LOST: Destiny Found

Yeah, but still, it was Desmond who did that. Jacks plan was exactly the same as the smoke monsters, so again, Jack completly drops the ball like always. Jack drops a ****ing nuke down a hole, without even considering other possibilities. Miles even says somthing about "What if this is what causes the incident?" And everyone just looks at each other and does it anyway.

Same thing happend in the final. Jack just goes along with it, and ends up almost destroying the island, and when he tries to kill the smoke monster, he gets whacked in the head. Then he does the exact same thing, but gets stabbed instead. Only thing I could think at that point was; serves you right you dumb shit.

I got some serious Misson impossibe 2 vibes at the final fight between Lock and Jack, even before Lock tried to stab him in the face. And Jurasic park 3 when the plane was taking off. I must say I had some pretty strong vibes about Frank Lapidus too. I thought there was something seriously wrong with him, and that he whould just take off.
 
Jack was under the impression that he knew what Desmond was doing but desmond had "flashed" to the little purgatory and had convinced himself that unplugging the cork was just going to send everyone there. He was wrong.
 
someone should change the thread title too "Lost: They were supposed to tell us how magic works"
 
I saw a post on another forum that I think very accurately explains why most of these people are disappointed:

This is how I define Lost now that I know how it has ended. Lost is character-driven mythologically-focused show that uses sci-fi conventions as a way to create modern myth.

When I say mythologically-focused in that sentence I'm not talking about Tolkein-type mythology. I'm talking about mythology mythology like Greek and Roman-type stuff. That type of mythological storytelling explores very broad philosophical themes through parable. Those stories rarely answer the "why" of any of their elements in any great detail because the "why" is less important than the characters experiences of those things.

Now, because Lost used sci-fi tropes in order to tell a mythic story, this confused a lot of people into thinking that the show was straight-up modern sci-fi when it wasn't. I don't blame those people too much, but I do think the writers gave enough hints about what the show actually was over the seasons that they shouldn't be too bent out of shape over it.

1/3 of every episode was devoted to exploring characters through flashback, and I don't think I've heard anyone really deny that Lost does have a deeper-than-usual focus on the characters. These people say that the other elements, the "mythology" shouldn't have been ignored. What these people mean when they say this is that the sci-fi shouldn't have been ignored. All of the sci-fi elements of the show map back to telling a story that's more like myth than sci-fi, though. The hatch was all about exploring the question of "Do you have the courage to test that the button actually does nothing when you have been told that by pushing it you are saving the world?" From the standpoint of the myth, the why of the button is not as important as the working through of that idea. That's why the show is so heavy on themes like fate versus free will, life and death. It's modern myth.

It being modern myth was why the show resonated with so many people that didn't usually much care for sci-fi. The show was using sci-fi elements to tell a story that more than just sci-fi fans would be able to connect with. The show was able to do the sci-fi competently enough to convince sci-fi fans the show was real modern sci-fi, but in the end they were shown that the show's heart wasn't in it.

tl;dr Lost ended up being a show that used sci-fi tropes to tell a mythic story rather than the straight-up modern sci-fi show a lot of people thought it was. I think what they've done is brilliant and more imaginative than if it had been straight-up modern sci-fi, but I can see how people who really craved good modern sci-fi could feel kind of betrayed. Those of you who feel this way should watch Fringe, because it is a good sci-fi for the sake of sci-fi television show.
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Ross said:
You can construe it that way and you can interpret it to be the most overt reference to Christian mythology, but for a show so heavily entrenched in religious and philosophical motifs plucked from a whole range of cultures, that would be a disservice (such as Hool, who obviously can't conceive anything interesting).
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Hey, how was I dragged into your lots-of-big-words-post? :p I took it as that because I'm Protestant and I was always raised that way. Only time I ever went to a church was for a wedding I couldn't remember as I was too young, or to light candles with grandma because I liked fire thus becoming a welder.

Most people in this forum really have to grow up more I think to understand the ending. This is the forum anyways that people think it's ok for school re-enactments of the KKK, but hell what do I know? http://www.halflife2.net/forums/showthread.php?p=3155079#post3155079 Notice who said it was ok and look at the immature posters in this thread.

I'm leaving this thread but all I gotta say is thanks to anybody who had a hand in developing the show, ABC to generously fund and air it (and believed in the producers), and Adrik for making the common joe understand the ending.
 
Adrik_Senturu said:
I saw a post on another forum that I think very accurately explains why most of these people are disappointed:
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I bow my head to whoever wrote that. Thanks for sharing. A friend of mine actually used Lost heavily in an essay about the use of myth in modern television and film.
 
Yeah, its just now that I realize that today is tuesday and theres no new Lost today or ever again for that matter. It was fun folks :(
 
To be honest, I didn't view Lost to be science fiction... I viewed it in as fantasy, using elements of ancient Egyptian, Greek and Roman mythology(though it also undoubtedly had elements from the Bible as well). That was the one of the main draws to me, particularly in times when the character development was quite... underwhelming. I kept telling myself there would be awesome revelations and some truly far out shit. Something that recaptured how I felt about The Hatch and when it started to fail. When the hatch failed... I had ****ing goosebumps. I wasn't sure what the hell was going to happen. What did happen though disappointed me greatly.

I felt like Locke felt when he was trying to hang himself. Only I didn't have Ben to talk me away from those thoughts. And as a result I was strangled... by my own hopes for what they were going to reveal to us about the series, as well as continuing with character development concerning those revelations.


4 8 15 16 23 42 <- meaningless! At least no explanation exists for us. More than anything else... I wish I knew the why of these numbers.
 
Lost. We are so in our own lives. We all have been. Most of us probably still are. We desire that which we did not own. We yearn for truth but are untrue to ourselves. We love people who hurt us. We hurt people who love us. We struggle to break free from the molds of our parents. The assumptions we make about ourselves deceive us. We are very, very alone.

In the event that you were upset with 'The End', then perhaps you are still at the beginning of your own journey.

The end of Lost - indeed, the entire series - has never been about answers. If you expected as such, then you're probably one who is having a great deal of difficulty accepting how it all ultimately came to a finish. You’re still searching for Walt. You’re still not sure who died, or when. You still don’t get the Smoke Monster. You’re pretty sure they all perished in a plane crash.

I think that whether or not you are satisfied with 'The End' says as much about your own life - the journey you are on - as it does about the characters many of us have grown to care so deeply for. What is it that is important to you, in your life? Is it your travels around the world, or the people you’re going to see? The surgery you have to endure, or the ones who are with you when you wake up? Describing Lost as a story about plane crash survivors on a mysterious island is like describing your own life as the story of someone who is born, makes some choices, and dies. The end is not the important part.

If you can’t learn to live together, you’re going to die alone. We - as viewers - have spent six years following every character on the Island. We've witnessed the most important part of their lives. We watched them grow. We watched them mature, struggle, fall, triumph, die, and let go of those aspects of their characters that stain them. Their time on the island is what lifted these characters out of loneliness, weakness and darkness and gave them love, strength and light. In the end, the island is just a setting.

Lost is something that comes from our hearts. It is found in as much as you have found yourself. It is the randomness of chance, and the possibility of meaning. The power of hour hearts and minds to either save or destroy us, and the strengthening of love, friendship and loyalty. 'The End' is everything fundamentally what we have - or should have - always expected the end to be; the survivors were found. What we didn’t fully understand, these past six years, is that the survivors were found the moment Oceanic Flight 815 crashed on the island. They were found each time they stood up for each other, defended each other, loved each other. They were found within that brief moment sandwiched between birth and death. They would never, ever have survived alone.

And the same applies to us. If you felt betrayed or disappointed by 'The End' because you did not receive the answers you wanted, then you're probably not looking in the right place. Certainly, I think, 'The End' has an emptiness to it. But it is deliberate. We all have yet to experience the full circle of our own lives. We’re searching within ourselves for meaning and searching for others to understand us. You would not be human if you did not feel something – I don't know, jealously or relief, perhaps – at the moment when each character “remembered”. It’s the moment of enlightenment; it’s your whole life flashing before your eyes; it’s the bright light we’ve all been told we’ll see and the loved one waiting at the other side. If we don’t receive the answers to all the mysteries in the world, maybe we don’t care. The only mystery that we need to solve is the one within ourselves, and more than anything else, we need each other (and maybe a dog) to get there.

'The End' is certainly unlike most Lost episodes. I don't think your enjoyment of it will fall squarely on how the dialogue or plot unfolded, or even which mysteries were addressed. I think the beauty of 'The End' is that it sets an elaborate stage which allows us all to decide and interpret where to take it from there. Like myself, I think that is why many people cannot seem to remove ourselves from a sort of emotionally exhausted state, because we gladly accepted the invitation that 'The End' offered, and have been unable to shake the final moments of this stunning series out of our hearts and minds. With others it might take some time before they're willing to personalize the story. Others may decide it's all crap and all this afterlife nonsense is unworthy of their time.

That's what I'm trying to say, I think. 'The End' was as perfect an ending for this series as it could possibly have been. However, I don't think it goes from "good" to "excellent" on its own merits; much of that will depend on the viewer's willingness to adapt it to their own experiences. I don't think anyone can merely "convince" you to go one way or another on something so personal.
 
I'm just going to respond to Rizzo, because everyone else is either saying the exact same things or the same thing about a different thing.

Rizzo said:
"It's a light"! Isn't a cop out to you guys? Fine.
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It's a light isn't an answer at all, the answer is that the island (and world) is powered by an electromagnetic core, which is a pretty direct answer really. The fact that it creates a light is an insignificant characteristic of the answer. It's only important in terms of symbolic imagery and for creating a spectacle.

Im not as pissed, Im just dissapointed. I am. Adrik can keep mention the ****ing characters again and again, And Sheepo can keep doing whatever it is he does, that's not going to change. And judging by just this thread and some other sites I browsed yesterday, Im not alone in feeling dissapointed.
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Hell, I'm a little dissapointed. The finale was many things, perfect it was not. The more I think about it the more I get a big ol' meh. However, the reason I found it somewhat dissapointing was not because it didn't shove forced "explanations" down my throat.
So please Adrik, tell me how wrong I am again for not getting the show, and it's perfect ending. Becouse I must be too stupid to understand the "Because I said it!" reason for everything that happend.
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Once again, Lost reflects life, because we'll never truly know a root cause or force that created everything the way it is, because "God did it" just leads to "What created God?". The show has a rich mythology that is explored deeply and shallowly in many places, but people keep expecting explanations of explanations. Here are some examples:

Why did MiB turn into a smoke monster? Becouse he did.
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MIB turned into the smoke monster because the light destroyed his 'humanity' when Jacob threw him into it. But I'm sure that's not good enough for you. The light's extremely powerful and only particularly special people can survive that force. Do you want Faraday to list off some made up sci-fi equation explaining how electromagnets turn people into smoke?
Jacob keeps telling people how evil he is
Why? Becouse he killed a few people? Who hasn't on that Island?
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Well first off, you're assuming that Jacob is giving the whole truth and knows exactly what he's talking about, but we know that's not true anymore. Secondly, I think you're referring to the fact that people keep saying everyone will die if he escapes the island, which really isn't a matter of "RAAAWR, ME SMASH PUNY EARTH", so much as the fact the Jacob thinks the smoke contains the raw power that would destroy the world if it were taken away/the process of him leaving would **** up the island or it's 'light' and destroy the Earth. Third, do you really not think he's atleast a little evil? I mean, he went through some bad times and he certainly is justified to a pretty unique sense of anger at his situation, but he kills dozens of people at a time without any regard for them just so he can leave the island.

So much happened just for the sake of drama, and when Ben got trapped under the log I just laughed. They have done that already I said. But then he's just free. Stuff for the sake of drama.
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I agree with you on the tree thing, it was a little silly detail that wasn't necessary, but in the scheme of the episode it didn't bother me too much.
Adam and Eve? Oh so, they had a plan for that all along? They had no idea what they where doing, so they changed the dialog from when Jack found them, hoping people whouldn't notice. How exactly? People screencap every frame of this show. It's such a lazy mistake. Just kill off 2 characters in the 70s or something. Have Rose and Bernard die in the passed. They where usless anyway.
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They're two ****ing skeletons on an island where hundreds have people have died. BS or not, it doesn't really matter.

On an unrelated note, I have nothing but contempt for brad92.
 
Two posts expressing how you don't care = You care

Not that I care. Wait...
 
I have said that I don't care?

And that is enough to generate such powerful a feeling as contempt?
 
The original ending that they planned for back in Season 1 began with Locke shouting "Walt! Summon the Hurley Bird!" Which he did, and all the protagonists climbed on his back and flew home.

There's your answer I hope you are happy
 
OK, I've never watched an episode of Lost. My Dad watches it. Once when I was visiting him, it was on and I sat there for a few minutes to watch, since he was really into it.

It looked like the stupidest drama crap ever. Tell me, is it actually good once you get into it? Should give it a chance?
 
As emotional as the finale was I still can’t help feeling disappointed, it just felt as if the writers thought "Well we never really wrote any of the stories with a beginning middle and end so lets make a whole new story line up for this season and see it through"

Having said that though there’s never been for me a show on tv that has had me as captivated as Lost has, I am sad its ended but its been a great ride :)
 
Sheepo said:
Secondly, I think you're referring to the fact that people keep saying everyone will die if he escapes the island, which really isn't a matter of "RAAAWR, ME SMASH PUNY EARTH", so much as the fact the Jacob thinks the smoke contains the raw power that would destroy the world if it were taken away/the process of him leaving would **** up the island or it's 'light' and destroy the Earth.
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I think there's also the case of: for the Smoke Monster to leave the island, he has to destroy the island. If the island is destroyed, the light, or whatever explanation you subscribe to, is destroyed as well. With Smokey absolutely determined to leave, it was essential he was destroyed in order to save the world.

Also, I recommend people watch the opening moments of Season 6 now that we know the true purpose of the flash-sideways. The moment of turbulence, Jack's tearful fear and Rose saying "It's alright, you can let go now" has become incredibly poignant. As was Jack's resistance to seeing the truth throughout the flash-sideways, his eventual acceptance when he says "Because I'm dead too" and bursts into tears was heartbreaking.
 
I found the entire series easy to understand, until the second half of this last season D:

I guess I'll need to watch it again
 
I get what your saying, and Sheepos reply was good. I get the ending. I just don't like it. What I don't get though, is Brads tl:dr post that I read anyway. What the ****?
I also have a problem with MiB not being able to leave the island. When he apperantly did, or not, depending on who Micheal saw on the boat. But still, why whould he need to destroy the Island to leave?
And of course I don't want the info dump Adrik keeps mentioning, just a monolog answering every question. So in that perspective, what we got is preferable.
 
VirusType2 said:
OK, I've never watched an episode of Lost. My Dad watches it. Once when I was visiting him, it was on and I sat there for a few minutes to watch, since he was really into it.

It looked like the stupidest drama crap ever. Tell me, is it actually good once you get into it? Should give it a chance?
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I just realized I was thinking of Survivor, sorry.
 
VirusType2 said:
OK, I've never watched an episode of Lost. My Dad watches it. Once when I was visiting him, it was on and I sat there for a few minutes to watch, since he was really into it.

It looked like the stupidest drama crap ever. Tell me, is it actually good once you get into it? Should give it a chance?
Click to expand...

Lost is like MW2. You spend hours trying to convince yourself it's good and then you realize you've been ripped off and kicked in the bollocks.
 
Has anyone found a time line for the entire series yet? Something similar to the Half-Life time line would be excellent.

I'd like to rehash my perspective on LOST to further explain why I was disappointed with the finale. First of all, despite the fact that the it soured me on the show to a degree, I still think it's one of the best shows I've seen. One of the greatest parts of LOST and the community was the myriad of theories proposed from the start. The majority of what I consider to be great theories arrived when the hatch became a major influence to the story. I would read theories for hours at a time, ranging anywhere from the origin of the polar bear to the Dharma Initiative as a whole. I was fascinated by some viewer's theory regarding electromagnetism and remember quite well spending a lot of time trying to construct my own hypothesis.

The flashbacks were also great. The time travel motif, although not explained enough to my liking, still made me go from six to midnight. When the issue of the island's ability to be moved through time was established I still maintained a heightened sense of curiosity although I was slowly starting to question the direction the writers were going. Before the show began to introduce the more faith based approach I really felt the story could develop a reasonable explanation for everything that remained unanswered.

That link Adrik provided was for the most part accurate in my opinion. But regardless of the character development and the thematic subtleties, I felt I was deceived. There's no question in my mind that the pseudo-scientific aspects of the show were an attention grabber, and for science buffs like myself it was nearly impossible to lose interest once they were presented.

So try and put yourself in the shoes of a science buff who is being presented with time travel, alternate dimensions, electromagnetism, etc. and then try to retain the same sense of satisfaction when these things prove to be trivial in the grand scheme of the show.

I'm not saying the show is structurally flawed nor am I implying the show is bad purely because it doesn't provide every answer to every question. Just understand that the things that made me love the show were essentially put on the back burner while this transition to faith was established. Maybe for people of faith this was a great ending but unfortunately I'm one of those assholes who likes having things answered.

That's all I have to say, we are all entitled to our opinions. On to the next show!
 
VirusType2 said:
OK, I've never watched an episode of Lost. My Dad watches it. Once when I was visiting him, it was on and I sat there for a few minutes to watch, since he was really into it.

It looked like the stupidest drama crap ever. Tell me, is it actually good once you get into it? Should give it a chance?
Click to expand...

I thought the exact same thing when I saw a random episode on TV, before even knowing the show existed
when I decided to start watching it from the beginning some years later, I was hooked.... I watched the first 3 seasons in a matter of weeks
give it a chance, you won't regret it
 
Blackthorn said:
I think there's also the case of: for the Smoke Monster to leave the island, he has to destroy the island. If the island is destroyed, the light, or whatever explanation you subscribe to, is destroyed as well. With Smokey absolutely determined to leave, it was essential he was destroyed in order to save the world.
Click to expand...

Yeah, well truth be told, that's what's confusing me about the finale.

MIB: All the candidates must be dead for me to leave the island.

One episode later

MIB: Well I can do it anyway.

I guess it was what Widmore told him about Desmond that made the difference? But I really don't see what difference having Jacob and all the candidates dead would make for removing the heart, so I'm assuming (unless I've overlooked something) that only became his plan after he talked to Widmore IE: Jacob wouldn't really see this particular doom of the world coming.


brad92 said:
I have said that I don't care?

And that is enough to generate such powerful a feeling as contempt?
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Yeah, when I told you the same thing a couple pages back. And contempt isn't a very powerful feeling.

Baserape> said:
Lost is like MW2. You spend hours trying to convince yourself it's good and then you realize you've been ripped off and kicked in the bollocks.
Click to expand...

Wait, you didn't enjoy the beginning and middle of Lost but you were hoping that the ending would make you suddenly like the show in retrospect?. Yeah, you sound like you're worth listening to.
 
I'd really like somebody to run through all the episodes and make a 2hr-ish movie where they removed all the useless stuff. WAAAAAALLLLLLLTTTTTTT, ecko, nobody cares about your ****ing baby, medusa spiders, and many other episodes with non-core-plot related elements.

The only reason I could continue to watch lost was because they killed off shannon, her character alone made me want to throw my TV out the window. That michelle rodriguez character was also terrible...and jack was just about as stupid, thankfully he became slightly more bearable.
 
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