i know a worrying amount about police systems for a civi :0
 
Direwolf said:
]And lets face it: American society is a giant mish-mash of human society in general.
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Right ... To people that disagree with nearly every aspect of american society, that would be slightly offensive to include them under that umberella... as stupid as it is to say everyone is responsible for one lunatic grabbing a gun and shooting people.
 
lePobz said:
Right ... To people that disagree with nearly every aspect of american society, that would be slightly offensive to include them under that umberella... as stupid as it is to say everyone is responsible for one lunatic grabbing a gun and shooting people.
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Ya but there are plenty of people in the U.S. who disagree with virtually every aspect of American society. Since they live in the U.S. they also help form what can be called the American society.
 
I think we're getting definitions crossed. I'm not saying "American Society" is inclusive of everyone in the country. "Society" usually refers to the majority's opinions/likes/dislikes/culture. And I can't imagine you hate everything about American society, since it includes everything from Rock and Roll to the Harlem Renassaince. (My spell checker just screamed.)
 
I blame the parents

seriously

In modern America and increasingly in Europe there exists a culture of passive parenting, raising children without boundaries or a traditional semblance of family
Now while i'm all for a tolerant liberal household, a parent who takes no responsibility for their children is guilty of child abuse
I l;ike everyone am a product of my parents -genetically a mix of both
psychologically - almost all my personality has been molded by their words and actions and lack thereof

What i despise especially is when parents turn up to counsellors or shrinks with their weird or anti social children and are reassured that it wasnt their fault..

So the real problem here is the parents as usual with the environment acting merely as a catalyst or even just a setting for the horrific events that can occur
 
I didn't say I hate it. I said I disagree with most aspects ... the fact that most cops can be 'bought', most people see muslims as terrorists, and that you need as many guns as possible to feel safe. Oh, and the number of people that drive SUVs ... why?

I think it's impossible to get anyone to disarm in the USA now. Even if handguns were banned, hardly anybody would get rid.

It's true that guns can't kill people by themselves, but if theres no guns in the first place, then people have a harder time killing people... and killing themselves at the end of it.
 
lePobz said:
I didn't say I hate it. I said I disagree with most aspects ... the fact that most cops can be 'bought', most people see muslims as terrorists, and that you need as many guns as possible to feel safe. Oh, and the number of people that drive SUVs ... why?
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I doubt the percentage of cops that can be "bought" is substantially different from the number in any other country.

There actually aren't nearly as many Americans as you think who feel the need to have guns to keep safe.

Most people do NOT see Muslims as terrorists, that is just a big load of crap.

The SUV thing however I agree with, I hate those things with a passion.

All this is comming from a Canadian who has travelled to the U.S. a fair number of times in his life.
 
The Mullinator said:
I doubt the percentage of cops that can be "bought" is substantially different from the number in any other country.

There actually aren't nearly as many Americans as you think who feel the need to have guns to keep safe.

Most people do NOT see Muslims as terrorists, that is just a big load of crap.

The SUV thing however I agree with, I hate those things with a passion.

All this is comming from a Canadian who has travelled to the U.S. a fair number of times in his life.
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Well I guess british TV isn't as accurate as it says it is ... or michael moore ...
 
lePobz said:
Well I guess british TV isn't as accurate as it says it is ... or michael moore ...
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I don't know much about British TV, however I can tell you that you should only use Michael Moore as a source to see the worst parts U.S, not its norm.
 
sigh ...kerberos I already gave you my reasoning, you just chose to ignore it
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I had'nt ignored your logic anymore then you had ... which means I looked at it, and agreed with it.

However, someone else asked another question, and so I provided for them what might be considered a country bash. In the dod.net forums, it is! :thumbs:

But let that worry you -- I know about the same epidemic you've mentioned, and yes I agree even beyond words ...
 
K e r b e r o s said:
I had'nt ignored your logic anymore then you had ... which means I looked at it, and agreed with it.

However, someone else asked another question, and so I provided for them what might be considered a country bash. In the dod.net forums, it is! :thumbs:

But let that worry you -- I know about the same epidemic you've mentioned, and yes I agree even beyond words ...
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god, my brain hurts after trying to decipher what you've said
 
That's so sad. Referring to the shooting, not the 457th rehash of the "Americans Suck, Less Guns Plz" argument.
 
heh say what you will, but I've never been one to give conspiracy theories a second thought ...all my evidence is based on fact
 
lePobz said:
I didn't say I hate it. I said I disagree with most aspects ... the fact that most cops can be 'bought', most people see muslims as terrorists, and that you need as many guns as possible to feel safe. Oh, and the number of people that drive SUVs ... why?
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I've lived in America my whole life, and I'd never say any of those things are part of American society. Cops being bought, and muslims automatically being labeled terrorists is just trash (although you might not think so watching the news sometimes), gun owners are actually the minority, and SUVs are a fad. (My own personal theory on that last one is being borne out by current autotrends: that people want something big thats not a van. Thus the rebirth of the station-wagon.)
 
lePobz said:
Well I guess british TV isn't as accurate as it says it is ... or michael moore ...
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LOL. Too funny. I love people overseas telling Americans what life is like in America. FYI Pobz, you couldn't be further from the truth. Michael Moore.. yeah he's a true beacon of honesty.
 
well I guess you americans dont care all that much for honesty cuz bush is still in office
 
Isn't it true that a lot of mosques in America were defaced/vandalised post 9/11? Doesn't that alone give truth to my previous statement?

Michael Moore was spot on in every fact he gave. The only argument you can give against him is that he doesn't give the other side of the story. Sure there are many Americans that oppose guns.

Moore never lied once, and until anyone can actually give evidence and back it up that he has done, you can all be quiet.
 
Guys...go back to the politics forum. Seriously, you're making a mockery of this whole incident.
 
The Mullinator said:
Here are some percentages from 2001
http://reason.com/0105/sb-guns.shtml
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between 77 and 90 milllion ...hmmm I wonder if this number reflects those that have illegal guns?


wow that means that most gun owners have more than one gun ...which kinda detracts from the "I need it for protection" argument
 
Farrowlesparrow said:
Guys...go back to the politics forum. Seriously, you're making a mockery of this whole incident.
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Making a mockery by debating its fundamental cause? You'd make a great leader.
 
lePobz said:
Isn't it true that a lot of mosques in America were defaced/vandalised post 9/11? Doesn't that alone give truth to my previous statement?

Michael Moore was spot on in every fact he gave. The only argument you can give against him is that he doesn't give the other side of the story. Sure there are many Americans that oppose guns.

Moore never lied once, and until anyone can actually give evidence and back it up that he has done, you can all be quiet.
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Mosques being vandalized means nothing since every major city is going to have a small group of people who hate Muslims and will be willing to do that. It means nothing of the rest of the population.

Michael Moore may tell truths but he does stretch them, and apply them in situations where they shouldn't be applied.
 
CptStern said:
between 77 and 90 milllion ...hmmm I wonder if this number reflects those that have illegal guns?


wow that means that most gun owners have more than one gun ...which kinda detracts from the "I need it for protection" argument
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Alot of that may be for hunting though
59% say they own a gun for hunting.

One of my best friends families are huge hunters and they keep at least 12 guns in the house, all rifles and shotguns for different family members and different animals.
 
I didn't hear of a single mosque being vandalized, and I know there are a couple in this area as one donated money or somthing to victims on 9/11.
 
Foxtrot said:
I didn't hear of a single mosque being vandalized, and I know there are a couple in this area as one donated money or somthing to victims on 9/11.
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ya there were some vandalised


not just in the US ...I distinctly remember an incident in canada shortly after 9/11
 
The Mullinator said:
One of my best friends faimilies are huge hunters they keep at least 12 guns in the house, all rifles and shotguns for different family members and different animals.
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that's just disturbing in so many ways ..."a family that hunts together stays together"?
 
CptStern said:
that's just disturbing in so many ways ..."a family that hunts together stays together"?
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Well...that would make sense considering where humanity comes from.
 
Foxtrot said:
I didn't hear of a single mosque being vandalized, and I know there are a couple in this area as one donated money or somthing to victims on 9/11.
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Neither did I. That's because aside from a few incidents across the country there wasn't a systematic outlash against Muslims. Puppets like Pobz, you know the ones that can't think for themselves and need people like Moore to do their thinking for them, will believe anything.
 
CptStern said:
that's just disturbing in so many ways ..."a family that hunts together stays together"?
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They certainly do stick together as well, over 12 kids in that house alone although most of them are all grown up now. They still get together every year to go moose, duck, and deer hunting.

I'm just happy that out of all the people I have met they probably have the most common sense.
 
The Mullinator said:
I'm just happy that out of all the people I have met they probably have the most common sense.
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ya I guess that would be an important trait to have seeing as how they own so many guns ;)
 
Geesh, imagine human beings actually hunting for food. Sure stretches the imagination huh Stern? Has living the posh Canadian lifestyle domesticated you too much?
 
is canned hunting ..hunting for food? please, I'd like to see stats that all hunters hunt out of necessity
 
Farrowlesparrow said:
Well...that would make sense considering where humanity comes from.
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yes but we've evolved since then ..I really dont like discussing this issue cuz people tend to jump all over me when I bring up animals and hunting
 
CptStern said:
yes but we've evolved since then ..I really dont like discussing this issue cuz people tend to jump all over me when I bring up animals and hunting
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I wont jump all over you, you dont have to like hunting....thats fine.

The one thing i noticed you said then was "we've evolved since then"

Our bodies and brains are almost identical to those humans who lived 1000 years ago who hunted daily, the evolution is of soceity.....i mean you cant say that native tribes are "less evolved" because they hunt.

Its simply what you have been subjected to in your growing up, there is still a hunting instinct in humans, some people it comes out stronger than others because of the brain "over-riding" these instincts.

Hunting for food is a silly excuse in most 1st world countries.

My reasoning for hunting is for the same reason i practive survival skills, i want to prepare myself for any situation.
The only times i have not eaten my kills is when the kill is un-edible or diseased.

I dont believe in hunting with guns as such, i prefer more "natural" methods (seeing as i practice survival skills)
An example of what i will do is stay out in the wilds and get water from snow and streams and roots from the ground and then get rabbits with a spear or birds with a flail.
I think its good to sometimes have a "return to nature", i mean we have been doing that a lot longer than sitting at computers e.t.c

EDIT: Anyway, this has gone WAY off topic.......but i guess it is a "thread"
 
short recoil said:
EDIT: Anyway, this has gone WAY off topic.......but i guess it is a "thread"
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Indeed it has, I'd like to see some more on-topic discussion.
 
CptStern said:
yes but we've evolved since then ..I really dont like discussing this issue cuz people tend to jump all over me when I bring up animals and hunting
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I'm not really saying its an excuse, but its a good reason.

Not much else for me to say here, so I'l just stop...
 
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