Half-Life 2? What a disappointment ...

[DarkDude]

HL2 has (or at least tries to have) more developed characters, and character interaction. The story has been made larger. It simply does not work that Gordon is mute. It leads to completely ridicilous situations. What's the point of having all these high-tech animated characters if Gordon has no response to them? Gordon could find out what's going on by simply ASKING someone. Or someone could tell him. Gordon doesn't even wonder where he is or why over a decade has suddenly gone by. It was different in Half-Life, because no one knew what was going on, and it didn't matter much because the only thing you had to worry about was to get out.

What's the point? To make the game more likelife and believable without making Gordon talk? To be able to understand the hidden meanings and sarcasm behind what the characters are saying? To make communication between NPCs a sight to behold? Well, we know it's most certainly not to assist Gordon with speaking.

Why do you even want him to talk in the first place? Did you actually expect him to? It seems that no one but you wants him to talk, so the very fact that this is an issue is absurd. Gordon could've also asked the stray scientists in HL to point the way out, but he didn't. I also think you're forgetting something, you're suppose to be Gordon in the game. It's not him that should be wondering, it should be you.

Oh, and you very much DIDN'T know what was going on in HL. All you knew was that you put some mineral object into the mass spectrometer and all hell broke loose. Most other things were pretty much just assumptions thought up by the gamers who played it. Oh wow, that's just what's happening with HL2's story! Surprise, surprise eh?

 

[cereal]

*didn't read the thread, just first post*

Look buddy, don't make such a huge statement about the game when you're barely an eighth done with the game. You're so early in if youre still on the airboat!

 

[substrate001]

It would benefit my overall experience in-game if Gordon could talk and make decisions, ala the original DeusEx. That said, HL2 is by far the coolest game I've ever played. The original HL converted me from console to PC gaming, and I never looked back! I'm already halfway thru HL2 for the second time, finding new secrets and places along the way...

 

[gcomeau]

I wanted to give a game a fair shot... so I stayed up playing it last night. Doom 3 really kept me on the edge of my seat, it was dark and moody and you always wondered what was going to happen next.

A scary monster jumps out of the dark at you.

Sorry if I ruined the surprise for anyone.

 

[OD-Black_Fire]

Shut the **** up, retard fanboy. Crawl back to your hole.

Nice. Just nice. Hell, you didn't even answer any questions in it. You just picked me out individualy and flammed me. I wonder why you didn't answer my question about your opinion on Star Trek, Star Wars, and the book Raft.

 

[Lt. Drebin]

Just a little addition.

I see science fiction elements in HL2, but the story is not science fiction. You guys follow.

I know what Spartan is saying, I think. The story in HL2 is not science fiction. It's not. "1984" has science fiction elements, but it is not a science fiction story....it's a story of rebellion...slavery, etc. Breaking control of others.

An element does not define a story.

 

[Lt. Drebin]

A scary monster jumps out of the dark at you.

Sorry if I ruined the surprise for anyone.

That must be the abridged, I'm a complete and utter smartass version. Objective work my friend.

 

[gcomeau]

That must be the abridged, I'm a complete and utter smartass version.

Ahh... you've played it too!

Objective work my friend.

Why thank you. But to be serious for a moment, let's just say we place our hypothetical Doom3 player at a randomly selected point in the game and he's wondering what happens next.

Would you bet money my answer was wrong?

 

[HadouKen24]

I know what Spartan is saying, I think. The story in HL2 is not science fiction. It's not. "1984" has science fiction elements, but it is not a science fiction story....it's a story of rebellion...slavery, etc. Breaking control of others.

I disagree. It's an extrapolation to a possible future from what was the present when he wrote the book. That's science fiction.

The fact that it's about rebellion, slavery, and domination doesn't really make a difference. To call something science fiction tells us the device it uses to explore the issues it brings up. It doesn't tell us what the issues are.

And "Animal Farm" is fantasy.

 

[Lt. Drebin]

You just made my point. The elements of science fiction are tools in themselves used to explore a story. True, science fiction doesn't tell us the issues, but the issues are what defines the story.

HL2 is a narative about a man against daunting odds, trying to free the last remnants of society. The fact that he's surrounded by aliens adds science fiction elements, but it does not come close to or become the end all of the story. I think what Spartan was trying to say, but didn't, was that we are defining a story with a genre. Domination, slavery, rebellion are elements of the story itself which utilizes science fiction.

About "1984", it is exactly what you said. Thats the genre. You said nothing of the story, or what the book is all about. You described aspects of setting. What I was trying to say is that there is no such thing as a science fiction story. There is only the story set in a science fiction based universe.

 

[Lt. Drebin]

But to be serious for a moment, let's just say we place our hypothetical Doom3 player at a randomly selected point in the game and he's wondering what happens next.

And if we picked a random point in HL2, could Gordon guess the Combine would be in hot pursuit?

Would you bet money I'm wrong?

I'm not knocking HL2, but rather putting it in the same light. Something I struggled with while playing HL2. But I like elements of the supernatural in my games, so I have an affinity to Doom 3. I still liked both games.

 

[Kalevi]

Half-Life2,off-line play

You are not the only one dissapointed with half-life2.
I paid A$89.95 for the damn thing, after messing about with it for several hours and using up countless internet hours,i woke up to what was going on. Half-life2 must be just a weird download manager. It updates,it decrypts,and it costs you more money every time you want to play,it is not a game at all,you ca'nt play it. I solved all problems and saved some money by taking it back to the retailer for a full refund.
Why should anyone after buying a game have to encrypt,update and validate ,etc files and start paying up again.
Lotta F...... crap, but then steam is just hot air is'nt it.
Kalevi

 

[O.G. GOaT]

Just a little addition.

I see science fiction elements in HL2, but the story is not science fiction. You guys follow.

I know what Spartan is saying, I think. The story in HL2 is not science fiction. It's not. "1984" has science fiction elements, but it is not a science fiction story....it's a story of rebellion...slavery, etc. Breaking control of others.

An element does not define a story.

The story of half-life 2 is science fiction. Yes there are aliens and technology that dose not exist yet, and yes they are basic elements of science fiction, there are more elements of science fiction found in half-life2. Half-life2’s narrative is based on a fictitious world based on a possible future for our society, this is science fiction. Your role in a game is not necessarily the plot of the game. Your role in half-life2 is to bring order to chaos (save the earth, save humanity), the rebellion and slavery are just the visible impact of the change in society in the future. you have to look at the bigger picture. your role may not be science-fiction, but the world your playing in, the story your role is based in, is science fiction.


this is what spartan views as science-fiction, and i feel half-life2 meets this criteria.

I will define science fiction, first, by saying what sf is not. It cannot be defined as "a story (or novel or play) set in the future," since there exists such a thing as space adventure, which is set in the future but is not sf: it is just that: adventures, fights and wars in the future in space involving super-advanced technology. Why, then, is it not science fiction? It would seem to be, and Doris Lessing (e.g.) supposes that it is. However, space adventure lacks the distinct new idea that is the essential ingredient. Also, there can be science fiction set in the present: the alternate world story or novel. So if we separate sf from the future and also from ultra-advanced technology, what then do we have that can be called sf?

We have a fictitious world; that is the first step: it is a society that does not in fact exist, but is predicated on our known society; that is, our known society acts as a jumping-off point for it; the society advances out of our own in some way, perhaps orthogonally, as with the alternate world story or novel. It is our world dislocated by some kind of mental effort on the part of the author, our world transformed into that which it is not or not yet. This world must differ from the given in at least one way, and this one way must be sufficient to give rise to events that could not occur in our society -- or in any known society present or past. There must be a coherent idea involved in this dislocation; that is, the dislocation must be a conceptual one, not merely a trivial or bizarre one -- this is the essence of science fiction, the conceptual dislocation within the society so that as a result a new society is generated in the author's mind, transferred to paper, and from paper it occurs as a convulsive shock in the reader's mind, the shock of dysrecognition. He knows that it is not his actual world that he is reading about.

Now, to separate science fiction from fantasy. This is impossible to do, and a moment's thought will show why. Take psionics; take mutants such as we find in Ted Sturgeon's wonderful MORE THAN HUMAN. If the reader believes that such mutants could exist, then he will view Sturgeon's novel as science fiction. If, however, he believes that such mutants are, like wizards and dragons, not possible, nor will ever be possible, then he is reading a fantasy novel. Fantasy involves that which general opinion regards as impossible; science fiction involves that which general opinion regards as possible under the right circumstances. This is in essence a judgment-call, since what is possible and what is not possible is not objectively known but is, rather, a subjective belief on the part of the author and of the reader.

Now to define good science fiction. The conceptual dislocation -- the new idea, in other words -- must be truly new (or a new variation on an old one) and it must be intellectually stimulating to the reader; it must invade his mind and wake it up to the possibility of something he had not up to then thought of. Thus "good science fiction" is a value term, not an objective thing, and yet, I think, there really is such a thing, objectively, as good science fiction.

I think Dr. Willis McNelly at the California State University at Fullerton put it best when he said that the true protagonist of an sf story or novel is an idea and not a person. If it is good sf the idea is new, it is stimulating, and, probably most important of all, it sets off a chain-reaction of ramification-ideas in the mind of the reader; it so-to-speak unlocks the reader's mind so that that mind, like the author's, begins to create. Thus sf is creative and it inspires creativity, which mainstream fiction by-and-large does not do. We who read sf (I am speaking as a reader now, not a writer) read it because we love to experience this chain-reaction of ideas being set off in our minds by something we read, something with a new idea in it; hence the very best science fiction ultimately winds up being a collaboration between author and reader, in which both create -- and enjoy doing it: joy is the essential and final ingredient of science fiction, the joy of discovery of newness.
(in a letter) May 14,1981

 

[Lt. Drebin]

Again. Thats genre.

The story as I said is set in a science fiction universe...You described nothing of the story.

Science fiction is not a story.

 

[O.G. GOaT]

Again. Thats genre.

The story as I said is set in a science fiction universe...You described nothing of the story.

Science fiction is not a story.

OMG! I think you are confused because what you just said makes no sense to me! (sorry)

The story is set in the HALF-LIFE universe, a universe that contains the codes and conventions of SCIENCE FICTION! Science-fiction is a genre That defines a story, science fiction is not a story in its self!

What we are debating is weather half-life fits in the science-fiction GENRE! Which im saying it does!
The half-life 2 story contains strong science fiction codes, which makes it fit into the science fiction genre.

If you read my last couple of posts carefully, I described how the story fits in the sci-fi genre.

when we say a story is science fiction, we mean it fits into the science fiction genre!, thats were you might be getting confused! :E

 

[RestInPeas]

Read, accept it and stop arguing about nothing, please...
It's become very off topic and boring.

science fiction
n.

A literary or cinematic genre in which fantasy, typically based on speculative scientific discoveries or developments, environmental changes, space travel, or life on other planets, forms part of the plot or background.

Source: The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.
Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.

---
science fiction

n : literary fantasy involving the imagined impact of science on society

Source: WordNet ® 2.0, © 2003 Princeton University

Personally I find neither d3 og hl2 very disappointing, though somethings were far from what I expected. If I had to choose one over the other, I'd say hl2 disappointed the most, but then I didn't expect much from the doom-series!
I was hoping for a deeper story in hl2, but maybe it will come in expansions..

 

[StAtiC]

All that from someone who didn't finish the game. People worry me.

EDIT see signature :thumbs:
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/

 

[booogerhead]

the story in hl2 will only be as deep as you wish to delve. and believe you me, it can go far deeper than "omg we is teh escapzoring from combinez, and theres some other peoplz wit us!" i'd be willing to bet that the more observant you are, the more you'd enjoy hl2 (or enjoyed, seeing as that can be an option).

 

[Lt. Drebin]

OMG! I think you are confused because what you just said makes no sense to me! (sorry)

The story is set in the HALF-LIFE universe, a universe that contains the codes and conventions of SCIENCE FICTION! Science-fiction is a genre That defines a story, science fiction is not a story in its self!

What we are debating is weather half-life fits in the science-fiction GENRE! Which im saying it does!
The half-life 2 story contains strong science fiction codes, which makes it fit into the science fiction genre.

If you read my last couple of posts carefully, I described how the story fits in the sci-fi genre.

when we say a story is science fiction, we mean it fits into the science fiction genre!, thats were you might be getting confused! :E

No. I'm not confused.

You just repeated exactly what I said in my last 3 posts. Everyone debating this in this thread has been calling it a science fiction story, when they're clearly refering to elements of genre.

You see this whole thread exploded because EricIce said he didn't care for the story. Since then, he's been the only person to mention a single element of the story while everyone else decide it to be a debate about genre while calling it the story.

I'm not confused at all. I just thought that 9 pages of discussion off topic needed direction.

Again. I like HL2, but I find the story of liberation to be a bit played out. I would have liked to see a different direction. Great game nontheless.

 

[Camon_Draconis]

Even Doom 3 is better than Half-Life 2 ... at least Doom 3 kept me on the edge of my seat and the storyline told through PDA's kept me interested enought to finish the game. And not to mention Doom 3's dark errie levels... which I cut the lights off in my computer game room and played the game in the dark. (much like I did with the Thief series)

this alone shows your stupidity. how can you compare doom 3's "story" to half life 2!?!?!? seriosouly! nothing like running in a stright line down a pitch black corridorr and every second, the same exact imp jumps around the corner. and just when you think that the imps are gone BAM!! another imp!

 

[badenglishihave]

Nothing like Half Life 2's story compared to Doom3's - Look up BAM two enemies: kill them, BAM 3 more enemies. OBVIOUSLY HL2's story is better. I've played both games now. I like both. I don't like either story a whole lot.


BTW to the prick who started talking about the entire Doom3 experience being "OMG there could be an imp around the corner OMG"... PLAY THE GAME. id incorporates sound beautifully into the experience, along with the obvious use of shadowing, architecture, and monster design created to SCARE you. I got one word for you - Hell. You haven't really been afraid till you've tried to shoot down a Hellknight in Hell. That's the point of the game. HL2 != trying to scare you all the time so get over it.

 

[smokeyassassin]

Doom 3 can't compare to HL2, simple fact.
Doom 3 kept me on the edge of my seat, happily blasting away in a clearly science fantasy based game, where HL2 had me, it simply had me. It involved me in the game so much I found my self moving between the edge of my seat, to slouching then back to the edge of my seat.
The time spent slouching wasn't wasted, it was spent thinking, working out what it was I was seeing, both visually and under the surface. The game works amazingly on all levels, visually stunning, with range and depth, and mentally challenging, leaving questions in my mind, refusing to answer them, yet!

Doom 3 on the other hand, a flashlight simulator, as someone accurately described it, so disappointing, and it never changed, so you got new weapons every so often, there was loads of back tracking if you wanted to finish the game completely, but no real exploration of world or mind.

And if you got stuck on hl2 then I'm sorry to say that it failed to suck you in to its reality or more than likely your just plainly lame.

 

[Tantalus]

HL2> Doom III.

Doom III was well done, in my opinion.

HL2 was done much weller.

 

[Expansion Pack]

Well i just finished HL2 and thought it was very good game wise,but problem wise(crashing,Stuttering,game not avaliable)stuff have soiled my enjoyment overall of HL2.

Game play i cannot fault it,brilliant,brilliant,brilliant.
Technology problem wise it really tried my patience to the bone and now its completed its gome from my harddrive along with steam.

What is it with games these days,Doom III was too dark and got repeditive, although when you did see something it looked great, and had some great moments but these were few and far between,and HL2 was brilliant beyond words, but was knocked on its arse by stupid bugs and problems that just should not have been there.
Still they are history now,time to move into the next ones.

 

[badenglishihave]

I beg to differ; It's time for mods. Doom3 expansions with more lighting, and Half-Life 2 expansions with more enemies and weapons.

 

[O.G. GOaT]

No. I'm not confused.

You just repeated exactly what I said in my last 3 posts. Everyone debating this in this thread has been calling it a science fiction story, when they're clearly refering to elements of genre.

You see this whole thread exploded because EricIce said he didn't care for the story. Since then, he's been the only person to mention a single element of the story while everyone else decide it to be a debate about genre while calling it the story.

I'm not confused at all. I just thought that 9 pages of discussion off topic needed direction.

Again. I like HL2, but I find the story of liberation to be a bit played out. I would have liked to see a different direction. Great game nontheless.

For crying out loud man! If a story contains elements of science fiction, its is classed as science fiction, what you are saying makes no sense!

Genre is just another word for classification.

The half-life2 story is about Earth being invaded by a technological superior alien race who has sent the human race to the brink of extinction and have enslaved the rest. You play the role of Gordon freeman, who is on the run from an army of genetically modified human cyborg’s. you then trigger a human uprising against their alien masters.

If that’s not a science fiction story, then what is?
Yes it contains science fiction elements, that is what makes it a science fiction story. A non science-fiction story contain no elements of science fiction!

When you hear reviews or people discussing films such as the matrix, terminator, pitch black, etc, they don’t say “it’s a story of such and such that contains elements of science fiction,”

I hope this is the last of the science fiction talk!

 

[Lt. Drebin]

The story is a narrative about Gordon Freeman who leads a revolt against an evil enslaving force.

It is in the science fiction genre. It's a matter of wording. I know what you mean when you say it's a sceince fiction story, but that wasn't even what this thread was about.

EricIce started this by talking about the story in HL2 and it turned into a genre discussion. The fact that aliens are our enslavers does nothing to effect the underlying story. It's still about uprising and revolution whether it's the British and America, aliens and City 17, Romans and their whole empire, etc. Do yo understand what I'm saying?

It's obvious that HL2 is in science fiction genre. I'm not arguing that. But it's relatively irrelavant to the underlying story. It's only a descrption of elements and tools. The only reason I made my posts was because the last person to discuss an element of the ACTUAL story was was the first poster of this thread.

When you hear reviews or people discussing films such as the matrix, terminator, pitch black, etc, they don’t say “it’s a story of such and such that contains elements of science fiction

They don't say it like that all the time, but thats what it is. I only made my commments, because there was 9 pages on a complete miswording. You have the original poster discussing the story and everyone else debating whether or not HL2 was in the sci-fi genre, a completely ludicrous debate. I never argued that HL2 wasn't in the sci-fi genre but few in this thread have discussed the story. HL2 is 100% sci-fi, but I think the story is lacking...to me it was an easy way out after Black Mesa and I'm not into the whole uprising/revollution stories--they're a bit played out. Still a great game.

 

[Lt. Drebin]

how can you compare doom 3's "story" to half life 2!?!?!? seriosouly! nothing like running in a stright line down a pitch black corridorr and every second, the same exact imp jumps around the corner. and just when you think that the imps are gone BAM!! another imp!

Wow, you really captured the story with that post. Anyway..

Half-Life 2 is NOTHING at all like that. *cough*COMBINE*cough*. No sir, no recurring elements or characters in HL2.

If you want to talk about the story, talk about it. Don't flame an element that exists in both games then say one is better than the other.

 

[Olograph]

I've been disappointed when I finished HL2.......****..... half of the scenes were cut ....it's the same for the guns and the story is really cheap and underdeveloped.

Seriously.......I think that the fact that there's a lot of missing things is because valve had a big rush to finish the game. It's not the normal development of a game like some stupid ass holes said!

Wake up in the alpha there were like 30 different weapons and they showed a lot of things in the official videos that they're not in the game... I'm sure that there's a link with the big delay of HL2, with how the game is now and with the shareholders of valve that forced gabe to release the game earlier!

 

[Mechagodzilla]

Olograph is the Michael Moore of video gaming. Only he can unravel this conspiracy!

Hints: Every game has something cut from it. Most of the bink scenes were kept but modified, 30 weapons is more than anyone would use, and the enemies they cut were sucky.

Oh snap, I just solved the entire mystery.

 

[Kommie]

Olograph is the Michael Moore of video gaming. Only he can unravel this conspiracy!

Hints: Every game has something cut from it. Most of the bink scenes were kept but modified, 30 weapons is more than anyone would use, and the enemies they cut were sucky.

Oh snap, I just solved the entire mystery.

You win!!! But comeon man "Oh Snap"? That shit was dumb four years ago. Unless of course you mean it in a joking/sarcastic way in that case its funny!
-edit-
Actually I see you are canadian, maybe it is popular there. I dont know.

 

[Mechagodzilla]

Thanks to sarcasm's power to undermine actual meaning, I'm part of the reason why the phrase became dumb four years ago. Hooray!

 

[DESSTROYER]

Half Life 2 is a typical FPS - go here, run there, in the sewer ... play catch with the dog... while it is fun... I admit. The story just isn't there, that grabs you and holds you to the game. There's nothing really pushing you to complete the levels...

EricIce

and doom3 is what? you go around shoot zombies run some more push a button talk to a guy he dies kill zombies meet new enemy kill demons kill zombies push button talk to guy, guy dies, shoot demons ETC.

 

[Styloid]

Sometimes I don't know what people look for in a story-- would you criticize Pulp Fiction for being a bunch of random events barely linked together? I hope not. HL2 had a good, and more importantly, natural feeling story that was told really well. It recognized that FPS's must tell a story differently than hollywood movies.

I think the fact that the game reacts to how you play is something we've forgotten about. If you are looking for story and immersing yourself, you would know about how Dr.Breen arranged the surrender of the humans in the 7 Hour war, that the picture of Eli's family on the shelf beside the computer was the only thing he took from Black Mesa or that Ravenholm was used by City17 escapees as a refuge until the Combined shelled it. However, if you wanted to play it like any other game, Valve let you do that by letting you gun through the whole game and just have a fun time. Valve gave you the options: deeper story and immersion or just running through some awesome action sequences, don't blame them for your own decision.

 

[Danimal]

maybe I should finish the game

Yea finish the game before you whine about it :naughty:

The airboat part is still a little boring until you get the mounted gun on it