Comprehensive Look At Direct X10, LongHorn, And Palladium!

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They are not making anything new for Windows 98. Not even Security Patches. I think it states something about that in the article I posted.
 
I got bored reading this whole thread cuz there was a lot of flaming, and the flaming wasnt even funny. but i dunno if anyone has already said this. The thing I'm most scared about is that the longhorn platform looks like it will be able to monopolize the pc industry. I know there pretty much already doing this, but they may have absolute power and I'm not sure if they can lose in the courts with all of their funding. But the way I see it, if Microsoft doesn't like what program "X" is doing they will easily be able to make it where people can't use program "X" no matter how good it is.

Like i said if this has been mentioned before just tell me
 
Originally posted by Kschreck
They are not making anything new for Windows 98. Not even Security Patches. I think it states something about that in the article I posted.
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My only worry is that you won't even be able to use Windows Update with 98 and get the existing updates, that would royally screw over the 98 users out there.

Originally posted by willyd
I got bored reading this whole thread cuz there was a lot of flaming, and the flaming wasnt even funny. but i dunno if anyone has already said this. The thing I'm most scared about is that the longhorn platform looks like it will be able to monopolize the pc industry. I know there pretty much already doing this, but they may have absolute power and I'm not sure if they can lose in the courts with all of their funding. But the way I see it, if Microsoft doesn't like what program "X" is doing they will easily be able to make it where people can't use program "X" no matter how good it is.

Like i said if this has been mentioned before just tell me
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Yeah, I and others have been pointing out stuff like that. Not that EXACTLY, but close enough. Although, what you're saying doesn't make a ton of sense. You can disable Pallidium, also the software company that makes product "X" doesn't have to opt to require Pallidium to run the product in the first place. So, I think your concerns in that respect aren't to be worried over.
 
Originally posted by Shuzer
^^^^
READ THE ABOVE POST POSEY :)





And you know this how? Unless you're a pirate at heart :)

Anyhow, it's funny that you say stuff like the aforementioned paragraph; no one here is really concerned over not being able to pirate software. Some might have concerns over that, however, most of us are concerned over Microsoft having TOO MUCH CONTROL over what you can and can't run on your system.

Should I HAVE to run Longhorn just to play the newest games? Should I HAVE to run Longhorn to use the latest and greatest image editing software? I don't like the idea of Microsoft potentially monopolizing the software market, not just the operating system market.

Picture this: VALVe wants to make HL3 using DX10, but it's a Longhorn exclusive. VALVe gives in to that, but before Microsoft allows them to use DX10, they have to agree to make HL3 run on Pallidium only. I don't like that, at all.

Now, I'd like to see constructive replies from you, posey, not stupid posts such as "omg wut hav u piratid in teh past week?? LOLZ," it makes you look stupid. You seem to think I'm a rampant pirater because I didn't pay for Windows XP, but this isn't the case. Stop talking down to people, please.
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well at least you admit to being a pirate. thats the first step.

i know how they think because i know people in real life that pirate games, and i hear their justification and why they think that.

most games nowadays, you HAVE to have a MS os installed to play it. why aren't you complaining? hl2, you will NEED an MS OS to play it, you will NEED directx. MS already has you by the balls, do you understand this? its not going to be too much different with longhorn, then it is now, besides a drop in piracy. so if things are going to be the same, then you are afraid of longhorn because you wont be able to get free stuff anymore. dont worry though, even a job at mcdonalds can get you more than 1 game a month. its nothing to really worry about
 
Originally posted by poseyjmac
well at least you admit to being a pirate. thats the first step.

i know how they think because i know people in real life that pirate games, and i hear their justification and why they think that.

most games nowadays, you HAVE to have a MS os installed to play it. why aren't you complaining? hl2, you will NEED an MS OS to play it, you will NEED directx. MS already has you by the balls, do you understand this? its not going to be too much different with longhorn, then it is now, besides a drop in piracy. so if things are going to be the same, then you are afraid of longhorn because you wont be able to get free stuff anymore. dont worry though, even a job at mcdonalds can get you more than 1 game a month. its nothing to really worry about
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Wow, let's see how many lame "work at fast food restaurant" comments you can make :dozey:

As for me admitting I'm a pirate? Yeah, I admit I have XP pirated, but past that, I'm not a pirate. The only thing I've ever DLed and kept is vaporware. Again, stop talking down to people, also continue saying stuff like "well at least you admit to being a pirate. thats the first step." Go on, it makes you look ever so intelligent.

I have to know, have you read ANY OF THIS THREAD? My god, go back and read the previous 34 pages to see why I and others don't like the idea of Longhorn's security plan. Judging by your response here, I'd have to say you haven't read or acknowledged any of mine and other's concerns. I've said COUNTLESS TIMES that I couldn't care less if I wasn't able to pirate software. GO BACK AND READ THE THREAD, MORON.

Also, I find it quite amusing that you continue to avoid Maskirovka's posts, just like we both predicted.
 
Wow, I think that's the first time I've ever seen Shuzer flame someone. Kinda says something about how ignorant and obnoxious posey is, heh.
 
Originally posted by Shuzer
GO BACK AND READ THE THREAD, MORON.
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do you really think im going to take you seriously if you resort to name calling like a child? whatever you've said in the past few pages is null because of this. grow up and then come back when you've cooled down

but i am reporting you for flaming.
 
Originally posted by poseyjmac
do you really think im going to take you seriously if you resort to name calling like a child? whatever you've said in the past few pages is null because of this. grow up and then come back when you've cooled down

but i am reporting you for flaming.
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..oh wow. I admit I shouldn't of said that, but what else can I say? You don't acknowledge ANYTHING we've all said and you continue to go on and on about how we're all dirty pirates.

Maybe you SHOULD follow my advice and go back and read the thread, it might help you understand why I exploded. Personally, I think this thread should be locked. You're not helping anything by calling me a pirate and telling me to get a job at McDonalds, which is flaming in itself.
 
Also, posey, you're not exactly innocent of not flaming anyone, but we won't get into that.

Anyhow, maybe I should just be done with this thread, it's obvious you're not going to reply to any of the logical, well thought out posts; instead you'll reply to the ones that you feel you can take advantage of (ie. Maskirovka's post you ignored, but you replied to mine when I made that comment about my installation of XP, had I not said that, you probably wouldn't have replied at all).
 
Originally posted by GhostValkyrie
Stop it, both of you.
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Okay, okay, sorry, I'll shut up

I do apologize for calling you a moron, posey. It was out of line, I just got a wee bit too worked up :cheers:
 
haha, GV yelled at you! :LOL:
Originally posted by willyd
I got bored reading this whole thread cuz there was a lot of flaming, and the flaming wasnt even funny.
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i'm sorry willyD, i was asleep :eek: thanks, GV, though i think your admonitions are a few pages late. this type of exchange is the reason for my 'dry sarcasm'. you all know that you won't be able to impress your views on the other side of whatever the debate du jour is, yet you go on making the redundant comments, and eventually ad hominem attacks. shitballs, gimme dry sarcasm over that any day.

psst! GV, you can send the check to that p.o. box i PMd you.:dork:
 
Originally posted by Shuzer
Okay, okay, sorry, I'll shut up

I do apologize for calling you a moron, posey. It was out of line, I just got a wee bit too worked up :cheers:
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Like a true Gentleman.

/me looks at Posey.
 
Originally posted by Lil' Timmy
haha, GV yelled at you! :LOL:
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Nahhh.. GV loves me :) lol, he was perfectly within reason to tell posey and I to stop. I completely over reacted, thus my apology :)

As for the same redundant comments over and over again, LT, what else can be said? posey won't listen to anyone, he replies very selectively, no matter how hard we try
 
Originally posted by Shuzer
As for the same redundant comments over and over again, LT, what else can be said? posey won't listen to anyone, he replies very selectively, no matter how hard we try
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thats why you put the keyboard down, go get wasted, and pass the **** out.
:cheers:
 
Originally posted by Lil' Timmy
thats why you put the keyboard down, go get wasted, and pass the **** out.
:cheers:
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lol, always adding an odd twist to threads, aren't you LT? :p
 
Originally posted by Shuzer
..oh wow. I admit I shouldn't of said that, but what else can I say? You don't acknowledge ANYTHING we've all said and you continue to go on and on about how we're all dirty pirates.

Maybe you SHOULD follow my advice and go back and read the thread, it might help you understand why I exploded. Personally, I think this thread should be locked. You're not helping anything by calling me a pirate and telling me to get a job at McDonalds, which is flaming in itself.
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i never flamed. and i never told you to get a job at mcdonalds. get your facts straight. i said by getting a job at mcdonalds, you could afford to buy more than 1 pcgame a month.
 
and to be honest, its not that i choose to ignore certain posts. i just dont feel like reading every single post from 5 different people directed at me. its not like this is a homework assignment heh

why can't we just agree that there are good things and bad things associated with longhorn and palladium. because i have acknowledged the bad, but no one seems to acknowledge the good. doesn't seem like anyone here gives two shits about developers or employees in companies in general. but then, im a self-righteous asshole for thinking of other people i suppose :rolleyes:
 
Originally posted by GhostValkyrie
Like a true Gentleman.

/me looks at Posey.
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im willing to apologize, just quote me on where i offended and ill be glad. i can't remember all the freakin posts ive done these past days
 
... Edit... button...

I can't believe this thread is still here... I would have thought after the first ten utterly pointless pages this would have been closed.
 
Originally posted by CheapAssStrat
... Edit... button...

I can't believe this thread is still here... I would have thought after the first ten utterly pointless pages this would have been closed.
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X button at top right of window. it makes all the forum go away so you dont have to look at it. try it sometime
 
Originally posted by CheapAssStrat
I wasn't complaining, just sharing a thought or two.

Stop being so defensive.
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you said edit... button...

as if you were telling me how i was posting was wrong
 
You're right, I was... but you said:

Originally posted by poseyjmac
X button at top right of window. it makes all the forum go away so you dont have to look at it. try it sometime
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In regards to my second comment. That's why I said stop being so defensive.

Anyway, let it go.
 
Originally posted by CheapAssStrat
You're right, I was... but you said:



In regards to my second comment. That's why I said stop being so defensive.

Anyway, let it go.
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i wasn't acting in a defensive nature when i said that comment. was giving friendly advice :cheers:
 
Originally posted by poseyjmac
and to be honest, its not that i choose to ignore certain posts. i just dont feel like reading every single post from 5 different people directed at me. its not like this is a homework assignment heh

why can't we just agree that there are good things and bad things associated with longhorn and palladium. because i have acknowledged the bad, but no one seems to acknowledge the good. doesn't seem like anyone here gives two shits about developers or employees in companies in general. but then, im a self-righteous asshole for thinking of other people i suppose :rolleyes:
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I do agree on that, but I think the negatives out weigh the positives, but that's just me. Let's just leave it at that and be friendlies, as supertrooper (that poser :() would say :)
 
check this url out

has this url been posted here? i found it to be very comprehensive.. have a good read..

im sorry if this url has been posted before in this thread.. just not too keen on looking through 37 pages..
 
I finally got through the whole thread, yes, that's right, I read it all.
READ THIS

Some points have been made on both sides of the arguement, but I really feel the discussion isn't going the way it should, but hey, wich one does, right?!

This is about SECURITY VS PRIVACY. There, it's been said.

Both are equally important when it comes to freedom. Correct? Yes, correct.

A few points:

-If software piracy is like stealing of shelves, then monitoring and dictating conduct on your pc is like having a cop, a prosecuter, a jury and a judge constantly over your shoulder.

-Price: Markets are ruled by the SUPPLY/DEMAND ratio. If everyone buys their software instead of "stealing" it, demand will skyrocket, while supply can't possibly raise accordingly, meaning the price will go up. There is no way around that. MooCow pointed this out, but it got ignored.

-Don't get to drawn in the piracy issue, since this isn't what longhorn/palladium is about. The real thing at stake here is the free market the pc currently offers. Microsoft is trying to convert the pc-world to a microsoft-world. Macintosh is a company, while pc is a product. If longhorn goes through, pc will be equal to microsoft, meaning everyone everywhere will have to go through MS to provide anything for the pc, even when talking about hardware(palladium chips will have to be integrated in every component for the MS model to work). What gives MS the capability? Money. What gives them the right? The voices of voting citizens who don't truely grasp the meaning of all this.

-DirectX: This is the one app that can turn the tide. It would be a great achievement if this app was forced out of the hands of MS by antithrust laws, but it will never happen. Still, the mere fact that ALL multimedia apps that use it, can't possibly be ported to another platform, means MS has a very tight grip on the market, like sony over Playstation or Nintendo over Gamecube. So there, the pc just turned into a gaming-console, even tho it has so much more potencial. The last chance would be opengl, but since version 2 still isn't here after so many years, I doubt developpers will use it instead of taking the easier, cheaper, faster, and more powerfull DirectX road. But apps that are made with opengl can be ported to another platform.

-Microsoft is a company, not a charity organisation. They have boardmeetings, where they discuss and decide over the future course the company will/should take. They are not interested in people, they are interested in money. Just imagine a meeting at MS: A big room, lots of MS posters, a big table, with all the boardmembers around it. Picture it in your head. One member, standing in front of everyone, says: "Let's force the users to use this and that app with our new "thrustworthy software", so we can make more money, look at the charts here, they speak for themselves". Then, another boardmember speaks up, and says "But hey, what about our customers? Wouldn't they want the right to choose their own software, and save money by doing so?". Then, all the boardmembers have a laugh, drink champagn while taking bites of their caviar toast. Do you thrust them with your ICT-freedom?

-Lastly, I admit to having a pretty radical view on all this piracy issue. I don't believe in the current model of copyrights. It's very easy: recorded music is "waves produced by an electronic device". How the hell am I supposed to pay for that? I already paid for the electronic device, damn it. What I do, is go to concerts(I really do). Same for movies. If I think a movie will be awesome, I'll see it in the theatre. But, hey, why should I have to pay for some guys standing around in front of a camera, talking about imaginary issues and making fictionous actions? Why do these people deserve so many billion dollars? They don't(by my standards). But if the movie's worth it, I'll pay for the theatre, no doubt(again, I really do).
There are some things bigger than the law, and one of them is LIFE. I need money to survive, to prosper. I'll keep as much of it as I can, plain and simple. If you care so much about copyrightholders, I suggest you start caring about the kids dying from wars, famin, thurst, hunger and diseases in 3rd world countries.
The copyright model is old, and should be removed, plain and simple. If a musician wants to make money, he should give concerts, sell t-shirts maybe, and sell cd's to those who are WILLING to pay for it. And certainly not sue people.

Thank you for reading through this. I hope I made myself clear.
 
Actually not all games use Direct X. One of those games is Unreal Tournament 2003. It works in both Windows And Linux. I do have a question for you, Are you going to buy LongHorn?
 
here...let me quote myself and others repeatedly so maybe posey will somehow be unable to ignore the posts that are important.

i still think it's total BS that he claims to ignore some posts because there are so many directed against him. please...if you don't want so many posts directed against you, maybe you should read those posts and find out why people think you sound like an idiot.

and telling people to "go get a mcjob" is what people were offended by...it's a flame. you get up on your box and say "hard work is the only way to succeed!!!"

nobody's saying you don't need to work hard. god...of course. the point is, i don't want to work my ass off and on top of that pay microsoft to increase their grip on the computer industry's balls.

FU for telling me to "go get a job to solve all your problems"
it doesn't work that way...it just doesn't.

republicans and most religious people (which after all your responses i'm sure you're some combination of, posey) think that money solves everything (they love option B). that if only you can throw enough money at a problem it will go away. on the other hand, they don't want any people getting a "free ride" on all their hard work. so they give all the money to the rich and try to force the poor to get jobs and get off welfare.

well that doesn't work. "trickle-down" economics was horrible in the Reagan administration and it's horrible now.

====================================

anyway posey, here's the post everyone keeps saying you ignored...there are more posts by me that you ignored as well, but i pretty much summed them all up in this post, which you ignored again :\


Originally posted by Maskirovka
so, posey...if the economic reasons why prices will go down if piracy stops are "simple economics" then why is it so hard for you to tell us all about that "simple" concept?



now, you also conveniently allow for nothing to happen (i.e. prices stay the same) in your "theory" whereas before you stated that they would certainly go down to some imaginary price that would exist without piracy.

yet you again conveniently ignored several posts by people stating that games have stayed at a steady $50 US ever since the days of Nintendo.

hmm...i don't seem to remember Nintendo cartridge piracy being "rampant"

also, CD prices have always been about $16-20, yet CDs continually cost less and less to produce as the CD-stamping indurstry gets better and better at doing it. yet CD costs stay exactly the same.

how's that for simple economics?

==============================

http://shumans.com/archives/000028.php

and that proves my point about "option B" just making people want to choose the "wrong" decision even more...

when the RIAA starts suing everyone left and right, including barber shops (who let their patrons listen to music while getting their hair cut) because it was "commercial use" of their music, everyone just starts hating the RIAA for whatever reason and they cite that as reason enough to pirate music.

it's not that i think music piracy is ok just because the RIAA is corrupt or something...of course that doesn't make it right. but you do have to realize how people think and try to work within that system of though to try to change their minds.

eradicating piracy through force will only make it stay the same or get worse, just like the war on drugs.

i was talking to my mom the other day (she's 55) and she said they've been "fighting the war on drugs" since she was in high school. 40 years and they've done nothing whatsoever but waste everyone's money spraying coca crops and bullshit like that.

it's time to start trying to find the real reasons for problems instead of applying these bullshit solutions. and microsoft's palladium is one of these band-aid bullshit solutions that isn't going to stop piracy at all.

=============================

feel free to stop by #ircforum on gamesnet to discuss this or whatever else you want...everyone is welcome.
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i'll just keep quoting people who know what they're talking about.

Originally posted by OCybrManO
If you knew people would pay $50 for your product would you only charge $30 for it?

Now, IF one major publisher lowers their prices considerably... then that would force the others to either lower their own prices or lose customers.
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Originally posted by Element Alpha
(palladium chips will have to be integrated in every component for the MS model to work). What gives MS the capability? Money. What gives them the right? The voices of voting citizens (LIKE POSEYJMAC - added by Maskirovka) who don't truely grasp the meaning of all this.

-DirectX: the mere fact that ALL multimedia apps that use it, can't possibly be ported to another platform, means MS has a very tight grip on the market, . So there, the pc just turned into a gaming-console

If you care so much about copyrightholders, I suggest you start caring about the kids dying from wars, famin, thurst, hunger and diseases in 3rd world countries.
The copyright model is old, and should be removed, plain and simple. If a musician wants to make money, he should give concerts, sell t-shirts maybe, and sell cd's to those who are WILLING to pay for it. And certainly not sue people.
Click to expand...
 
posey, please don't ignore the most important posts again...it's a little suspicious.
 
Hey, guys, did you notice posey is the only one pro-longhorn?

He can't answer every post!

There are over 500 of them.

And no, I don't plan to just bend over and spread my legs for microsoft's long "horn".

EDIT: Let posey be. It's clear he doesn't know what he's talking about. I read it all. Idiocy has been promoted before him, and before those that came before, and so on. Just let it be. Try to stick to to the topic, or make a thread discussing posey, maybe PM him, but the best is to just let it be. Come on, say it with me: "Let it be".
 
yeah but he seems to read all the posts and only ignore the questions people repeatedly ask. Oh, and he also ignores when people point out the inaccurate things he posts.

i pretty much summed the important arguments up, but he ignored those...which is why i quoted myself and others in an effort to get him to read the important points.

but by the time he gets back, he'll probably have a bunch of other posts to read between mine and his and he'll ignore mine because it's long...and he loves option B, so he won't even read, let alone understand anything that disagrees with it...just like i predicted.
 
Can somone give me a clear answer to this question:

Will a PC with palladium built in run Linux without interfereing with the Linux operateing system?

Microsoft can do whatever they want to windows as long as they don't **** Linux up. If Linux can't be run on Palladium hardware I'll only buy non Palladium hardware. If windows Longhorn only runs on Palladium hardware then I won't use Longhorn and I'm not going to pay for it regardless.

I think Microsoft will allow Longhorn to be run on non Palladium systems as they have said that Longhorn will have back compatibility, which makes the whole situation alot less worrying.
 
Hey cool, your back! mind if i join in?

Edit: LOL my post went above yours :p
 
Originally posted by Element Alpha


A few points:

-If software piracy is like stealing of shelves, then monitoring and dictating conduct on your pc is like having a cop, a prosecuter, a jury and a judge constantly over your shoulder.



-Don't get to drawn in the piracy issue, since this isn't what longhorn/palladium is about.
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1. then its happening today. as most games only run on a MS os, and more and more games only support directx. does this have you up in arms? an online cdkey check is a policeman checking to see if you have bought a legit product, this policeman doesn't trust that you will have it tomorrow, but checks WHENEVER you want to play online. doesn't this piss you off?

2. if you ignore the piracy issue, you are ignoring one of the main benefits to longhorn and palladium. if it weren't for this system, i wouldn't be so stoked about longhonr/palladium. but this means companies can now get what they deserve. are you guys THAT selfish to regard that as trifle? nevermind dont answer that.
 
Originally posted by Maskirovka
go gooooo ignoooring
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some people have things to do besides this forum, like WORKING, and STUDYING for classes. so just calm down your bitter self.
 
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