Ever taken drugs?

[Reaktor4]

Legalizing everything would make things worse or things would stay the same. Take Amsterdam, for example; every knows it's drug central and a lot of Europe blames their drug problems on Amsterdam.

http://www.drugwarfacts.org/thenethe.htm

People want what they can't have. If you legalize maurijuana, then people would move on to cocain and e-pills. If you legalize those, then something else would become the 'big thing'.

And if you legalised everything...?
Anyway that doesnt make sense. As has been pointed out many times the more liberal countries have less users of all drugs. If what you said was true heroin and coke etc would be a huge problem in holland, but... http://www.drugwarfacts.org/thenethe.htm

Also, if you legalize cocain or marijuana, then you'd have THRICE the amount of auto accidents, chemically impaired incidents, and so forth.

http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=5450

You'd have people going to work and getting high while they're on duty. Sure, there may be a rule that prohibits them from doing so, but that doesn't mean everybody will obey the rules.

So why doesnt everyone go to work drunk now then?
Of course you will always have irresponsible people doing irresponsible things, but it would be a very small percentage of people going to work high, especially if the number of users was lower.

 

[Reaktor4]

Yup, and alcohol is legal.. and look at the amount of deaths, fights, illnesses and addiction related trouble is linked to booze.

So legal or not, drugs are a bad idea.

Alcohol by its very nature causes people to act like that. Thats not a fair comparison. I cant think of an illegal drug that has those effects anywhere near the percentage of time that alcohol does.
And the addiction thing, alcohol is THE hardest drug to quit once addicted and by far the most dangerous to be addicted to, as withdrawals can actually kill you.

 

[RRunner]

Cmon drugs arent good 4 you, you have to an utter moron to think that. But oh how i miss them ... the longing cant even be described, it is a happy green fairy land filled with chocolate, coca cola and 20 grams of a good standard marok, pizza and video film, smoking blunts non stop....(im actually shaking writting this lolololol), my god how i miss doing drugs (making that long soft fall through the sofa, into a buitiful black void of absolut peace and tranqulity, but thats also what keeps me from doing it.

Drugs and a normal life dosent mix well. Its either the one or the other, you cant have both.

Bah for party hippies.....thats not doing drugs, thats like standing in the tivoli and not trying the rollercoaster. But most eventually try the rollercoaster, and just simply cant forget the ride or stay on it afraid to get off, scared of what they might miss.

 

[The Dark Elf]

Alcohol by its very nature causes people to act like that. Thats not a fair comparison. I cant think of an illegal drug that has those effects anywhere near the percentage of time that alcohol does.
And the addiction thing, alcohol is THE hardest drug to quit once addicted and by far the most dangerous to be addicted to, as withdrawals can actually kill you.

Your kidding right? You must be just screwing around now.. Surely?


You really need to go visit a few drug dens, or talk to people who are on drugs, i think you'll get a nasty shock, the effects can and are much worse than those brought on by booze.

 

[Reaktor4]

With your last comment, now you do.

Nope, what does something being newsworthy have to do with the amount of drug users in a given country?

 

[The Dark Elf]

Nope, what does something being newsworthy have to do with the amount of drug users in a given country?

It's where your getting your "facts" from.. hence the inaccuracy of your statements.

 

[Reaktor4]

Your kidding right? You must be just screwing around now.. Surely?


You really need to go visit a few drug dens, or talk to people who are on drugs, i think you'll get a nasty shock, the effects can and are much worse than those brought on by booze.

How so?

 

[Maxi]

Drugs are bad, mmmkay?

 

[The Dark Elf]

How so?

You appear to be under the illusion that drugs aren't harmful. Yet people who _have_ taken them in the past who have real world experiences are met with your comments that basically they/we are wrong. Now I know bliink and PiMuRho and neither of them would ever lie about something like that.

They, as do I and others who've posted in this thread have personal experience ourselves and seeing it first hand, enough experience to know the effects from it, and that its nothing to do with the price of drugs or how to get them.. What is so hard to understand about that?

 

[MadHatter]

http://www.drugwarfacts.org/thenethe.htm

That's a really cute link, but using a biased site and info isn't going to further your argument.

And if you legalised everything...?
Anyway that doesnt make sense. As has been pointed out many times the more liberal countries have less users of all drugs. If what you said was true heroin and coke etc would be a huge problem in holland, but... http://www.drugwarfacts.org/thenethe.htm

Gosh darn, there goes that link again. Whatever shall I do. If it doesn't make sense then why did you say, "Yes", when I asked if you believe everything should be legalized? If I recall, heroin and cocain aren't legalized in Holland... Unless I'm wrong. Correct me if I am.

http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=5450

So why doesnt everyone go to work drunk now then?
Of course you will always have irresponsible people doing irresponsible things, but it would be a very small percentage of people going to work high, especially if the number of users was lower.

Alcohol is a regulated luxury, yes. And why would the users of marijuana be less in numbers as opposed to alcohol users?

It's a law of nature, people want what they can't get.

I'll repeat it again. Currently, we have one main legal drug that causes deaths and problems -- alcohol. Lets add heroin and opium to the equation. Add 1 + 2 = 3. Now you have THREE contributors to impairment and the ramifications that succeed it.

Legalizing every drug would be like allowing every person to carry a gun with them in public. People cannot be trusted.

 

[Reaktor4]

You appear to be under the illusion that drugs aren't harmful.

Quote?

 

[The Dark Elf]

Quote?

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/search.php?searchid=176447

 

[MadHatter]

Alcohol by its very nature causes people to act like that. Thats not a fair comparison. I cant think of an illegal drug that has those effects anywhere near the percentage of time that alcohol does.
And the addiction thing, alcohol is THE hardest drug to quit once addicted and by far the most dangerous to be addicted to, as withdrawals can actually kill you.

If you cannot think of any illegal drug that has relative causes to what Dark Elf posted then you are seriously lying to yourself. Very fair comparison. You denounce alcohol to be the most lethal drug and then you deny it of sharing similar qualities of other lethal drugs and say it's not a fair comparison. HAH!

 

[PvtRyan]

Yep, but the point seems to be getting ignored by him hehehe

Well, I'll just dissect his post again. Makes me sorta tired, but meh.

Legalizing everything would make things worse or things would stay the same. Take Amsterdam, for example; every knows it's drug central and a lot of Europe blames their drug problems on Amsterdam.

First things first: Marihuana is NOT legal, it's tolerated. There are restrictions on the use of it.
And what does our tolerance of marihuana have to do with the drug problems of the rest of Europe? Cocaine, heroine are all still illegal, those are the export drugs of countries, marihuana doesn't get exported (tourists come to Amsterdam for it) and if it does, exportation and fabrication of it in large quantities is ILLEGAL. That has absolutely NOTHING to do with the use of marihuana on personal basis.
Out biggest drugs problem is XTC, and guess what? It's illegal.

Drug capitals of hard drugs are still Columbia and Afghanistan.

People want what they can't have. If you legalize maurijuana, then people would move on to cocain and e-pills. If you legalize those, then something else would become the 'big thing'.

Yeah, I know what you mean, everyone I knew that had a sip of alcohol once, or smoked a sigarette is now a shivering crackhead in an alley. It's a sad world. There's no reason why you would take on heavy drugs when you used lighter ones.

Also, if you legalize cocain or marijuana, then you'd have THRICE the amount of auto accidents, chemically impaired incidents, and so forth.

Ha, you're funny. First of all, you're equaling marihuana to cocaine, but their effects are very different in scale and severity.

And do tell me, how many cases of 'father comes home stoned, beats up his kids, beats up his wife' have you heard?

There's no reason why suddenly car accidents would triple while you've been able to get behind the wheel drunk for years. And your driving skills on marihuana don't plummet as much like they do with alcohol.

You'd have people going to work and getting high while they're on duty. Sure, there may be a rule that prohibits them from doing so, but that doesn't mean everybody will obey the rules.

Stop it, you're killing me!

I don't know how the things are there with you, but I've never seen someone stoned at his job, neither like I have seen someone drunk on their job, while there should be plenty of those by your reasoning.

It's kinda funny that everyone thinks we here are stoned 24/7. While facts have shown that a smaller percentage of the youth here has used marihuana than for example in the UK or the US.

 

[MadHatter]

Alcohol by its very nature causes people to act like that. Thats not a fair comparison. I cant think of an illegal drug that has those effects anywhere near the percentage of time that alcohol does.
And the addiction thing, alcohol is THE hardest drug to quit once addicted and by far the most dangerous to be addicted to, as withdrawals can actually kill you.

Some alcohol is actually healthy for people. Alcohol ABUSE is the killer.

 

[Reaktor4]

That's a really cute link, but using a biased site and info isn't going to further your argument.

Biased? Ffs, the sources are quoted and include the american government.
So what youre saying is, if those statistics are right, im right?

Gosh darn, there goes that link again. Whatever shall I do. If it doesn't make sense then why did you say, "Yes", when I asked if you believe everything should be legalized?

Because thats the truth. Thats not what you asked before that.

If I recall, heroin and cocain aren't legalized in Holland... Unless I'm wrong. Correct me if I am.

Even cannabis isnt legal in holland, but the point is holland is much more tolerant. And it works, as shown by the figures. They arent allowed to legalise because of the un.

Alcohol is a regulated luxury, yes. And why would the users of marijuana be less in numbers as opposed to alcohol users?

It's a law of nature, people want what they can't get.

And keeping everything illegal helps in that case?

I'll repeat it again. Currently, we have one main legal drug that causes deaths and problems -- alcohol. Lets add heroin and opium to the equation. Add 1 + 2 = 3. Now you have THREE contributors to impairment and the ramifications that succeed it.

So its more likely for heroin to kill someone if theyre using a clean needle, proper taught injection technique, accurate dosage of a pure drug, than using an old needle, poor technique and dangerously dirty drugs which they dont even know the potency of?
I think youre forgetting the "clean heroin does no permanent physical damage" part of the heroin post.

Legalizing every drug would be like allowing every person to carry a gun with them in public. People cannot be trusted.

So everyone is gonna start using every drug then, thats what you mean?
This is getting tedious.

 

[burner69]

Drugs are obviously a controversial subject.
I've done Coke, and pills - neither of the two I'm proud to say I did - but it was an experience. I really enjoyed tripping out, it was possibily the strangest/ most surreal/ one off/ happy/ bizarre events in my life. FFS a toilet spoke to me :angel:

But when it comes to weed I find people's view very odd.
Why, exactly, do you think smoking weed is bad?
Fair enough, done in excess amounts can lead to paranoia, and other such problems, but anything done is excess has problems.

Weed is the most sociable thing I do. Laugh if you want, but if you do you've clearly never had a good smoke with people. Do you pass a pint round in the pub? Hell no. And... when you get pissed what do you do? Fall over, become loud, often get violent or upset, and according to statistics, are more likely to commit crimes.
What do you get when high? The giggles. A desire to talk very deeply about matters. You become pretty much totally honest with your friends and yourself. Has anyone ever has any trouble off someone whos stoned? I doubt it. But drunk... I bet there are quite a few.

If you think that weed leads you on to harder drugs, again, I'd disagree. Just because I smoke weed dosen't mean I want to start tripping out. OK I've done pills, but I would have done them regardless, I did them for the experience. I've got some figures some where that basically shows no link between cannabis users moving on to harder drugs - but you'll have to hang fire for them.

Basically what I'm getting at is that cannabis users are given a hard time - and I don't see why. Let's be honest, all drugs have negative effects, if they were all fine we'd probably all do it. But the fact remains that alcohol is a far worse 'drug' to take. Look at the health problems related to it, and the immediate effects.

If you don't wanna try drugs, I appreciate where you're coming from. I'd just question you if you got pissed on any regular basis.

 

[Reaktor4]

It's where your getting your "facts" from.. hence the inaccuracy of your statements.

Wrong. I dont take any of my facts from the news, and can quote myself saying that its a bad idea. If you can prove otherwise, maybe you would be interested in this http://www.randi.org/research/index.html

 

[Reaktor4]

http://www.halflife2.net/forums/search.php?searchid=176447

Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms.
???

 

[Reaktor4]

Some alcohol is actually healthy for people. Alcohol ABUSE is the killer.

Umm.. yes. You edited and completely changed that post, didnt you?

 

[Reaktor4]

Well, I'll just dissect his post again. Makes me sorta tired, but meh.



First things first: Marihuana is NOT legal, it's tolerated. There are restrictions on the use of it.
And what does our tolerance of marihuana have to do with the drug problems of the rest of Europe? Cocaine, heroine are all still illegal, those are the export drugs of countries, marihuana doesn't get exported (tourists come to Amsterdam for it) and if it does, exportation and fabrication of it in large quantities is ILLEGAL. That has absolutely NOTHING to do with the use of marihuana on personal basis.
Out biggest drugs problem is XTC, and guess what? It's illegal.

Drug capitals of hard drugs are still Columbia and Afghanistan.



Yeah, I know what you mean, everyone I knew that had a sip of alcohol once, or smoked a sigarette is now a shivering crackhead in an alley. It's a sad world. There's no reason why you would take on heavy drugs when you used lighter ones.



Ha, you're funny. First of all, you're equaling marihuana to cocaine, but their effects are very different in scale and severity.

And do tell me, how many cases of 'father comes home stoned, beats up his kids, beats up his wife' have you heard?

There's no reason why suddenly car accidents would triple while you've been able to get behind the wheel drunk for years. And your driving skills on marihuana don't plummet as much like they do with alcohol.



Stop it, you're killing me!

I don't know how the things are there with you, but I've never seen someone stoned at his job, neither like I have seen someone drunk on their job, while there should be plenty of those by your reasoning.

It's kinda funny that everyone thinks we here are stoned 24/7. While facts have shown that a smaller percentage of the youth here has used marihuana than for example in the UK or the US.

Glad someones finally here who sees sense.

 

[MadHatter]

Well, I'll just dissect his post again. Makes me sorta tired, but meh.



First things first: Marihuana is NOT legal, it's tolerated. There are restrictions on the use of it.
And what does our tolerance of marihuana have to do with the drug problems of the rest of Europe? Cocaine, heroine are all still illegal, those are the export drugs of countries, marihuana doesn't get exported (tourists come to Amsterdam for it) and if it does, exportation and fabrication of it in large quantities is ILLEGAL. That has absolutely NOTHING to do with the use of marihuana on personal basis.
Out biggest drugs problem is XTC, and guess what? It's illegal.

Drug capitals of hard drugs are still Columbia and Afghanistan.



Yeah, I know what you mean, everyone I knew that had a sip of alcohol once, or smoked a sigarette is now a shivering crackhead in an alley. It's a sad world. There's no reason why you would take on heavy drugs when you used lighter ones.



Ha, you're funny. First of all, you're equaling marihuana to cocaine, but their effects are very different in scale and severity.

And do tell me, how many cases of 'father comes home stoned, beats up his kids, beats up his wife' have you heard?

There's no reason why suddenly car accidents would triple while you've been able to get behind the wheel drunk for years. And your driving skills on marihuana don't plummet as much like they do with alcohol.



Stop it, you're killing me!

I don't know how the things are there with you, but I've never seen someone stoned at his job, neither like I have seen someone drunk on their job, while there should be plenty of those by your reasoning.

It's kinda funny that everyone thinks we here are stoned 24/7. While facts have shown that a smaller percentage of the youth here has used marihuana than for example in the UK or the US.

A. Do you have to mock me?
B. I know many people who've gotten into accidents because they, or the driver, was high.
C. I've seen plenty of people walk into work under the influence of something.
D. This is not just about marijuana.
E. Marijuana and conaine and are mind altering drugs. Severity may vary, but principle is the same.
F. I did not say every person who smokes a cigarette or sips some beer will become a crackhead.
G. One of my friends was stoned and racing on e-pills and he beat the crap out of his girl because he thought she was someone else. But oh no, I'm just making that up, aren't I?
H. If you think marijuana does not impair your driving skills then.... Well, I don't know what to tell you.
I. Exactly, druggies come to Amsterdam to acquire marijuana and then go where ever. Amsterdam's like your stop-and-go place for marijuana users.

 

[MadHatter]

Umm.. yes. You edited and completely changed that post, didnt you?

Which post? Pray tell show me.

 

[h00dlum]

tried cannabis once..didint feel much..might try again to see how its like..

 

[Reaktor4]

The post i quoted.

 

[Recoil]

I participated in smoking weed some time ago, but all in all it was just about 10 times. Didn't affect me much, since I'm a non-smoker.

(It sucked though.)

 

[MadHatter]

The logic of you drug legalizing advocators purely escapes me. If you guys think legalizing everything is all the sudden going to make all the problems disappear? Then you're nuts.

Drugs = bad. So how would legalizing them make things any better? What is it about that very, very simple logic that escapes your minds?

 

[Reaktor4]

tried cannabis once..didint feel much..might try again to see how its like..

a lot of people feel nothing the first time

 

[MadHatter]

The post i quoted.

Do you see where it says, "Edited By..." anywhere? I think not.

 

[Reaktor4]

The logic of you drug legalizing advocators purely escapes me. If you guys think legalizing everything is all the sudden going to make all the problems disappear? Then you're nuts.

Drugs = bad. So how would legalizing them make things any better? What is it about that very, very simple logic that escapes your minds?

This is exactly what i predicted. If you want to have some credibility, simply go to the heroin post, and debunk each point one by one.
Bet you cant.

 

[burner69]

Yeah guys. You seem to be implying that if weed was made legal suddenly everyone would start taking it. They would't. If they made crack legal I wouldn't touch the stuff.

And if you think the number of deaths caused by alcohol or the number of road accidents caused by alochol would DOUBLE if weed were legal - then you're VERY wrong. Cannabis has completely different effects from booze. And how many times does it have to be pointed out? Beer is more hazardous to your health! It's a medical fact.

The question we ask is; why legalise a drug that makes you rowdy, violent, can be highly addictive and causes many death either through being under the influence, or through damage it causes to the body - when we could have a drug that makes you calm, sociable, happy, is not addictive (it can be socially addictive, but not socially and physically as is alcohols case), causes very few deaths through being under the influence, the damage it causes to the body is minimal compared to booze, and there is evidence to say that it both does and does not cause lung cancer. It has important medical qualities as well, which legalising would make much more accesible to people who would benefit from them.

Don't get me wrong - weed isn't 100% safe, but it's a dam sight better than beer. There is such thing as cannabis phycosis, which, although rare and only as a result of extreme use, is VERY bad. (but I'd rather have that than die of kidney faliure).

Oh and the reason weeds illegal is because the Bible doesn't say so. Jesus drank wine ergo we can drink booze. There's no mention of weed so it can't be smoked. In India cannabis use is practically a part of the religion, I'm told.

 

[Reaktor4]

Do you see where it says, "Edited By..." anywhere? I think not.

Irrelevant. It doesnt say that if you do it quick enough.
I saw what you posted (i use tabbed browsing), but unfortunately i only glanced at so i dont remember exactly what you said. Can moderators look at unedited versions of posts i wonder?

 

[MadHatter]

You know what? You guys are stoned... stoned deaf and whatever floats your boat, then so be it. As long as you're happy then no skin off my ass.

Stoned deaf.

 

[MadHatter]

Irrelevant. It doesnt say that if you do it quick enough.
I saw what you posted (i use tabbed browsing), but unfortunately i only glanced at so i dont remember exactly what you said. Can moderators look at unedited versions of posts i wonder?

What did I initially post then?

 

[MadHatter]

This is exactly what i predicted. If you want to have some credibility, simply go to the heroin post, and debunk each point one by one.
Bet you cant.

Oh dear I feel threatened.

 

[MadHatter]

Yeah guys. You seem to be implying that if weed was made legal suddenly everyone would start taking it. They would't. If they made crack legal I wouldn't touch the stuff.

And if you think the number of deaths caused by alcohol or the number of road accidents caused by alochol would DOUBLE if weed were legal - then you're VERY wrong. Cannabis has completely different effects from booze. And how many times does it have to be pointed out? Beer is more hazardous to your health! It's a medical fact.

The question we ask is; why legalise a drug that makes you rowdy, violent, can be highly addictive and causes many death either through being under the influence, or through damage it causes to the body - when we could have a drug that makes you calm, sociable, happy, is not addictive (it can be socially addictive, but not socially and physically as is alcohols case), causes very few deaths through being under the influence, the damage it causes to the body is minimal compared to booze, and there is evidence to say that it both does and does not cause lung cancer. It has important medical qualities as well, which legalising would make much more accesible to people who would benefit from them.

Don't get me wrong - weed isn't 100% safe, but it's a dam sight better than beer. There is such thing as cannabis phycosis, which, although rare and only as a result of extreme use, is VERY bad. (but I'd rather have that than die of kidney faliure).

Oh and the reason weeds illegal is because the Bible doesn't say so. Jesus drank wine ergo we can drink booze. There's no mention of weed so it can't be smoked. In India cannabis use is practically a part of the religion, I'm told.

Did you pay attention in your drivers ed. class? Weed causes a delay in your reactions and a list of other effects.

I'm not saying legalizing drug would make every person a user, but you act like if it were legal nobody would use it.

 

[burner69]

The logic of you drug legalizing advocators purely escapes me. If you guys think legalizing everything is all the sudden going to make all the problems disappear? Then you're nuts.

Drugs = bad. So how would legalizing them make things any better? What is it about that very, very simple logic that escapes your minds?

Look at the facts man. Check out the link supplied above. If you legalise a drug it gives the state greater power over it. For some people the fact that it's legal puts them off. A greater percentage of the population smoke weed in the US and UK than Amersterdam.

Don't just assume, find facts

 

[Reaktor4]

Oh and the reason weeds illegal is because the Bible doesn't say so.

The reason, in america, was mainly racism. Look at what harry anslinger said about cannabis all those years ago:

"There are 100,000 total marijuana smokers in the US, and most are Negroes, Hispanics, Filipinos, and entertainers. Their Satanic music, jazz, and swing, result from marijuana use. This marijuana causes white women to seek sexual relations with Negroes, entertainers, and any others."

"...the primary reason to outlaw marijuana is its effect on the degenerate races."

"Marijuana is an addictive drug which produces in its users insanity, criminality, and death."

"You smoke a joint and you're likely to kill your brother."

"Marijuana is the most violence-causing drug in the history of mankind."
http://www.heartbone.com/no_thugs/hja.htm

Disgusting.

Jesus drank wine ergo we can drink booze. There's no mention of weed so it can't be smoked. In India cannabis use is practically a part of the religion, I'm told.

There is some evidence that jesus' miraculous healings were the result of cannabis. Ill dig it out if you wanna see it.

 

[MadHatter]

One minute I'm told that alcohol is the greatest killer and it's legal. Next I'm told that all these other drugs should be legalized and everybody would skip down the street and drug problems would just magically decrease to a millimeter.

 

[MadHatter]

I'm finished with this thread.


Good show.