LOST: Destiny Found

Yorick said:
I rewatched the last episode, and the scene with Jack and Richard really seems to have finally cemented Jack into the character we always knew he was going to be. Yeah he's still reckless and borderline suicidal, but with everything he has seen, he's gone from being a man of science to a man of faith.
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Truly an amazing moment.
 
Tyguy said:
Ben Linus is such a wimp. This character reversal shit he pulled was boring and lame.

"No one else will have me!!!!"

Give me a ****ing break. Stop crying and be the Ben Linus we have all gotten to love. Kill that bitch making you dig your own grave...come to think of it, kill the pilot too, he's boring and his acting sucks.

And in the other dimension...anyone else find it odd that instead of saying "If you don't write a good letter of recommendation for this girl on top of my previous demands, I'll ruin you" he simply caved and gave in? Ben is supposed to be this poster boy of intellect and even I, a stupid consumer whore, could have negotiated better.

This season has made me question my LOST fandom and it's going to take a hell of a lot to get me back on the bandwagon.

Oh look, the fuse went out...that's just ****ing perfect, great story bro.
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Silly post, although I have to agree about the pilot (Frank). He's an extremely boring and worthless character whose only purpose it seems is to come with his shitty Americana attitude every now and then to relieve tension.
 
The blackmailing negotiation didn't make any sense. The whole point of blackmail is that the person does what you want under threat of having information revealed. If he doesn't do what you want, you reveal that information. You don't cave as soon as they threaten to be mean to you. You nail their ass to the wall. A bad reference from a disgraced principal wouldn't mean shit. Furthermore, once the reference letter is written and sent, the principal has no collateral other than Ben's promise, and what is that worth?
 
yeah, i didn't really get the blackmailing part. ben could of just added ''sending a bad reference'' to his list of things that would make him reveal the information, but i guess there had to be something in there that made him change so drastically from his island self and that was it.

edit: i say list of bad things, i mean stepping down from principal.
 
I figured that the letter would be worthless if the principal left shortly after it was written.
 
Well, it would have the same effect if he wrote a bad letter or no letter at all, Alex wouldn't get in in either case.
 
Alright episode.
I thought it started off great but slowly went downhill.

Sawyer's character remained mostly the same except instead of being a con man he's now a cop but he's still hunting down the man who caused his parents to die.

The "recon" mission that Flocke sent Sawyer on seemed so utterly pointless aside from finding out Widmore's numbers and supposedly tricking him into getting ready for Sawyer to bring him Flocke.(we all know that Widmore's going to outsmart them)

And the Claire and Kate situation is just laughable, I can't see that going anywhere at all.

It was an enjoyable episode but it could've been better, much better.
 
damn, two mediocre episodes in a row. i hope the show keeps its momentum after next week.

and i gotta give props to the pace of this season? is it not perfect? i just feel like they nailed the answer/mystery ratio.
 
what a ridiculous ending

not so great episode.
 
Pretty worthless, although, Smoke Monster telling Kate that he had a crazy mother and making the comparison that now Aaron does as well, makes me wonder if perhaps there is a connection as to why children weren't being born on the island (though that only started occurring after the late 70's, so I'm not sure).
 
Solid episode. Nothing great. Currently it's my second least favorite. I naturally like Sawyer far more than I do Kate, so I rank it higher than 'What Kate Does'.

Next week?

Hellz Yez!!!
 
Can someone give me a quick rundown on what's answered so far? I don't feel like reading through everything on Lostpedia.
 
Worst episode of the season. The more I see of her, the more I realize how poor an actress Emilie de Ravin is. Her entire storyline this season has been shite, and she doesn't pull off the crazy island girl for one second. The reconciliation with Kate was laughable both in terms of acting and story development.

Sawyer' s visit to the Hydra island was too long, although I supposed it filled a function. His flashsideways were a mess, though, and I didn't really see the point of bringing Charlotte into the whole thing, she didn't serve a purpose at all. And as Lucid said, Sawyer is the exact same character in the alternative dimension, very dull.

Finally, I wish someone would tell the producers to stop having that sentimental music every time one of the characters feels a bit moody.
 
Can't say that i liked this episode. Nothing but filler.

They're dragging out things way too ****ing long. I Am kinda glad that this series is ending.
At first, i was starting to get annoyed. Now, it just slowly bores me.
 
I thought it was pretty good. I kinda liked when Clair got the crazy slapped out of her by Schlock. The ending was lame though.

"We take the sub." LOST!
Ok, so what?

Also, what's up with Terry O'Quinn's bitch tits? Seriously those are getting out of control.
 
That... What the hell?

Edit: Oh, you quoted Samon. Carry on.
 
If Richard's Episode is anything short of amazing, I will kill everyone.
 
Rizzo said:
"We take the sub." LOST!
Ok, so what?
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I LOL'd at that part.

"Even if we can get on that plane, who's gonna fly it?"
"We ain't taking the plane, freckles. We're taking the sub."

Oh, OK then, we can't pilot a plane, but I'm sure operating a submarine is just like driving a car!
 
Unfocused said:
I LOL'd at that part.

"Even if we can get on that plane, who's gonna fly it?"
"We ain't taking the plane, freckles. We're taking the sub."

Oh, OK then, we can't pilot a plane, but I'm sure operating a submarine is just like driving a car!
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Taking means hijack in Sawyer language.
 
Yorick said:
I hate you so very much.
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Why's that? :p

Samon said:
I am not quite sure you understand what 'filler' actually is.
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What did you think of 'Recon', Samon?

Elaborating upon my previous post; I can't say Recon did anything for me. As I said, I like Sawyer, but as mentioned previously, there's no difference between his two personas. This also creates an apparent inconsistency. Anthony Cooper - who Sawyer labels a con-man - is the reason for his parents' death, yes? But Locke and his father are still on speaking terms, meaning he never took his kidney or threw him out a window. Now, if the two people are the same Anthony Cooper, how does this work exactly?

Miles. Charlotte. Liam. I understand the writers wish to exemplify these characters operating within the same sphere of influence, but the manner in which the Alt reality executes these connections seems arbitrary. There seems to be little point having the likes of Miles and Charlotte pop up around Sawyer beyond the "they all meet up in some capacity regardless" notion. It lacks the meaningfulness and significance of the connections established in the original timeline as seen in the early seasons. Perhaps this will be clarified in upcoming episodes. I don't exactly expect to discover the nature of the flash-sideways until the end of the season. I certainly hope this is the case.

And Widmore! Chirst, what to make of this? This development apparently destroys all notions of him being on the same side as MIB which, at this point, makes absolutely no sense based upon what has been established.

EDIT: I take that back. Widmore and MIB are on the same side. Oh, what a second play-through can do for you.

Next week is going to kick ass, though. :p

Current Episode Rankings

1. Dr. Linus
2. The Substitute
3. LA X
4. Lighthouse
5. Sundown
6. Recon
7. What Kate Does

Rizzo said:
Also, what's up with Terry O'Quinn's bitch tits? Seriously those are getting out of control.
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Cut the man some slack. He's 57 1/2.
 
brad92 said:
This also creates an apparent inconsistency. Anthony Cooper - who Sawyer labels a con-man - is the reason for his parents' death, yes? But Locke and his father are still on speaking terms, meaning he never took his kidney or threw him out a window. Now, if the two people are the same Anthony Cooper, how does this work exactly?
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We don't know that they are the same Anthony Cooper. We also don't know if that's what crippled John Locke. We also don't know, if that is what crippled John Locke, that he wasn't able to get over it. Hell, it was, what, 30+ years ago that Cooper conned Sawyer's family, it's even possible that he stopped conning in the alt. There is not enough information to determine what happened. That doesn't make it inconsistent.

brad92 said:
And Widmore! Chirst, what to make of this? This development apparently destroys all notions of him being on the same side as MIB which, at this point, makes absolutely no sense based upon what has been established.

EDIT: I take that back. Widmore and MIB are on the same side. Oh, what a second play-through can do for you.
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What? Who says? It's possible they could end up cutting a deal, since Smokey wants to leave the island and Widmore wants to have the island, but you're crazy if you think that they're both trustworthy enough to work together.
 
Yorick said:
We don't know that they are the same Anthony Cooper. We also don't know if that's what crippled John Locke. We also don't know, if that is what crippled John Locke, that he wasn't able to get over it. Hell, it was, what, 30+ years ago that Cooper conned Sawyer's family, it's even possible that he stopped conning in the alt. There is not enough information to determine what happened. That doesn't make it inconsistent.
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No, no, you are quite right. That's why I labeled it as 'apparent'. It may or may not be. I am inclined to believe in your latter sentiment.

Sorry for the misunderstanding.

Yorick said:
What? Who says? It's possible they could end up cutting a deal, since Smokey wants to leave the island and Widmore wants to have the island, but you're crazy if you think that they're both trustworthy enough to work together.
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Firstly, I'm not so sure we should be taking anything Flocke says seriously.

Secondly, there is substantial evidence since Season 4 that both MIB and Widmore have been collaborating in some form or another. I believe Widmore to be an operative of MIB. It is the ghostly form of Christian - likely a manifestation of the Monster - who pushes Locke to leave the Island, and calls for his death. "That's why they call it a sacrifice".

"I said that you had to move it, John.

It is then Widmore who find him in the middle of the desert, seriously injured.

He allows him to find the Oceanic Six with Abbadon. Abbadon makes it perfectly clear that he does not want Locke to succeed. In Hurley's case, he makes himself clearly visible to Hurley, who he appeared to only shortly before. "Are they still alive?".

He ensures that John finds out about Helen's death to further disenfranchise himself from what it is he thinks he is supposed to do.

Widmore wanted John to fail. He wanted him to die - either to commit suicide, or to be killed. He also wanted him to return to the Island regardless.

"There's a war coming, John, and if you're not back on the island when that happens, the wrong side is going to win."

'Recon' initially made me doubt this proposition, but I have since re-watched the episode and gathered otherwise.

Sawyer makes a proposition to Widmore:

"I'll bring the old man right to your doorstep... then you can kill him."

"What do you want in exchange, James?"

Then Sawyer tells Locke:

"I told them I'd tell you the coast was clear and bring you back with me... walk you right into their trap. That way they could kill you. Which means they'll be caught with their pants down when we change our plan of attack."

Locke says "I appreciate your loyalty."

Sawyer is assuming that Widmore and Locke want to fight each other. Widmore and Locke both look slightly amused at this. Judge for yourself. Neither of them directly confirms Sawyer's idea.

Sawyer is basing all of this off the pylons he saw, and the fact that Locke sent him to do recon.

But the pylons could just be a safety precaution for whatever interaction/negotiation Widmore and Locke are going to have. Locke is much more powerful than Widmore and could wipe out his whole team in Smokey mode.

So why did he send Sawyer to Hydra Island?

For the same reason Sawyer's briefcase always spills open - so the victim of the con can "see the money, get his hands on it." In this case the money = the plane. Sawyer had to see it with his own eyes.

Notice also, out of curiosity, that Locke asked Ben to meet him at the Hydra island where Widmore is setting up camp. Interesting that Locke hasn't gone yet.
 
Sawyer's plan for them to fight each other does feel too easy and convenient to me, but I'm not entirely convinced yet.

brad92 said:
It is then Widmore who find him in the middle of the desert, seriously injured.
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It's possible that Widmore was just watching that area. Being a leader of the Island, he could know where it drops people out. It would also be somewhat convenient for Smokey to be able to communicate with Widmore. He'd have to have someone who can come and go from the Island at will - or at least get transmissions out, which then kind of defeats the idea that Widmore has been searching for it the entire time.

brad92 said:
He allows him to find the Oceanic Six with Abbadon. Abbadon makes it perfectly clear that he does not want Locke to succeed. In Hurley's case, he makes himself clearly visible to Hurley, who he appeared to only shortly before. "Are they still alive?".

He ensures that John finds out about Helen's death to further disenfranchise himself from what it is he thinks he is supposed to do.

Widmore wanted John to fail. He wanted him to die - either to commit suicide, or to be killed. He also wanted him to return to the Island regardless.
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I think that Widmore only cared so far as he expected John Locke to lead him back to the Island. I don't think any of them gave a shit whether John succeeded or lived or died so long as he gave them the means to return. What they didn't count on was Ben coming back as well, and killing Abaddon.

You could be entirely correct, it's a sound theory, but I would hate that. I was talking to Samon yesterday and we both love the idea that Widmore is trying to take the entire island. It's not about becoming a leader of the Others again, he wants to take Jacob's place.

I'll be seriously bummed out if Widmore turns out to have joined either side, I really want an all out war to happen.
 
Yorick said:
I think that Widmore only cared so far as he expected John Locke to lead him back to the Island. I don't think any of them gave a shit whether John succeeded or lived or died so long as he gave them the means to return.
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So what exactly did allow Widmore to return? How is it exactly that Widmore used Locke to return to the Island? As far as I can tell, Widmore gained nothing from Bentham's little adventure.

I also find the timing of his arrival convenient. It isn't simply when Jacob dies that he comes back. It is when MIB kills him.

Yorick said:
It's not about becoming a leader of the Others again, he wants to take Jacob's place.
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I really like the idea.

My reservations are simply based off of what we have perceived from the characters' actions of the past.

But I too could be entirely wrong.

We'll see within the coming weeks, I guess.
 
brad92 said:
So what exactly did allow Widmore to return? How is it exactly that Widmore used Locke to return to the Island? As far as I can tell, Widmore gained nothing from Bentham's little adventure.
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I also find the timing of his arrival convenient. It isn't simply when Jacob dies that he comes back. It is when MIB kills him.[/QUOTE]

I've heard that Jacob's Death makes some things on the Island not function, and being "Hidden" is one of those things. Obviously anything right now is simply speculation since we don't have the full picture.

I didn't mean to imply that Widmore used Locke to get back to the Island, but I think that was his plan. It's been a while since I've seen it, but I'm pretty sure that after Abaddon dies, Locke drops somewhat into hiding. Jack tells him to sod off and the next we see of him is writing his suicide note. And I don't recall Widmore knowing what happened to Locke.

Ben told Locke straight out that Widmore was going to use him to get back to the island, and kill him. Given that Ben didn't know about Locke becoming Smokey, it's a safe bet that his understanding of what would happen was more, dare I say, realistic. In terms of Widmore actually getting to the island, Ben killed Locke when Locke told him what to do next - contact Eloise Hawking. It's not entirely out of the ordinary that Widmore would have done the same thing, or found out about the Ajira flight from that meeting. Ben, for all his other faults, was there essentially protecting the Oceanic Six from Widmore.

In my opinion, obviously.
 
What I don't understand is, how the **** does Widmore know anything about who the smoke monster is as a person. He was always operating on a level beneath Jacob and the other supernatural things it seemed.
 
Raziaar said:
What I don't understand is, how the **** does Widmore know anything about who the smoke monster is as a person. He was always operating on a level beneath Jacob and the other supernatural things it seemed.
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meh, im more bothered by how hurley knows what richard looks like when they've never shared any screen time.
 
Depicts accurately the journey of John Locke.
 
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