tookie williams

Yes in an argument on MSN he just said "Statistics don't mean shit" :/
 
CptStern said:
omg, please stop lemon
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huh?



come on now, If you are proven guilty, why would u have to wait another x amount of years to be sho/thung whatever bring it over with.:flame:




4 people.......... and u guys think is has "improved" and what not... you make me puke.
 
Spicy Tuna said:
It costs more, becuase the damn supreme court has to much power.... apeal this, apeal that.IMO once tookie was found guilty>neck shot
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All hail the infallible judicial system! :borg:

also...






what's with the extra space in your posts





and the lack of capitalization........... and big pauses?







what does it all mean?
 
you dont get it..... once the state decides he/she is guilty of the charges then get it over with. BUT the surpreme court which has to much power imo. tells the state THAT ,the convicted has the right to appeal...which is ok at first BUT its not only 1 appeal it X ammount thats why tookie had the time to "imporve" himslef and write nice lil kiddie books...... which doesnt change the fact the brutally murderd 4 poeple.
 
Spicy Tuna said:
you dont get it..... once the state decides he/she is guilty of the charges then get it over with. BUT the surpreme court which has to much power imo. tells the state THAT ,the convicted has the right to appeal...which is ok at first BUT its not only 1 appeal it X ammount thats why tookie had the time to "imporve" himslef and write nice lil kiddie books...... which doesnt change the fact the brutally murderd 4 poeple.
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Spelling and punctuation FTW people!
 
english isnt my 1st language so , dont even start that game with me.





stern: thats good and all but, people that are proven guilty beyond doubt ( I think thats how you say it) should delt with right away imo



I understand your argumentation stern, but "he has improved as a person" and "he was nominated for nobel price"
So was Hitler! It just doesnt cut it.
 
Everyone that is ever convicted of a crime has, by definition, been found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. That requirement has to be made in every case. It's not some special scenario that would allow you to speed up the process. Still, as CptStern already said, "as of February 2004, 113 inmates had been found innocent and released from death row"... despite initially being found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. Obviously, something isn't working quite right if that many capital punishment cases are screwed up.
 
Spicy Tuna said:
I understand your argumentation stern, but "he has improved as a person" and "he was nominated for nobel price"
So was Hitler! It just doesnt cut it.
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:|..............what!?!?
 
Sorry, I was just slightly suprised that you had appeared to inform me Hitler was nominated for a nobel peave price and had improved as a person. Unless i'm reading your wording wrong

So, yeah, :|..............what?!?!

Edit: Oh, and in reply to your comment that I never post anything of meaning, arn't you the guy who posted about BRAIN WORMZ? God, that was an enlightening subject that benefited me, im sure you'll agree :p
 
Please always post your sources. I would also be interested in seeing when Hitler was nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize :rolleyes:
 
ummm..... I mean that people say TOOKIE ( not Hitler^^) had improved as a person.... and that he also was nominated for a peace nobel price... whic doesnt mean crap BECAUSE >Hitler> was alos nominated for a that price.




edit:eek:k u fool, I hope you will apologize when I post the source.
 
Spicy Tuna said:
stern: thats good and all but, people that are proven guilty beyond doubt ( I think thats how you say it) should delt with right away imo
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? did you read what I posted? 113 people found innocent that were on death row ..they obviously were proven guilty without a shadow of a doubt ...or they wouldnt be in death row (see this is how the justice system work, if there's any doubt to the innocence of someone he's usually found "not guilty")



Spicy Tuna said:
I understand your argumentation stern, but "he has improved as a person" and "he was nominated for nobel price"
So was Hitler! It just doesnt cut it.
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so? it's not like I was advocating for him to be released



edit: and yes Hitler was nominated for a Peace prize but it was withdrawn:

"Adolf Hitler was nominated for the Nobel Prize in Peace by E.G.C. Brandt, member of the Swedish parliament. The nomination was withdrawn in a letter of February 1, 1939"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Nobel_Prize_controversies
 
Nominations for the prize may be made by a broad array of prominent individuals, including former recipients, members of national assemblies, university professors, international judges, and special advisors to the prize committee. In some years as many as 199 nominations have been received. The nominations are kept secret by the committee which asks that nominators do the same. Over time many individuals have become known as "Nobel Peace Prize Nominees", but this designation has no official standing [2]. Nominations from 1901 to 1951 have been released in a database. When the past nominations were released it was discovered that Adolf Hitler was once nominated in 1939, though the nomination was retracted in February of the same year.



stop calling me Lemon plz, Absinthe.






http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nobel_Peace_Prize
 
Spicy Tuna said:
stop calling me Lemon plz, Absinthe.[/url]
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But you are! You are the lemon! Now and forever!

Hitler was once nominated in 1939, though the nomination was retracted in February of the same year.
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You got me there, although it is impossible to compare a fascist 1940s dictator who commited the largest genocide of all time to a man who has clearly improved. It is not right for him to have been executed, but I disagree with the death penalty altogether.
 
Absinsthe mhm...... I once thought you hate me.
Are you just making fun of me now, or what are you doing?




Sprite I would like to comment "on your comment" but then I would be banned, so.. sorry :(
 
(OFT) Yeah, weve been making fun of you for months, didn't you know? :E (OFT)

On Topic: I support the death penalty, but its situational. For example, if a man sexually assualts a girl in other country to me that ive never met before, I doubt it would affect me (As evil as that sounds). However, if the same incident had arisen and effect (Lets say) on the girl that is a close friend of mine, then I would react differently because I have an emotional connection with that person. In all fairness, if say, a member of your family is murdered, then you'll probably judge the criminal in a different way than if the victim was a faceless person to you.

It also differs depending on scale and cruelty. Again, a man instantly killing another man with a bullet to the head is a horrific crime, and the criminal deserves a life sentence, but not death. If a man kills a thousand women and children by burning them to death that I am far more likely to want his to die.

And yes, I know that it's twisted logic, but meh, its the way I am.
 
Llama said:
It also differs depending on scale and cruelty. Again, a man instantly killing another man with a bullet to the head is a horrific crime, and the criminal deserves a life sentence, but not death. If a man kills a thousand women and children by burning them to death that I am far more likely to want his to die.

And yes, I know that it's twisted logic, but meh, its the way I am.
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That's way different in scales. They both have to be executed, but the second guy... much worse.

The life sentence is quite a major punishment, about the same scale as the death sentence. Personally, I believe the life sentence is worse. I really wouldn't want to live in a prison for my whole life... That's terrible (IMO anyway).

The death sentence is usually applied to cases in which a person's life is/was threatened, or that, well, the victim is dead. That's brutal and it needs to be paid one for one. The murderer took away the victim's life. His life has to be taken for justice. (In a war, this is frikking different, though) That's quite just.

I mean, if someone close to you is murdered, then you'd wish the murderer dead. That's just it. When people are killed, others are affected (on major scale; not eating, contempleting suicide...). They wish that had never happened. They wish for the murderer to be torn apart and *beep*.

So that's why the death sentence is important. If something wrong happens, someone has to fix it up (likewise if something wrong happens in a project, someone's got to fix it up and you'd be handing up crap). Justice is the way to go in this case, and the need for punishments is extravagant.

Note: IMO. So don't flame me. It's just my belief. :smoking:

EDIT: I'm going to take an example. The country with the most executions would have to be Singapore (where I live). I don't know any other country with punishments like it.

Kidnapping -> Death sentence
Murder -> Likewise
Drug Trafficking -> Over 15g, death sentence.

Right. Now go to other states around it. Vietnam's law: Over 600g of drugs -> death sentence. That's a far cry from Singapore... it might also be just why we have the one of the lowest crime rates in the world (in other cities, walking alone at night is dangerous... not Singapore). We take crimes seriously, and of that, the crime rate here is much lower.
 
bigburpco said:
That's way different in scales. They both have to be executed, but the second guy... much worse.

The life sentence is quite a major punishment, about the same scale as the death sentence. Personally, I believe the life sentence is worse. I really wouldn't want to live in a prison for my whole life... That's terrible (IMO anyway).

The death sentence is usually applied to cases in which a person's life is/was threatened, or that, well, the victim is dead. That's brutal and it needs to be paid one for one. The murderer took away the victim's life. His life has to be taken for justice. (In a war, this is frikking different, though) That's quite just.

I mean, if someone close to you is murdered, then you'd wish the murderer dead. That's just it. When people are killed, others are affected (on major scale; not eating, contempleting suicide...). They wish that had never happened. They wish for the murderer to be torn apart and *beep*.

So that's why the death sentence is important. If something wrong happens, someone has to fix it up (likewise if something wrong happens in a project, someone's got to fix it up and you'd be handing up crap). Justice is the way to go in this case, and the need for punishments is extravagant.

Note: IMO. So don't flame me. It's just my belief. :smoking:
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Heh, likewise, I have my own opinions. For example, I think the Death penalty is far worse than a life sentence. (Not that life inprisonment isnt horrible itself) but I see where you're coming from
 
The people who don't support the death penalty would let Himmler off if he repented.
 
0mar said:
The people who don't support the death penalty would let Himmler off if he repented.
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start from the beginning of this thread and read it all ..when you're done come back and let us know if anyone was asking for Williams to be released instead of being executed
 
Yeaah! Go 0mar! Sweeping, inaccurate generalizations for the win!


Idiot.
 
0mar said:
The people who don't support the death penalty would let Himmler off if he repented.
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Wahey, nazi references right off the bat. :thumbs:
 
anyone who takes a life without a reason should die...
Edit: CptStern, why aren't you replying to my god damn pm after a day?
i'll delete this edit when you reply to it...
 
Everybody has a reason. Even if it's a phucking stupid one.
 
i edited that post three time, i was gonna put:
"and i don't mean stupid fuc|<ed up reasons like: 'i wanted to rape some girl but she didn't let me, so i killed her' or ' i felt like i should fuc|< them all, and so i did..' reasons..."
 
jerkasaur said:
anyone who takes a life without a reason should die...
Edit: CptStern, why aren't you replying to my god damn pm after a day?
i'll delete this edit when you reply to it...
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oh shit sorry ...have any idea how many PM's I get everyday? ...more than one :)
 
I don't support the death penalty, because I don't like the government killing its own citizens. No matter what.

edit:

And for all those senseless folk who think life in prison is worse than death, then why does the convict almost always appeal and fight for a life sentence? (not sure if anyone said this here, but just in case)
 
Even a wretched existence is better than an awful existance. It's part of being alive- the will to stay that way.
 
CptStern said:
I thought I answered it here:


"of whether or not lethal injection is humane? of course it is ..next to hanging or public stoning ..but put it up against something like life in prison with no chance of parole and it looks like what it is: a barbaric practice best left to punative regimes instead of enlightened ones"
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I agree, there's nothing that comes close to humane in any form of killing, unless it involves putting some sick and dying person out of their misery.

In fact having private executions in closed chambers is much worse than having hangings in the public square IMO, because then people aren't privy to the horror of it all.
 
JNightshade said:
Even a wretched existence is better than an awful existance. It's part of being alive- the will to stay that way.
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And there's people who would actually support keeping certain convicts in filthy dungeons for the rest of their lives, along with torturing or castrating them. Such would be an example of the failings of total democracy.

I <3 the Constitution and 8th Amendment.
 
0mar said:
The people who don't support the death penalty would let Himmler off if he repented.
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:|

Golden.

Nat Turner said:
I don't support the death penalty, because I don't like the government killing its own citizens. No matter what.

edit:

And for all those senseless folk who think life in prison is worse than death, then why does the convict almost always appeal and fight for a life sentence? (not sure if anyone said this here, but just in case)
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'Cause they think otherwise, and want to hang on (precariously) on life. A man who has truely repented will have accepted it in peace as it is his punishment. It doesn't make us (people who think life sentences are worse than death) senseless.
 
bigburpco said:
'Cause they think otherwise, and want to hang on (precariously) on life. A man who has truely repented will have accepted it in peace as it is his punishment. It doesn't make us (people who think life sentences are worse than death) senseless.
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Your logic is faulty and poor. Your argument is based on moral absolutism, and is therefore unsubstantiated.

Actually, you can repent and also seek life. Understanding and feeling sorry for your crime does not need to follow with a wish for death.
 
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