LOST: Destiny Found

[Warped]

I could write the synopsis for a better ending on a cocktail napkin!

yeah if you had a week to do it. Go ahead Mr, Tell us how it could have ended any better than it had.

 

[Sparta]

Haha wow, when I wrote that post to Adrik I was initially going to respond to what he would've responded too, but after skimming about 3 pages of him uselessly debating and being a tool, I realise now the no point in debating someone so hopelessly a fanboy who resorts to "really just shut up" as an explanation for everything.

Nice job, Adrik, way to be a complete tool

 

[Adrik_Senturu]

Haha wow, when I wrote that post to Adrik I was initially going to respond to what he would've responded too, but after skimming about 3 pages of him uselessly debating and being a tool, I realise now the no point in debating someone so hopelessly a fanboy who resorts to "really just shut up" as an explanation for everything.

Nice job, Adrik, way to be a complete tool

"Heh, I was GONNA respond but im too good for that. tool."

Behind all of my "you are stupid shut up"s were reasons behind me saying that but like No Limit you just kind of see my post and start foaming at the mouth and start mashing the reply key as fast as you can.

 

[Sparta]

"Heh, I was GONNA respond but im too good for that. tool."

Behind all of my "you are stupid shut up"s were reasons behind me saying that but like No Limit you just kind of see my post and start foaming at the mouth and start mashing the reply key as fast as you can.

Yup. You got me. I'm sorry for calling most of this thread stupid assholes and telling people to shut up and **** themselves when I haven't been able to give them answers beyond "Because they said he's the embodiment of all evil".

I should really stop frothing at the mouth and mashing my keyboard now. Your posts are hurting my feelings ever so much.

 

[TwwIX]

Adrik's about as credible as a bible thumper.

 

[Warped]

Yup. You got me. I'm sorry for calling most of this thread stupid assholes and telling people to shut up and **** themselves when I haven't been able to give them answers beyond "Because they said he's the embodiment of all evil".

I should really stop frothing at the mouth and mashing my keyboard now. Your posts are hurting my feelings ever so much.

Who's the more foolish: The fool, or the fool who follows him?

 

[Adrik_Senturu]

Its really only been you and No limit dog. Everyone else seems to be keeping it pretty real. You could say they've...Let go....Moved on even.

But please give me what you think would have been a better answer then what was given to us Im all ears

 

[Jerry_111]

I gave up on Fringe after a few episodes. Did it get better later on, is it worth a second try?

Quite a bit. The first season started off very episodic and I also bailed like you did, but then I heard it got better in the second half of the season and watched it. I think it did indeed improve because the series became less episodic and more serialized with an interesting mythology.

 

[Adrik_Senturu]

I just remembered this page:

http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Mysteries

90% of the stuff on there is marked as solved, the other 10% being partially solved. Thats preeeetttty funny.

 

[Rizzo]

No really. Most on that list was shit anyways. Im so angry right now! Wow. It's like, my eyes are blurry.

Really? The most important and logical explanation is not okay? What the hell do you want? Do you want a scientific explanation? Do you want Faraday to look into the camera while holding up some equation in his notebook and say that the island is a result of dinosaur remains crystalizing into magical light? Here's a question: What is the point of life? Oh wow, did I just blow your mind? These themes and questions about humanity, life, ourselves, are what's important, not the writers guessing what ridiculous trivial details satisfy you.

"It's a light"! Isn't a cop out to you guys? Fine. Im not as pissed, Im just dissapointed. I am. Adrik can keep mention the ****ing characters again and again, And Sheepo can keep doing whatever it is he does, that's not going to change. And judging by just this thread and some other sites I browsed yesterday, Im not alone in feeling dissapointed.

So please Adrik, tell me how wrong I am again for not getting the show, and it's perfect ending. Becouse I must be too stupid to understand the "Because I said it!" reason for everything that happend.

Why did MiB turn into a smoke monster? Becouse he did.
Jacob keeps telling people how evil he is
Why? Becouse he killed a few people? Who hasn't on that Island? So much happend just for the sake of drama, and when Ben got trapped under the log I just laughed. They have done that already I said. But then he's just free. Stuff for the sake of drama.

Adam and Eve? Oh so, they had a plan for that all along? They had no idea what they where doing, so they changed the dialog from when Jack found them, hoping people whouldn't notice. How exactly? People screencap every frame of this show. It's such a lazy mistake. Just kill off 2 characters in the 70s or something. Have Rose and Bernard die in the passed. They where usless anyway.
I have more, but I have a feeling im just not smart enough for this show. If you're glad with how everything turned out, good. Im happy for you.

 

[xombine]

No really. Most on that list was shit anyways. Im so angry right now! Wow. It's like, my eyes are blurry.

 

[Sparta]

But please give me what you think would have been a better answer then what was given to us Im all ears

That's the thing, it's not my job to provide answers, it's theirs, the writers. They wrote the show, they should know what they're doing and they clearly didn't know for the majority of the show.

A lot of the shows biggest answers boil down to "because we say so" and that's it. The Man in Black is evil because we say so. The Man in Black can't leave the island because I say so. He'll destroy the world, why? Because I said he will. You must protect the light because we say so. It could be the source of all live and death on the planet but I know shit all about the island anyway, still you better listen to me! Also, if your brother leaves the island the world will end. Just FYI.

You know, in the end the entire show wouldn't have happened if Jacob just said "Sure, you can leave the island, I don't see why not".

To me, this has proven Lost is fundamentally dumb.

I guess I'm pretty much done with this thread.

 

[Laivasse]

Enjoyable finale, laughable plot, laughable fanboy defences. Time to watch something else.

 

[StardogChampion]

A lot of the shows biggest answers boil down to "because we say so" and that's it. The Man in Black is evil because we say so. The Man in Black can't leave the island because I say so. He'll destroy the world, why? Because I said he will. You must protect the light because we say so. It could be the source of all live and death on the planet but I know shit all about the island anyway, still you better listen to me! Also, if your brother leaves the island the world will end. Just FYI.

Sparta wins. And WTF were those numbers?

 

[Remus]

I know shit all about the island anyway, still you better listen to me! Also, if your brother leaves the island the world will end. Just FYI.

Also yes it's true that I killed your real mother, but listen to me anyway! That's a good boy!

Honestly WTF

Like I said before in this thread under those circumstances only MIB reacted normally.

 

[Sliver]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpgYXWePU-c

 

[No Limit]

Its really only been you and No limit dog. Everyone else seems to be keeping it pretty real. You could say they've...Let go....Moved on even.

Umm, are you reading the same thread as me? Most people aren't buying your fanboy explainations.

 

[Asknoone]

It's both amusing and irritating to come to this thread and find the discussion polarised between idiocy and stupidity and visa versa. I can't even begin to discern the difference between Adrik, No Limit, TwixBix and Rizzo or whoever. But, it's http://www.halflife2.net, we don't expect anything better - so, the finale.

It was as good as it could be, and perhaps the most definitive conclusion the writers could have achieved. For me, it worked, on a character level and a mythological level--the answers that were provided during the course of the season were good enough to supply at least a modicum of explanation to those left in the dark. As a whole, the last two seasons could have arguably been considerably better at handling those questions and filling in the remaining gaps, which would have left it open to a finale that was not only emotionally satisfying, but rewarding as a whole, too.

The Flash-Sideways conclusion? Ooo, ahhh. The symbolism at the end was almost overbearing, and Christian's monologue to Jack was almost too corny to stomach at times, but I think I was lost (hoho) in the profundity of it all by that point. People are very quick to label it purgatory -- and I don't think they can be blamed for interpreting it as such -- but I don't think that's what it was. It doesn't matter if it was real or not, or if the 'light' represented something heavenly and paradasiacal. It doesn't matter. You can construe it that way and you can interpret it to be the most overt reference to Christian mythology, but for a show so heavily entrenched in religious and philosophical motifs plucked from a whole range of cultures, that would be a disservice (such as Hool, who obviously can't conceive anything interesting).

That reality was a composition of the love and faith they have for one another, and a physical reflection of the threads and paths they took, as people, together, on that Island. Did they need to show that so literally? Lindelof and Cuse thought so. I bought into it. Lost left me satisfied.

A lot of the shows biggest answers boil down to "because we say so" and that's it. The Man in Black is evil because we say so. The Man in Black can't leave the island because I say so. He'll destroy the world, why? Because I said he will. You must protect the light because we say so. It could be the source of all live and death on the planet but I know shit all about the island anyway, still you better listen to me! Also, if your brother leaves the island the world will end. Just FYI.

I think that's exactly the point. It is a leap of faith. It's a leap of faith in that you're presented with something emprical; only, you can't say for sure what that is. That was the light in that cave. Jacob spent over 2,000 years on that Island - an Island often personified with a 'will' of its own - I think it's a safe bet to assume he knew something. When Desmond pulled that stone out of the hole, something very bad happened, and that light disappeared. The Island, this place of redemption, of miracles and the incredible, it started to crumble into the ocean. That's when you have to believe that it means something very significant. Jacob threw his brother into that cave, and he subsequently emerged as a pillar of black smoke, able only to take on the form of the dead. What is he? Did all the bitterness and hatred he possessed fuse with that place to unleash the yin to its yang? His release from the Island would result in the destruction of reality. We don't know that, but we do have to believe that. I can sympathise if that does not satisfy, but looking in retrospect at the whole, with all those thematic elements tumbling over and over in the big washing machine - faith, free will, destiny, love, science, physics, metaphysics, life and death... do you need the story to say something definitive about that? I don't think I did.

 

[Tyguy]

I think the first few seasons of this show were excellent. The mysteries surrounding the hatch and other dharma stations were enough to catapult this show to the top. But when you take a series long unknown like the whispers and give it that horrendous explanation you might as well shoot yourself in the foot as a writer. The same applies to the smoke monster. I don't know what would have satisfied me as an answer but what was given to us certainly fell short.

Maybe those of us that were let down aren't as easily entertained? Maybe had the show presented itself as a religious quest from the beginning and not a scientific anomaly it might have been more acceptable. Sure, the relationships developed by the characters were intriguing but that doesn't justify molding the story into a soccer mom's wet dream.

 

[Yorick]

Maybe had the show presented itself as a religious quest from the beginning and not a scientific anomaly it might have been more acceptable.

I think you should rewatch the beginning few seasons. Lost was always about science, belief in ourselves, and even faith in something larger than ourselves.

 

[Asknoone]

I think the first few seasons of this show were excellent. The mysteries surrounding the hatch and other dharma stations were enough to catapult this show to the top. But when you take a series long unknown like the whispers and give it that horrendous explanation you might as well shoot yourself in the foot as a writer. The same applies to the smoke monster. I don't know what would have satisfied me as an answer but what was given to us certainly fell short.

Maybe those of us that were let down aren't as easily entertained? Maybe had the show presented itself as a religious quest from the beginning and not a scientific anomaly it might have been more acceptable. Sure, the relationships developed by the characters were intriguing but that doesn't justify molding the story into a soccer mom's wet dream.

I think you're wrong. In fact I think most of you are wrong; wrong in that you have no conception of what is acceptable or appropriate in the realm of narrative. It's almost like you are products of a shallow contemporary culture, operating within self-imposed boundaries of definitions of genre. Are you actually putting a limit on a particular motif? What is it exactly that makes you think Lost's closure is unacceptable?

That you think the show has become a "religious quest" negates you from having anything valuable or introspective to say about it, but let's take a look at your blank expectations. What prohibits you from being able to embrace the show's congeries of themes and its representations of them? I don't think anyone is claiming Lost is perfect. It's a network show, and I'm surprised it's actually managed to deal with the many missteps it's taken--I'm surprised it's been even able to come to this kind of conclusion, and deliver it with such candour. Lost, as a work of fiction, is at liberty to be what it chooses to be. It's a generational fault that prohibits you from appreciating that.

 

[No Limit]

I think you're wrong. In fact I think most of you are wrong; wrong in that you have no conception of what is acceptable or appropriate in the realm of narrative. It's almost like you are products of a shallow contemporary culture, operating within self-imposed boundaries of definitions of genre. Are you actually putting a limit on a particular motif? What is it exactly that makes you think Lost's closure is unacceptable?

That you think the show has become a "religious quest" negates you from having anything valuable or introspective to say about it, but let's take a look at your blank expectations. What prohibits you from being able to embrace the show's congeries of themes and its representations of them? I don't think anyone is claiming Lost is perfect. It's a network show, and I'm surprised it's actually managed to deal with the many missteps it's taken--I'm surprised it's been even able to come to this kind of conclusion, and deliver it with such candour. Lost, as a work of fiction, is at liberty to be what it chooses to be. It's a generational fault that prohibits you from appreciating that.

I think the problem honestly is we are all too stupid for this. You guys keep talking about themes and all this other crap most people that aren't taking english as their major give any shit about. I can only speak for myself but I think this is true for most of the people that watched this show. We watched it for the suspense and the mystery. The suspense was trying to figure out what the island was, they left you hanging at the end of each episode with the hope it would be explained in the near future. The writers took a big dump on all of that, explaining it away as some light that nobody knows anything about, we just have to assume that light has to stay on. Put all the themes and all the literary crap aside and that point alone ruined the ending of this show for people like me. But by all means, all us simpletons must be wrong because we don't grasp that this was about the characters and not the island.

 

[Yorick]

I think the problem honestly is we are all too stupid for this.

I couldn't agree more.

 

[No Limit]

I couldn't agree more.

Yup. Glad you guys found the show entertaining because of all those awesome literary themes most average people don't give a shit about.

 

[Yorick]

Yup. Glad you guys found the show entertaining because of all those awesome literary themes most average people don't give a shit about.

I'm glad too! Shouldn't you be watching Family Guy or something?

 

[No Limit]

I'm glad too! Shouldn't you be watching Family Guy or something?

I would, but the season is over unfortunately.

I bet anytime you see a movie based on a book you are the guy that always says the book was way better.

 

[Adrik_Senturu]

I think that's exactly the point. It is a leap of faith. It's a leap of faith in that you're presented with something emprical; only, you can't say for sure what that is.

I was gonna post something but basically this. People complaining about "there was no reason to protect the light blah blah" on a show on which one of the major themes was faith.

I think yorick was the one who said it before but protecting the light = pushing the button. Why? Because someone said it was important. It's up to you whether or not to believe them.

 

[Yorick]

Yeah, that's what I said. It's kind of upsetting how many people just don't understand this show.

I bet anytime you see a movie based on a book you are the guy that always says the book was way better.

Not necessarily.

I thought Fight Club was just as good as the book. I thought the original Charlie and the Chocolate Factory was as good. Same goes for Matilda. The Green Mile is a wonderful adaptation. Sin City is great. I found Lord of the Rings to be considerably better than the books. I found The Notebook to be better than the book.

Feel free to try again, though. It's cute as hell that you think you know anything about what I like or don't like, based simply on your own admission that I'm a more intelligent person than you are.

 

[Adrik_Senturu]

realtalk here:

I think a lot of people who had expectations about this show don't really understand how TV works sometimes. We are very lucky with what we got.

A 6 season network television show with 20+ episodes in each nonstrike season is going to have dropped plot elements, characters that are important at first then aren't anymore or leave the show, etc. So if you want every minor detail from Season 1 that you happened to latch on to to be explained fully in Season 6 on a network TV show, you just don't understand much about television.

The "big picture" stuff on the other hand, was answered, and done in a way that gelled consistently with what was developed before, something that stuff like the XFiles and BSG failed at to varying degrees.

And from S3 onwards, the big picture stuff all had answers and major things have been plotted out, so it it is thematically consistent with what we've been seeing for the past few years, with minor adjustments being made. All of which is pretty good for network TV.

Cable TV with 10-12 episode seasons, not bound by having to appeal to every demographic? Different story and different perspective. But Lost did great for a network show of its size and actually better than I expected.

 

[No Limit]

Yeah, that's what I said. It's kind of upsetting how many people just don't understand this show.



Not necessarily.

I thought Fight Club was just as good as the book. I thought the original Charlie and the Chocolate Factory was as good. Same goes for Matilda. The Green Mile is a wonderful adaptation. Sin City is great. I found Lord of the Rings to be considerably better than the books. I found The Notebook to be better than the book.

Feel free to try again, though. It's cute as hell that you think you know anything about what I like or don't like, based simply on your own admission that I'm a more intelligent person than you are.

You kind of proved my point. Yes you are more intelligent, only when it comes to reading books. Congratulations. I have other things I spend my free time on. The point remains that for most people that don't have a english degree the show was a huge disappointment. You sound like the people that look at picasso and say how brilliant it is when to most people it looks like someone threw up on a canvas.

And fight club was based on a book? wow.

 

[Tyguy]

I think you're wrong. In fact I think most of you are wrong; wrong in that you have no conception of what is acceptable or appropriate in the realm of narrative.

Yet you apparently have some inherent clairvoyance regarding prime time television?

It's almost like you are products of a shallow contemporary culture, operating within self-imposed boundaries of definitions of genre.

lol, this holier than though attempt to belittle those who have different opinions is not only insulting, it's mildly pathetic. However, props on trying to present yourself as this undiluted intellect!

That you think the show has become a "religious quest" negates you from having anything valuable or introspective to say about it.

No, it doesn't.

What prohibits you from being able to embrace the show's congeries of themes and its representations of them?

What prohibits you from sticking your face in dog shit? You're suggesting that simply understanding the themes will somehow alleviate any criticism of the show...which is absurd. I know what the damn themes are, that doesn't change anything.

Lost, as a work of fiction, is at liberty to be what it chooses to be. It's a generational fault that prohibits you from appreciating that.

"It is what it is." Epic use of logic.

This "generational fault" you describe is interesting, would you mind expanding on that for those of us who aren't lucky enough to have a pedestal to stand on?

 

[Adrik_Senturu]

It doesnt take an english degree to realize one of the shows major themes is faith, hth.

 

[Yorick]

You kind of proved my point. Yes you are more intelligent, only when it comes to reading books. Congratulations. I have other things I spend my free time on. The point remains that for most people that don't have a english degree the show was a huge disappointment. You sound like the people that look at picasso and say how brilliant it is when to most people it looks like someone threw up on a canvas.

So, your argument is that Damon and Carlton shouldn't have made the show they wanted to, but should have pandered to idiots, such as yourself?

 

[Asknoone]

I think the problem honestly is we are all too stupid for this.

By your own admission No Limit!

You don't need to prove it. Stop posting, perhaps?

 

[Tyguy]

So, your argument is that Damon and Carlton shouldn't have made the show they wanted to, but should have pandered to idiots, such as yourself?

Why is it the majority of people defending the show from legitimate criticism are a bunch of douches?

No Limit presented completely legitimate gripes with the show and was met with the fanboy army. It's a television show, stop pretending it has any impact on your life. It's as though he slapped your mothers across the face.

 

[Yorick]

Why is it the majority of people defending the show from legitimate criticism are a bunch of douches?

"I'm too stupid to understand this show so I'm going to bitch about it" is not legitimate criticism.

 

[Adrik_Senturu]

"the show is stupid it gave us no answers, themes? **** themes I want answers" is not legitimate criticism.

Now if someone would have posted something like, "I understand the whole faith thing, but overall I was disappointed with the series as a whole even if the finale makes sense. I guess I just wanted a little more is all" which I think the only person to do so was Raaziar then yes, that would be valid criticism.

Edit: Yorick, we just had a ****ing mind link.

 

[No Limit]

So, your argument is that Damon and Carlton shouldn't have made the show they wanted to, but should have pandered to idiots, such as yourself?

Yup, saying the light is what it is because we said so panders to the intelligent people such as yourself.

Also classy move calling people that don't agree with you idiots.

By your own admission No Limit!

You don't need to prove it. Stop posting, perhaps?

Yup, lets all stop posting and let you brainiacs have a super serious discussion about the importance of the characters and how insignificant the island was.

By all means guys, keep riding that high horse of yours.

 

[No Limit]

Why is it the majority of people defending the show from legitimate criticism are a bunch of douches?

No Limit presented completely legitimate gripes with the show and was met with the fanboy army. It's a television show, stop pretending it has any impact on your life. It's as though he slapped your mothers across the face.

But you see, I dont read books all day so I have no right to an opinion.

And I used to think the politics board was where people turned to calling people they didn't agree with idiots. Didn't know Films, TV and DVDs was the real section where the super intelligent douchebags come out.

 

[Yorick]

Also classy move calling people that don't agree with you idiots.

Hey I'm just going along with what you said. I'd love to hear a rational argument against my point of view from someone who actually understood the show and just didn't agree with the direction.

I had a pretty lengthy discussion with a friend of mine last night who thought the Island was "purgatory" from the very beginning, which I don't agree with at all, but he was able to clearly make his case and provide explanations and examples of why he thought so.

Of course, unlike you, he also reads books.

I don't understand how you can be so angry about this show's finale. It's pretty obvious that even from the beginning, it was never meant for you. There's an analogy to be made where you're an ape who picks up a work of Shakespeare and, finding it has no pictures, defecates all over it.