Sex Before Marriage?

[poseyjmac]

I'm the only one here who can make somewhat of a judgement here ...well you guys are all valid too but I'm the only one married (there's more but they havent posted in this thread yet)

Getting married doesn't automatically make you wise and give you automatic respect. i know plenty of idiotic married people. marriage isn't a reward for being intelligent.

you wait all your life to meet someone who you want to marry, you're so wrapped out in the excitement/emotion of the wedding day, she looks the best she ever has and you spoil the only opportunity to live that moment you'll ever have just because of inexperience? My honeymoon night was ....errr ..good because we had long ago established each other's likes and dislikes.

so howd it go? did you tell her,

<stern>hey honey i learned this trick from sara!
<wife>OOOOOH!
<stern> and this one from Julie!
<wife> AHHH MY GOD!! OOOH!
<stern> i learned this little maneuver from veronica....oh..sweet.sweet.veronica...
<wife> AAAAAOOOOHHHHH!

seriously, sex is not rocket science. you'd have to be an idiot to spoil it because you forget where your dong goes and how it moves. not to say there aren't things to learn that can heighten the experience. there definately are. but you talk about them as if they mean the difference between pleasure and suffering. thats just false. the fact that a wife and husband could learn together and see the improvement is a great possibility.

 

[MiccyNarc]

Did Jesus say you must marry beore having Sex: Yes, but he wasn't strong on the subject
Did God give us Free Will: Yes

How does this contradict?

 

[poseyjmac]

Asexuality isn't common, and we weren't built from the ground up for skydiving either.

It doesn't matter what you do as long as you don't do it to prove anything- to god, to your family, or to yourself.

you're not saying anything relevant here.

remember that the world is not black and white. one can value one thing over sex, still being sexual, but not giving it much effort.

 

[Griz]

seriously, sex is not rocket science. you'd have to be an idiot to spoil it because you forget where your dong goes and how it moves. not to say there aren't things to learn that can heighten the experience. there definately are. but you talk about them as if they mean the difference between pleasure and suffering. thats just false. the fact that a wife and husband could learn together and see the improvement is a great possibility.

If you'd had sex, you'd know just how very wrong most of that statement is.

Personally, i've yet to meet anyone who's first time was anything more than a slightly awkward, mediocre letdown especially in comparison to nearly every subsequent time. And surely you owe it to your wife to make her wedding night as special, in every way, as it can possibly be and not run the risk of things ending a little 'prematurely'....

What i should say though is that i think the idea of abstinence (especially among teenagers who are subject to rediculous levels of peer pressure to have sex when they're not ready) very admirable. Perhaps if more teenagers / young people thought that way less of my taxes would be spent on supporting '16 year old slapper Shazza from Liverpool and her 4 kids by 5 different fathers (yes 5! she's not sure who the father of the 4th is after an evening of daisychaining).

 

[jondy]

<stern>hey honey i learned this trick from sara!
<wife>OOOOOH!
<stern> and this one from Julie!
<wife> AHHH MY GOD!! OOOH!
<stern> i learned this little maneuver from veronica....oh..sweet.sweet.veronica...
<wife> AAAAAOOOOHHHHH!

Umm.... without making any easy shots as to your own virginity, I think you'll find experience doesn't quite work like that.

Oh, and my 'irrelevant' post was simply pointing out that most people do get sexual urges, and the main reason people abstain before marriage is morality. But you might have had to read between the lines a little.

 

[CrazyHarij]

I think sex is too much of an important thing in a relationship, it's vital no matter if the relationship will lead to marriage or not. The enjoyment, the feeling of connection, etc etc are some of the things I think every couple should go through together long before they even consider marriage.

Poseyjmac, most of your statements on the subject just makes it look like you haven't had sex at all but are just making "general" and vague claims with a tint of religiosity.

 

[poseyjmac]

right on schedule. i figured id get the 'you're probably a virgin if you think that way' remarks. really mature guys.

 

[Absinthe]

How could abstinence do harm?

As I detailed before. Many people who pledge abstinence ignore sexual education. They put a strenuous and unnecessary burden on themselves. And if they're not rushing into a marriage for sex, they're certainly breaking down before it. I don't have a link on me, but I recall a study coming to the conclusion that young adults that pledge abstinence are far more likely to engage in sexual intercourse, and virgin boys themselves were more likely to engage in anal sex.

I'm not saying this happens to all people who pledge abstinence. But it's clear that the majority of people were simply not made for it in mind and all it's doing is creating a host of problems.

And what is your idea of 'worth it?' I would think that when a person is ready, mature and willing to share themselves with a person who is worth it, they would be willing to commit to a relationship that will sustain the couple through out a life time. How convinient that we have the institution of marriage to cater for this commitment.

Except you don't require marriage for that. Nor is marriage some surefire mechanism that creates a long-lasting relationship. Yes, the ideal is for a relationship to last a lifetime, but that is far from the case in reality.

I believe that the act of sexual intercourse should be a meaningful and intimate one, and because of this, I believe that this act should only be carried out when it is with someone you trust, some one you care for, and someone who is willing to commit themselves to you for the rest of your life. That is the importance I attach to the intimate act of sex.

Intents behind actions. But if the relationship does not work out in the long run, does that mean that what you felt meant nothing? You're essentially implying that a failed relationship retroactively cheapens emotion, but there's absolutely no reason to think such a thing.

What I don't understand is why anyone else would be prepared to share something so intimate with a person if they are not willing to commit to that person. It seems to me that unless you are willing to commit yourself to the person you share this intamacy with for the rest of your life, then the insentive behind the intercourse isnt to share something intimate with someone, but to attain pleasure from someone without taking the responsibility of caring for that person.

What are you saying? That people who engage in premarital sex don't care for their partners? Pardon me, but what callous emotionless universe do you live in?

You act like attaining pleasure from sex is bad thing, but I don't believe so. A roll in the hay for some fun and pleasure is completely acceptible so long as the two partners are sensible about it.

This is the problem with premarital relationships. It's more about two people coming together to attain pleasure from eachother instead of two people coming together because they are mature enough to care for one another. Because two people who truly cared for one another, would stick together, like family, no matter how boring, or how unpleasureable the relationship got. Your parents dont kick you out of the house when they are sick of you. So why would your partner, who you have shared one of the most intimate experiences you've ever had in life, kick you out? Only because that partner was in the relationship due to selfish reasons, and not due to the responsibilities and commitments that kind of intimate relationship requires.

Frenzy, you sound like somebody who has never been in a relationship. If I'm wrong on that, then correct me, because you have no idea what you're talking about. Premarital relationships aren't all about getting pleasure. Conversely, there are plenty of marriages based on the shallow base of sex. Not all premarital relationships last, but neither do all marriages. So your entire argument about married people having more commitment than unmarried ones really falls apart.

And two people that really care for eachother do not need to remain in that kind of relationship if they find themselves incompatible, but there's nothing stopping them from maintaining close friendship and the like. You rest on so many suppositions and assumptions it's scary.

 

[CptStern]

Getting married doesn't automatically make you wise and give you automatic respect. i know plenty of idiotic married people. marriage isn't a reward for being intelligent.

way to take it out of context. I meant I could relate because the topic is about waiting till you're married ..well I'm married so I have insight into the issue

so howd it go? did you tell her,

<stern>hey honey i learned this trick from sara!
<wife>OOOOOH!
<stern> and this one from Julie!
<wife> AHHH MY GOD!! OOOH!
<stern> i learned this little maneuver from veronica....oh..sweet.sweet.veronica...
<wife> AAAAAOOOOHHHHH!

mildly insulting generalization aside I can see that you've never been intimate with someone you love ..it's not about technique but rather wanting to please someone because you love them

seriously, sex is not rocket science. you'd have to be an idiot to spoil it because you forget where your dong goes and how it moves.

there's art

and then there's art

not to say there aren't things to learn that can heighten the experience. there definately are. but you talk about them as if they mean the difference between pleasure and suffering. thats just false. the fact that a wife and husband could learn together and see the improvement is a great possibility.

not saying that that couldnt happen and I never said it was either pleasure or suffering ..my point is/was that sexual incompatibility is what ruins many marriages IMO it is better to know what you are getting into before you jump in headfirst ..and this comes from experience. I've both lived with someone for many years and am married

 

[poseyjmac]

its sad that sexual incompatibility ruins marriages. it just shows how shallow people are.

can you jerk me off right? well then you're a keeper! no? well then ill find someone else that can jerk me off better. people disgust me sometimes.

 

[CrazyHarij]

right on schedule. i figured id get the 'you're probably a virgin if you think that way' remarks. really mature guys.

Seriously. I'm not one to make prejudicial claims like this unless I really feel it's apt.

And writing shit like this..

<stern>hey honey i learned this trick from sara!
<wife>OOOOOH!
<stern> and this one from Julie!
<wife> AHHH MY GOD!! OOOH!
<stern> i learned this little maneuver from veronica....oh..sweet.sweet.veronica...
<wife> AAAAAOOOOHHHHH!

seriously, sex is not rocket science. you'd have to be an idiot to spoil it because you forget where your dong goes and how it moves. not to say there aren't things to learn that can heighten the experience. there definately are. but you talk about them as if they mean the difference between pleasure and suffering. thats just false.

..is obviously telling the tale of someone very inexperienced and probably just wanting to appear like an expert on the subject.

EDIT:

its sad that sexual incompatibility ruins marriages. it just shows how shallow people are.

can you jerk me off right? well then you're a keeper! no? well then ill find someone else that can jerk me off better. people disgust me sometimes.

Christ.. where to start..

 

[CptStern]

its sad that sexual incompatibility ruins marriages. it just shows how shallow people are.

can you jerk me off right? well then you're a keeper! no? well then ill find someone else that can jerk me off better. people disgust me sometimes.

stop being a jackass that's not all there is to it ..with that attitude I really dont feel like elaborating

 

[poseyjmac]

Christ.. where to start..

exactly. so many think with their penis they don't think with their brain.

many people, including most of the people in this thread, put all emphasis on physical pleasure, and disregard feelings and meaningful sacrifice. which is what abstaining is all about. you people think its all about sex, sex has to be perfect, etc.

sex is great, but there are more important things than sex. abstaining is bigger than that to some people. its making an extremly difficult sacrifice for the one you love. the sheer difficulty of it makes it extremely valuable to some people. people who don't think with their libido, but have actual feelings. crazy i know. but newsflash, love is not sex.

 

[poseyjmac]

stop being a jackass that's not all there is to it ..with that attitude I really dont feel like elaborating

yeah exactly. go use your penis, don't bother using your brain. your wife doesn't care for that anyway.

 

[Absinthe]

many people, including most of the people in this thread, put all emphasis on physical pleasure, and disregard feelings and meaningful sacrifice. which is what abstaining is all about. you people think its all about sex, sex has to be perfect, etc.

Don't be ridiculous. We know there's more to a meaningful relationship thatn sex. It is you who makes it to be such a big deal with your "sacrifice" and whatnot.

An extreme sacrifice for the one you love... and that you haven't met yet either, right? How insane.

yeah exactly. go use your penis, don't bother using your brain. your wife doesn't care for that anyway.

Wow. If I had to select a post that's most out of line in this topic, this would be my nomination.

 

[CrazyHarij]

exactly. so many think with their penis they don't think with their brain.

many people, including most of the people in this thread, put all emphasis on physical pleasure, and disregard feelings and meaningful sacrifice. which is what abstaining is all about. you people think its all about sex, sex has to be perfect, etc.

sex is great, but there are more important things than sex. abstaining is bigger than that to some people. its making an extremly difficult sacrifice for the one you love. the sheer difficulty of it makes it extremely valuable to some people. people who don't think with their libido, but have actual feelings. crazy i know. but newsflash, love is not sex.

You're a ****ing idiot. Sorry. You completely misinterpret what we're talking about while there are some VERY experienced people here explaining what it's all about.

I thought sex was only about physical pleasure.. until I actually had sex.

 

[ComradeBadger]

Sex is fun.

Casual sex is more fun

 

[CptStern]

yeah exactly. go use your penis, don't bother using your brain. your wife doesn't care for that anyway.

you dont know me, stfu and dont bring my wife into it ..that's a backhand slapping offense had you said it to my face


I love my wife and it's far more pure then your silly notion of what love is, which is based on nothing more than archaic puritanical ideals that are long dead

 

[kirovman]

I think a lot of people find they are sexually incompatible due to a lot of underlying factors and other incompatibilities. It's not all physical. It's psychological connections too.

Oh and think before you start insulting people's wives. Troll.

 

[AzzMan]

Sex is fun.

Casual sex is more fun

^5 to that brotha:thumbs:

 

[Direwolf]

Being in a serious relationship enlightened me also. One way or another, sex isn't just sex. Usually the people I meet who deviate from the sexual norm (they won't have sex before marriage etc) have more messed up relationships than the rest of us.

 

[Tantalus]

I am a LCMS Lutheran, so I think that it's a sin, purely because it's in the bible as a sin.

But from a non-religous standpoint, I think it's okay. Can be good or bad depending on the couple.

 

[poseyjmac]

Don't be ridiculous. We know there's more to a meaningful relationship thatn sex. It is you who makes it to be such a big deal with your "sacrifice" and whatnot.

An extreme sacrifice for the one you love... and that you haven't met yet either, right? How insane.

im not surprised that you don't understand this concept.

 

[poseyjmac]

You're a ****ing idiot. Sorry. You completely misinterpret what we're talking about while there are some VERY experienced people here explaining what it's all about.

I thought sex was only about physical pleasure.. until I actually had sex.

you're violating forum rules by flaming me.

 

[poseyjmac]

you dont know me, stfu and dont bring my wife into it ..that's a backhand slapping offense had you said it to my face


I love my wife and it's far more pure then your silly notion of what love is, which is based on nothing more than archaic puritanical ideals that are long dead

its funny how worked up you people get about this. it definately is striking a nerve. a nerve of regret perhaps?

you still don't get it though. it has nothing to do with puritanical ideas, or religion. its a simple gift of sacrifice. gifts are meaningful, religion or none.

 

[kirovman]

I'm sure you made him get worked up. Maybe it's because you were busy insulting him about his wife? That would tend to make most people get annoyed.

There's a few people who don't like Stern's point of view on these boards, but I don't believe many have stooped so low as that.

 

[poseyjmac]

I'm sure you made him get worked up. Maybe it's because you were busy insulting him about his wife? That would make most people get annoyed.

There's a few people who don't like Stern's point of view on these boards, but I don't believe many have stooped so low as that.

i haven't stooped to any low. i was proving a point and i meant no ill will towards his wife. but if someone tries to 'bring it' on a forum and drags his wife into the fray, he can't expect things to be all rose petals. it just shows you should be careful before divulging sensitive information about things that are personal to you on a forum. again, no insult was intended towards his wife.

 

[CptStern]

its funny how worked up you people get about this. it definately is striking a nerve. a nerve of regret perhaps?

who are you to judge what my motivations are? you havent the foggiest clue as to who I am, if you had you would know regret doesnt fit into any of my life choices ...we'll see 30 yrs down the road if I'm still married ...and it wont be because I took a chance and leaped into a life long commitment without knowing what I was getting into. The only nerve you struck was insulting my wife

you still don't get it though. it has nothing to do with puritanical ideas, or religion. its a simple gift of sacrifice. gifts are meaningful, religion or none.

no it's you who doesnt "get it" ..your puritanical POV subscribes to the archaic notion that chastity = purity. In other words a woman cant be pure if she's sullied herself by having sex with someone else ..it's bigoted sexist and completely stupid. That "gift" is self serving and serves no purpose whatsoever

 

[Tantalus]

you're violating forum rules by flaming me.

You're violating forum rules by spamming. Three posts in a row.


I agree with you, too many people think with their little head between their legs. But that does not mean that's all they think with.

Just because a relationship has premarital sex doesn't mean that it's not based off of love. That seems to be the point you're missing.

 

[CptStern]

i haven't stooped to any low. i was proving a point and i meant no ill will towards his wife. but if someone tries to 'bring it' on a forum and drags his wife into the fray, he can't expect things to be all rose petals. it just shows you should be careful before divulging sensitive information about things that are personal to you on a forum. again, no insult was intended towards his wife.

your backpedaling is in vain; your post proves your intent. And I didnt drag my wife into it YOU did. And I dont believe for a minute your insult wasnt deliberate

What sensitive information? I gave away no such info

 

[poseyjmac]

who are you to judge what my motivations are? you havent the foggiest clue as to who I am, if you had you would know regret doesnt fit into any of my life choices ...we'll see 30 yrs down the road if I'm still married ...and it wont be because I took a chance and leaped into a life long commitment without knowing what I was getting into. The only nerve you struck was insulting my wife

so you gauge a relationship by the sex. maybe its just me, but that seems a bit shallow.

no it's you who doesnt "get it" ..your puritanical POV subscribes to the archaic notion that chastity = purity. In other words a woman cant be pure if she's sullied herself by having sex with someone else ..it's bigoted sexist and completely stupid. That "gift" is self serving and serves no purpose whatsoever

its true. a woman can't be sexually pure unless she is a virgin. but thats just life. that doesn't dictate that she will never have true love or find the one man that she will be with for the rest of her life. you need to stop attaching assumptions onto purity.

how can it be sexist when many women agree with it? its shared by many people as a valuable and unique gift, which is not self-serving. on the contrary its actually the opposite, its the most self-less and difficult act you could ever give a woman.

but again, as great as the gift is, i don't consider it the ultimate end all be all, and if you can't pull it off, then why try. on the other hand, the amount of anger in your posts suggests that you may think otherwise despite what you say.

 

[poseyjmac]

your backpedaling is in vain; your post proves your intent. And I didnt drag my wife into it YOU did. And I dont believe for a minute your insult wasnt deliberate

What sensitive information? I gave away no such info

so then im a psychic for knowing you have a wife? she was just part of an example, so calm down.

 

[poseyjmac]

Just because a relationship has premarital sex doesn't mean that it's not based off of love. That seems to be the point you're missing.

you haven't been reading my posts fully then. quote me where i said a relationship can't be based off love if premarital sex is had.

 

[Angry Lawyer]

Sex is great fun, no contesting it, just like alcohol and programming (all of which are probably bad for your health in some way).

-Angry Lawyer

 

[Sulkdodds]

Ahem.

<stern>hey honey i learned this trick from sara!
<wife>OOOOOH!
<stern> and this one from Julie!
<wife> AHHH MY GOD!! OOOH!
<stern> i learned this little maneuver from veronica....oh..sweet.sweet.veronica...
<wife> AAAAAOOOOHHHHH!

yeah exactly. go use your penis, don't bother using your brain. your wife doesn't care for that anyway.

you're violating forum rules by flaming me.

its funny how worked up you people get about this. it definately is striking a nerve. a nerve of regret perhaps?

really mature guys.

And of course...

many people, including most of the people in this thread, put all emphasis on physical pleasure, and disregard feelings and meaningful sacrifice. which is what abstaining is all about. you people think its all about sex, sex has to be perfect, etc.

I think they save themselves for when they are ready, mature, and willing to share themselves with a person they think is worth it.

The enjoyment, the feeling of connection

What are you saying? That people who engage in premarital sex don't care for their partners? Pardon me, but what callous emotionless universe do you live in?

I don't think it's relevant whether sex is before marriage or not. What is relevant is whether you really love the person - the point of sex with someone you love is not mainly the sex part, but the love part.

Premarital relationships aren't all about getting pleasure.

Sex for the sake of sex is wrong in my view, i respect myself too much for that... but if you love the person then you dont need a peice of paper to tell you its ok to have sex.

If you expect to find yourself in shallow relationships where the major basis for love is sheer ****ing, then perhaps that holds true to you, but it doesn't for most people. If you get your panties into a twist because your partner has had sex in the past, then you have issues. Mature and loving couples should focus on their present experiences and what it means to them instead of hanging themselves up on a past lover.
You have this RIDICULOUS notion that "true" love is only possible through marriage. What a crock. You may not marry the girlfriend you had at 16, but that doesn't make the experience you had at the time any less real and valid.

Hmmmm. :dozey:

 

[CptStern]

so you gauge a relationship by the sex. maybe its just me, but that seems a bit shallow.

yes, it is you ..because no one who's ever been in a long term relationship would claim that sex is what defines a relationship. Again you have no clue as to what my motivations are ..my wife wasnt my first, second, third or fourth ..there's a reason why I married her and not the others ..but again I dont have to validate my relationship to the likes of you

its true. a woman can't be sexually pure unless she is a virgin. but thats just life.

...and you claim puritanical ideology doesnt motivate you ...please dont try to feed me that idiotic crap ..sex is more than just a physical act ..but you cant seem to get that

that doesn't dictate that she will never have true love or find the one man that she will be with for the rest of her life. you need to stop attaching assumptions onto purity.

you are attaching the assumption not I. Being a virgin does not make a person pure ..I'm sure there's plenty of serial killers who were virgins. It is innocence of spirit that makes a person pure ..whether or not they've partaken in a physical bodily function is immaterial to purity ..it's only religion that attachs that stigma to purity

how can it be sexist when many women agree with it? its shared by many people as a valuable and unique gift, which is not self-serving. on the contrary its actually the opposite, its the most self-less and difficult act you could ever give a woman.

well then if she didnt want to abstain and had been with other people would that make your "gift" any less meaningful? or does it only go one way: you must BOTH be pure

but again, as great as the gift is, i don't consider it the ultimate end all be all, and if you can't pull it off, then why try. on the other hand, the amount of anger in your posts suggests that you may think otherwise despite what you say.

anger? I wasnt pissed off till you insulted my wife ...god knows why I'd get angry at that :upstare:

 

[KoreBolteR]

sex before marriage, of course!

marriage is when your officially together ON PAPER.

as soon as you meet and become an item is when you shud have sex!

but... one night stands are good too.... so

 

[Nat Turner]

poseyjmac has terrible logic and reasoning in what he's trying to say.

At least he's only ruining his own life through abstinence. My theory is that he's psychologically unable to be happy having premarital sex, because he has been brainwashed to a false sense of morality. He would feel guilty. It's really sad.

He has to be happy by not experiencing the greatest pleasure in life during his sexual prime.
I can be happy and also experience this great pleasure.

I kinda feel sorry for him.

edit: clarifying

 

[poseyjmac]

Ahem.

i can take peoples quotes out of context to. but at least make a point off our false contexts.

 

[poseyjmac]

yes, it is you ..because no one who's ever been in a long term relationship would claim that sex is what defines a relationship. Again you have no clue as to what my motivations are ..my wife wasnt my first, second, third or fourth ..there's a reason why I married her and not the others ..but again I dont have to validate my relationship to the likes of you

so then why are you posting right now?

...and you claim puritanical ideology doesnt motivate you ...please dont try to feed me that idiotic crap ..sex is more than just a physical act ..but you cant seem to get that

False. ive already agreed that sex is more than a physical act.

you are attaching the assumption not I. Being a virgin does not make a person pure ..I'm sure there's plenty of serial killers who were virgins. It is innocence of spirit that makes a person pure ..whether or not they've partaken in a physical bodily function is immaterial to purity ..it's only religion that attachs that stigma to purity

being a virgin does not make one pure. but it does make one sexually pure. thats the only point i was making.

well then if she didnt want to abstain and had been with other people would that make your "gift" any less meaningful? or does it only go one way: you must BOTH be pure

it doesn't make the gift any less meaningful. it just makes her gift not as great.

anger? I wasnt pissed off till you insulted my wife ...god knows why I'd get angry at that :upstare:

you weren't pissed off till you thought i had insulted your wife. but no i didn't do that. btw this is a forum. getting angry won't do you any good but make your posts more sloppy.