weed..whats the big deal??

[No Limit]

Nice points Rico, but here is why they are wrong /

Originally posted by Rico You can call me close minded and bash me all i want but the point stands that nobody will ever listen to pro-legalization arguments if you don't have any scientific proof that pot will make society better. As for the crime rates in america, please go to a less developed country and see if i'm not right. I know i am because i was born and raised in Venezuela, one of the better countries around South America and before i moved to america i thought crime was low in my country... here you see stories about a single murder and everyone is outraged, there you see people get killed for the shoes they wear and its just aknowledged and then moved on.

Ever heard of a small place called Amsterdam? The decriminalization of pot pretty much got rid of crime in that entire area. You simply can not have any scientific evidence in this matter as pot is illegal in most countries, the only exception (Amsterdam) goes on the side of people wanting it legal.

As foar as your "alcohol is more harmful than weed" argument, i completely agree. Alcohol IS pretty bad, but i believe i already stated the reason why it still remains legal in society. Anything done in moderation can be good though so you can't argue the points of legalizing a new drug if you say everyone will use it in moderation. The sad fact is that maybe a few people will, but a lot of people will abuse it hence causing more trouble than it caused before it was made legal.

You are completely missing the point here. You automatically associate making weed legal with the fact everyone will smoke if that happens. If weed is legal or illegal, roughly the same amount of people will smoke, moderation has nothing to do with anything. Yes, there will be idiots but these idiots are here anyway and there is nothing we can do to get rid of them. Punishing an entire society simply because a small percentage is not responsible isn't a way to make laws, especially when those laws won't decrease the amount of idiots.

The age group that consumes ganja is somewhere around 10 - 25 years of age (there may be some exceptions and i apologize if i'm wrong) and more often than not it's a passing fad. How can anyone say they smoked pot "because they enjoyed it" if you had never smoked pot before? I'm not talking about smoking it for the second time, i'm talking about the first time you ever did it. You couldn't have know if you enjoyed it or not simply because you had never tried it before, so it all comes down to either being cool or having a physical condition.

You are probably right on with the age group (even though I know a couple people over 50 that smoke but that is an extremely small percentage). Yes, people start smoking because of peer pressure, but people do that for everything, including alcohol. However, that again has nothing to do with it. Peer pressure will be there whether weed is legal or illegal.

I really don't mind the current condition on mariuana as it is right now. It's illegal but its not as widespread as some people make believe. and no i am not some holier-than-thou religious freak who doesn't do anything bad, i drink at parties and in moderation, i can honestly say i have been drunk a few times but i haven't done naything stupid or soemthing i would regret during those times because i don't drink simply to 'get hammered'. Heck i have been drinking with my dad ever since i was 9. I am simply stating my opinion on the subject at hand.

Nothing to say on that as its not really a point, just want to quote everything you say so someone doesn't accuse me of ignoring your points .

To those people who say "pot smokers aren't violent!" i will tell you this story.

Once i was in a party and i was having a great time. During that party a lot of alcohol and drugs were exchanged but i always stayed away from the things i believed were too stupid to do. I simply don't use any kind of drug unless i am sick or in pain, i was neither of those. I was there minding my own business and talking to some friends when some guy approached me, the smell of pot all over his clothes asking me "why aren't you smoking?" I replied i simply didn't like it and i didn't mind if they did it as long as i didn't have to do it. What happened contradicts everything you people say about peaceful smokers. These guys tried to grab me and force me to smoke pot. Being the big guy that i am (im of pretty bulky build, not a bodybuilder but muscular nonetheless) i managed to get away from most of these guys, i had to leave the party smashing people in the face with my fist and i even had to hit a guy with a chair so he would stop chasing me around. Of course i left after that.

You were at a party, do you honestly thing that all those people didn't drink? I can guarantee you they were violent and stupid because of alcohol, not pot. I smoked pot and know many people that have. Weed does not make you want to hit things or force people to do anything, high people simply want to sit on their ass and have you leave them alone. This is not meant as anything bad toward you but you are arrogant because you never smoked weed. I promise you and I'm sure anyone that has smoked pot will say the same, weed does not make you violent.

Now why would they try to force someone to smoke pot? Of course to get people addicted. Pot works differently for different people. For some people it does nothing, for some it makes them feel sick, for others it gives them that euphoric high which most of the potsmokers are after. Not everyone can get addicted, but face it, pot is an addictive drug, if not why do you think drug dealers make so much money nowadays? I had some friends who dealt drugs, and let me tell you they were making more money than people who actually got college degrees and worked 40 hours a week non stop.

First off, no matter what you are raised to believe, people that smoke pot are not some kind of hidden society that force you to take a hit so they can recruit you. One hit sure as hell will not make you addicted, you probably won't even feel the effect of the drug. Second, just above you said that most people quit smoking by the time they hit 25. This means that weed IS NOT addictive as people will simply stop without any kind of treatment. Cigarettes, which many people smoke until the day they die, are addictive.

As far as medical use is concerned, i have absolutely nothing against the medical use of pot, heck they already use cocaine as medicine as i already explained in a past post. Selling pot legally would only increase expenses, the government would have to grow it to avoid paying foreign countries and pot does not grow in any climate, it requires a tropical climate in order for it to be grown. After legalizing pot the government would also have to spend even more money on educating the consumer. Ad campaigns cost a lot of money believe it or not.

The government should be educating the consumer about pot right now. This is the entire problem of drug abuse, if a certain drug is legal or not has nothing to do with how many people use it. Education has almost everything to do with it. Sure, it will cost a lot of money. However, you are forgetting how much money the government would make if pot was legal, hell, probably 1 % of that would be enough to educated the public.

Then comes then enforcing of safety while smoking pot. Who's going to keep an eye on people who smoke to make sure they don't do anything stupid like drive and smoke at the same time? You can't just hope they won't do it, you need to actively prevent it from happening. all of this costs money, and i guarantee you it will cost a lot more than what you can get from legalizing pot.

This is the whole point. Currently the government can not contol how people do drugs because it is illegal. If it was legal the government could regulate it to help prevent people doing stupid things. If you think this will cost more than what the government will get than you obviously have no clue how much revenue weed generates each year.

READ SECOND PART AS THIS POST IS TOO LONG

 

[No Limit]

PART 2

I really don't care what you people do with your personal freedom, but the moment that freedom infringes on mine we have a problem. Do as you wish as long as it doesn't affect anyone else but you. Pot clouds your judgement, otherwise you wouldn't use it at all. A clouded mind can do stupid things, things it would not do if it weren't under the influence of drugs. I have seen people kill themselves because the growing paranoia of using pot constantly (pot makes some people slightly paranoid) made them think shooting themselves in the head would solve all their problems.

You are correct, but once again, this will happen if weed is legal or not. If anything having it legal will help the situation because of education.

As far as laws are concerned, i analize everything i am told to do and not to do, if i deem it logical i follow it, if now i recheck everything and actually do my research before bashing such a law. Laws were put in place through a system, a system that i believe to be more credible than the single voice of someone who smokes pot. For a law of this kind to pass it requires analisys by hundreds of people. What are the chances hundreds of people passed a law just to piss people off? Very small... Very small.

But it is not a single person that smokes pot. There are millions of people in this nation that do not agree with the current laws. Many of these people have never smoked pot but did enough research on it to come to their conclusion, something the current law makers are not doing.

When you smoke pot you take a risk, the current risk is being fined or jailed. You make your own decisions and do it anyways. That is your choice. Nobody is saying you can't do it, the yare just telling you that if you do it you will face consequences. If you don't want to go to jail go to a state where pot is decriminalized, i believe florida is one of them, i'm not sure... The point is you already have the choice of using pot, my view as i stands now is that someone who smokes pot and complains about it is very close to a thief who steals something and then demands that stealing be made legal. It's illegal right now, if you cared so much about the legality of the proccess you wouldn't have used it until it was made legal or at least decriminalized.

Nothing personal toward you again but the above reasoning is absolutely stupid. What if using a computer was illegal? Would that mean that anyone using a computer is the same as a theif that wants the law changed?

A fine for smoking pot sounds reasonable to me... heck if they fined alcohol i bet there wouldn't be as many drunk-related accidents either.

I was disagreeing with you on everything up to the last part, now I have no clue on which side you are on .

 

[pat_thetic]

Tell me one person who thinks pot should be legalized and does not take pot?

 

[No Limit]

Originally posted by pat_thetic
Tell me one person who thinks pot should be legalized and does not take pot?

My dad always bitched about pot being illegal and I know that he never smoked. I have a few friends that never smoked that feel the same way. This whole, tell me one person who doesn't smoke pot and thinks pot should be legalized is a really stupid argument. All the people that think pot should be legal posted their arguments and these arguments seem to be winning. Unless you have some evidance against why pot should be legal its clear from this debate that pot should be legal and anyone opposed to it cannot come up with any good back up for their opinion. This is how almost every debate over pot has ended but the people making the laws refuse to listen and have a closed mind about all this.

 

[Rico]

I believe that pot should be decriminalized but not made entirely legal. That's where i stand on my argument. You do whatever you want to do, just keep in mind that like smoking cigarretes, it will be an expensive vice if you keep getting caught by the police.

I think decriminalization is a good middle ground for both parties.

 

[Maxi]

Should stay illegal... I can already do stuff when heavily drunk..

 

[TaiFong]

How about no, since I don't want to be getting high off of second hand smoke. Or how about in the future when I have a child and there is someone smoking weed nearby. You KNOW they are going to be assholes about putting it out just like cigarette smokers. Would you want your toddlers to be high? Is that an entertaining thought? Cigarette smoke is bad enough for kids. With marijuana, not only are their lungs getting damaged, but their brain functions are being drastically altered. This is obviously not a good thing.

 

[king John I]

this is such a stupid post.



is there such a thing as internet police?

 

[Shakermaker]

For all you history lovers out there, look this one up: criminalisation of drugs was started by the USA in the 1920's (with alcohol btw; proves the point it IS a drug). After WWII, the Americans started 'persuading' allies to do the same. Example: in the late 1940's European countries that wanted to get cash and loans from the USA through the Marshall-plan, had to agree to making the use of drugs illegal.

On-topic: I favour full legalisation of all drugs. You can't beat it, so you better join it. And profit from it, like mchammer wrote. Tax the hell out of anyone that wants to try any kind of drugs.

 

[pat_thetic]

Legalize every drug? That would be like some sort of population control!!

 

[nw909]

Originally posted by king John I
this is such a stupid post.



is there such a thing as internet police?

Sir, you're coming with us.

 

[Wildhound]

Originally posted by EvilEwok2.0
especially one as popular and deadly as weed, will only **** the world up more.

THC (tetrahydrocannabinol) is the active ingredient in marijuana. It cannot kill you. In fact it is physically impossible to overdose on THC, this has been proven numerous times, in numerous studies, through animal testing.

Furthermore, any negative effects have yet to be proven. Research has even shown that marijuana may assist in the fighting of cancer as long-term smokers are far less likely to contract it.

Also, consider this, Marijuana is currently a class C drug, like asparin. Whereas alcohol - were it not legal - would be a class A drug, right up there with Heroine and Cocaine.

I'll close by saying this: Personally, I do not smoke 'weed' and never have. I do, however, know the facts having studied it numerous times during my involvement with EYP. It's virtually harmless compared with drugs that are already freely available, it is even far less harmful than nicotine. If people want to smoke it, they should be free to go right ahead.

 

[RakuraiTenjin]

Originally posted by RandomPING
Marijuana doesn't give brain damage, it doesn't even kill brain cells. It creates a thin coat around the brain that degrades over a while if a person isn't exposed to pot. The coating only slows down mental process's slightly (or moderately depending on if the person is a heavy user for many years) but doesn't physically damage the brain.
The only way pot could have given anyone brain damage is if it was laced with something heavy, or she was exposed to it as an infant. And liquor and nicotine also would have simmilar effects on a developing mind.
It is really sad that your niece has brain damage, but it isn't from pot. Pot's effects are known and those simply arn't side effects. If she had a chemical inbalence it's possible, or an allergic reaction then thats possible too, but that's like blaming milk for a lactose intollerent person drinking it and getting sick.

Her mother smoked pot. And yes, it's confirmed, it was from the marijuana =/.

And also considering how my SISTER's life is now, she doesn't have brain damage, but she's a ****ing loser, and it from marijuana, she's told us.

Over my dead body will it be legalized in the states, and I swear to god, if it gets near that point, I will probably truthfully try to kill the main politician pushing it.

 

[Warbie]

Anyone who thinks pot does no harm hasn't been in contact with many long term smokers.

Many ppl dabble at school or uni - but that's very different. If pot is legalised there will be a big increase in in long term, daily smokers ... the only ppl who will benefit will be the psychiatrists.

 

[mchammer75040]

Originally posted by Warbie
Anyone who thinks pot does no harm hasn't been in contact with many long term smokers.

Many ppl dabble at school or uni - but that's very different. If pot is legalised there will be a big increase in in long term, daily smokers ... the only ppl who will benefit will be the psychiatrists.

See i really hate this crap, no offense but seriously go read all of the previous pages this has already been talked about for like the entire time and we have already proven how it can benefit us.:dozey:

 

[crabcakes66]

Originally posted by pat_thetic
Tell me one person who thinks pot should be legalized and does not take pot?

my parents certainly dont smoke.......but they are see the benefits of it being legal.

and the supidity and propagada that surounds it.

 

[crabcakes66]

couldnt edit above post.

Originally posted by pat_thetic
Tell me one person who thinks pot should be legalized and does not take pot?

my parents certainly dont smoke.......but they see the benefits of it being legal.

and the supidity and propagada that surounds it.


I see alot of people in this thread that have been brainwashed...and have NO clue what they are talking about.......


you know they dont always tell you the truth in school guys....you need to make you own decisions




1. IS POT ADDICTIVE?

yes it is. both physically and mentally......its on about the same level as tobacco

I have first hand exerpiance....i used to be a pot head. Im not ashamed of that. It was self medication.

alchohol is MUCH more addictive and much more dangerous....i have had first hand experiance with both alcoholics and potheads

take a guess at witch one id rather be?....wich one is destructive?.....witch one beat there children in front of me?

.....wich one walked down the street at 3 in the afternoon in ther boxers singing?
wich one had EXTREME emotional imbalances?(pot can cuase emotional imbalance also)


2. IS POT SMOKE HARMFUL?

Yes it is. any smoke is harmful. just about anything you take into your lungs other than nitrogen and oxygen is harmful to you. anything that burns is releasing toxic chemicals......

the air in your house right now is full of dust and other particulate matter....is it harmful? yes and no, your lungs have adapted(since birth) to this enviroment..they regenerate faster than they are damaged.

when you inhale something like smoke......they are damaged faster than they regenerate......and can be permantly damaged if they dont have time to repair that damage in between smoking.

3. DOES POT CAUSE CANCER?

Yes it can. this goes hand in hand with #2.......... you are weakining your lungs and injecting toxic chemicals into your body...... its no differant than anything else you do......i garantee everything you eat drink and touch at some point someone will say has a chance of cuasing or curing cancer.


4. CAN POT KILL YOU?(from smoking to much in one sitting, or the first time you smoke it)

No. The only way to die from pot is asphyxiation. The active ingrediant can not kill you in any logical dosage.(anything can kill you in a large enough amount, from water to cold medicine )


5. DOES POT CUASE BRAIN DAMAGE?


Short term- yes it will slow you down if you smoke alot....it will make you lazy.......it wil damage your lungs.

long term- if you stop smoking there are no long term effects that have ever been proven......the same is not true for alcohol



......now....im sure most of you know the effects of alchohol.

if you dont....then multiply any of my negative comments towards pot by 10x and add violance and liver diseise....and extreme emotional instability as well as an addiction thats almost as bad as heroin.....



now.....? why is alohol lega?l........and 1 alcoholic has the right to destroy more lives than 100 people that smoke pot once in a while, ever will?

....and why is something comparitivly less dangerous than the most widley abused drug in THE WORLD ilegal?

becuase most of you have been brainwashed to think so.

 

[Warbie]

Where has it been stated that pot can benefit you mchammer75040??

For all these studies and tests noone still has an idea of the long term effects.

I hate to sound like a broken record but I know many ppl who have been harmed by smoking pot - don't try and tell me that cannabis is harmless when it's blatantly not true.

I smoked everyday for almost a decade - and spent all that time hanging out with 100's of other smokers. This is what my judgement is based on. That and all the scientific studies which say scientists still havn't really got a clue.

 

[crabcakes66]

Originally posted by Warbie
Where has it been stated that pot can benefit you mchammer75040??

For all these studies and tests noone still has an idea of the long term effects.

I hate to sound like a broken record but I know many ppl who have been harmed by smoking pot - don't try and tell me that cannabis is harmless when it's blatantly not true.

I smoked everyday for almost a decade - and spent all that time hanging out with 100's of other smokers. This is what my judgement is based on. That and all the scientific studies which say scientists still havn't really got a clue.

explain how its any worse than alcohol....or over the counter cold medicine....

 

[NSPIRE]

Never smoked it and not plannin' to. I don't do narcotics, I just drink. Drinking's fine . Just not the herbs.

 

[crabcakes66]

Originally posted by NSPIRE
Never smoked it and not plannin' to. I don't do narcotics, I just drink. Drinking's fine . Just not the herbs.

ignorance at its best........thankyou for summing up my whole point.

 

[mchammer75040]

Originally posted by Warbie
Where has it been stated that pot can benefit you mchammer75040??

For all these studies and tests noone still has an idea of the long term effects.

I hate to sound like a broken record but I know many ppl who have been harmed by smoking pot - don't try and tell me that cannabis is harmless when it's blatantly not true.

I smoked everyday for almost a decade - and spent all that time hanging out with 100's of other smokers. This is what my judgement is based on. That and all the scientific studies which say scientists still havn't really got a clue.

Didnt say it didnt harm you. Like i listed in my first post, it has benefits to our society as a whole. Later on i added more in saying different cultures have used it to cure illnesses such as loss of apetite that ARE deadly. The money we would save busting drug dealers, we could use to educate rather than force everything underground. Dont ask anything about what i just said(no offense), its already been posted way before.

Then there is personal freedom. And if anyone of you say that is a childish thing to say you take everything in front of you for granted. The freedoms in the USA (im assuming you live in the usa but this also applies to other countries with similar views of the USA) is something you should hold close, alot of countries dont give their people those freedoms. Im not going to elaborate anymore on those im sick and tired of repeating myself, if you want to know in detail read the posts.

 

[K e r b e r o s]

Wow,

I just came by the forums today and decided to read up on a few things--then to the best of interests, I stumble...here

To be honest, the author of the thread was addressing from his own emotional standpoint asking: Whats the big deal about it?

My Opinion:

First and foremost, your going to get a lot of different views on this subject--and we can thank the media for granting over-powered "title presiding over right" sociality groups for down placing people who are not even technical dangers to others.

But the point being, "on why it is such a big deal", is because its a danger to how we choose to live our lifes. Certain drugs have since been illegal since the early 1950's when the dangers of them became easily apparent--people usually taking the drugs do not realize the situations at hand they cause; and its because its illegal that noone really wants it.

You risk arrest upon having it--thats the big deal. Because its illegal.

We could all talk of: "Have you tried it?" or "Ignorance at its best" to retort against my arguments, but my sole point being is; "Have you tried getting off of it?" And that question serves more relevance--its asking you, can you feel good without drugs? Sure. Type yes. Type no. But I know that in more situations these people whom I question here are not being honest only to support their own arguments.

Yea sure, the question of, "Well have you tried it?" ties a lot of tongues, but not for mine. My experiences of it were'nt bad at all--infact I just moved on with my life; HOWEVER, the experiences I've seen others have with it alarms me. Furthering my point, my friend John drinks and smokes weed--we are still best friends, just I choose not to be around him when he does these things, because he really has no idea what the **** he is doing:

Example One:
He smokes--he starts to push or rub-up against me. Not cool.

Example Two:
He drinks, he starts to get louder--he wants to play fight, then tries to turn the issue series.

Bad experiences have any motiv to my opinion? Not anything of personal venue I've done to myself--but what people have done unto me or themselves because of it. Now we could argue their are different people everywhere, and granted, THAT cannot be DENIED.

However, what majority do these people factor under? I read somewhere on this thread that 80 to 90% of the total population has been offered this kind of drug--thats bullshit druggies try to use; making their point much more clear through the use of false statistics to "weed" their message in that "drugs are more prominant, make em legal."

The fact is, its a 50/50 split between the people who are dangerous that use them, and the people who are'nt dangerous that use them.
But we have no psycological distinctions on who is danerous or peacefull--and because its readily capable of making someone emotional or physically unstable for a given time-period, its a risk noone is really willing to take. Lets consider that the actual figures of drug related issues factor about 30 to 50 percent of the population. Considering nearly 30 to 50 percent of the general population has:

*Tried Drugs and Quit

*Tried Drugs and is still on them

*Witnessed or dealt drug use

that 50/50 split of any of the given percentages ranging from 30 to 50 still maintains an overall danger--considering now were a country with 210 million people living in it right now.

And as I stated above, the psycological distinctions usually are'nt as accurate, prominant, or capable of safe-guarding people who become victims of drugs.

We can also thank the media and the Public Schools for Hinting drug use makes a person bad--I don't distinct these people are bad, Christ, their ****ing people to begin with. However, on the fly you do repeatedly something stupid in my presences, using this drug, don't be suprised if I distinct that what your smoking is the reason for your own arrogance.

I don't live paranoid--I just live safe. I let people use drugs; I don't bug them. But when they bug me and try to get me to use them--I don't ****ing want them. I want to be myself, and I don't need drugs in my life because the fact of the matter is; my life and how it progresses is a high--What about yours?


Summary: Drugs feel good--but their side effects are bad.
Its illegal, and thats the big deal--thats why noone wants them around or to hear about them; let alone see any for you might get blaimed by the asshole who has them, you carry them aswell.

---other issues---

I agree with some of the people who've said the goverments involvement to "safe secure" you to be a certain way is wrong; theres no doubt the government tries to instill lawing that otherwise reduces us to the mentality of sheep.

P.S. Don't illiterate from the numerical support you get from people who do drugs on these forums--making cat calls, calling me ignorant, arrogant, or not "free-minded" is only going to get you the same referencing back.

 

[oldi1knoby]

Originally posted by pat_thetic
Tell me one person who thinks pot should be legalized and does not take pot?

Me. I haven't smoked in years, but I think it should be legal. It's not the governments job to tell us what substances we can and cannot take. Why can we smoke cigarettes, and drink alcohol, yet we can't smoke pot?

Makes no sense to me. I personally still would not smoke it even if it were legal, becuase it does lower your inteligence.

Maybe I judged too quick oldi1knoby, which I appologise for. That study was an interesting read.

However, I do know alot of ppl who's life has been adversely affected by cannabis use. Smoking every day for years is going to change a person, messing about with your brain chemistry can't be a smart move.

As you said - nobody really understands the long term effects. How do you know that if you'd smoked for another year or two things wouldn't have been different? If my m8 had given up after 7 years he'd have been an excellent advertisment that cannabis does no harm (unfortunatley after 12 years of heavy use that is far from true :/)

I believe that smoking leads to harder drugs (not saying for everyone ......... but many) simply because of the company you end up hanging out with. There's also the ever increasing desire to get 'wasted' on something. As an ex-long term smoker i'm sure you understand that once the novelty has worn off, and you have a high tolerance, smoking weed doesn't really do alot :/ .... it just becomes something to do (like biting your nails)

According to my doctor cannabis completely messes with your immune system (havn't read this any where else tho) It got to the stage that I developed many illnesses - constant colds, weird rashes (ergh) and shingles. Then polyarteritis (a virus that gives you artheritis in pretty much every joint in your body) How ironic then that cannabis has been hailed as as a wonder drug for relieving the symptoms of artheritis ........... someone up there has a really shitty sense of humour :/

Plus it funds crime and makes your salmon not swim up stream /o\

Actually, one of my friends was a big pothead and had 4 children in 5 years.... Pot has nothing to do with fertility. As for your friend, how long has he been quit? My mind was "****ed up" like your friends for at least 3 years afterwards. I am clean now, but the biggest problem I had in those years was depression. I had become so used to the social structure that potheads are used to (sitting around getting high to have fun), that I didn't KNOW HOW to have fun without pot. I am still trying to adapt to normal friendships/relationships, but I am so much more happy now that my mind is cleared up. Another thing that caused depression was lonelyness. When you quit, you have to cut off ALL YOUR OLD FRIENDS... Being sober alone is hard in the beginning, and I suggest you join a support group if you start to fall back. I didn't need it, but I had my family to help me.


I don't endorse pot, but I hate the fact that the Government can so easily take away one of our freedoms. I know a couple pot-heads now, and they are nice people. I would hate to see them go to jail just because of a petty addiction...

Edit:

Oh, and Warbie. As in the case of my father, not only do people pre-disposed to mental illness have a much better chance of becoming addicts, but Drugs will some times trigger the Mental Illnesses that would have otherwise stayed dormant until later in life. MOST mental illnesses show up in late adolescense or shortly thereafter. About 18-24 . My father first started showing his signs of bipolar disorder in his early to mid twenties.. I haven't spoken to him much on this subject so I am not sure. Very touchy subject.. I do suggest your friend see a psychiatrist if he is not allready, if you feel this strongly about his mental health...

 

[crabcakes66]

Originally posted by K e r b e r o s
--considering now were a country with 210 million people living in it right now.

since your talking about statistics.....i should point out that there are closer to 300 million people in the usa.......


http://www.census.gov/main/www/popclock.html


that should help...

 

[Beta Man!]

Yes, it's pretty ridiculous that marijuana is illegal, when alchohol kills brain cells (pot leaves your mind alone) and makes you violent. It is also ironic that cigarettes are legal when they are massively addictive and marijuana isn't. Marijuana simply contains a negligable amount of tar (smoke it out of a bong and there is practically none) and with a gram of pot (more than enough to get high) there is the same amount of carcinagins (sp?) as a few cigarettes.

Think of it as masturbation of the senses. Just because it feels unbelievable doesn't mean you have to become addicted to it.

 

[crabcakes66]

Originally posted by Beta Man!
Yes, it's pretty ridiculous that marijuana is illegal, when alchohol kills brain cells (pot leaves your mind alone) and makes you violent. It is also ironic that cigarettes are legal when they are massively addictive and marijuana isn't. Marijuana simply contains a negligable amount of tar (smoke it out of a bong and there is practically none) and with a gram of pot (more than enough to get high) there is the same amount of carcinagins (sp?) as a few cigarettes.

Think of it as masturbation of the senses. Just because it feels unbelievable doesn't mean you have to become addicted to it.

your not exactly correct there.....mary jane is addictive when used(abused) heavily.....but so are a million other things.

Pot does cuase short-term memory loss....and emotional imblances.
(it did in me ..and still does in lots of my freinds)

 

[MrD]

I still don't see how its addictive qualities or associated health issues should have any bearing on legality decisions. There are plenty things more addictive or more dangerous that are freely available.

Can I ask the "it should be illegal" people why they think they have the right to tell me what I cannot do?

 

[mchammer75040]

Originally posted by K e r b e r o s

We can also thank the media and the Public Schools for Hinting drug use makes a person bad--I don't distinct these people are bad, Christ, their ****ing people to begin with. However, on the fly you do repeatedly something stupid in my presences, using this drug, don't be suprised if I distinct that what your smoking is the reason for your own arrogance.

I don't live paranoid--I just live safe. I let people use drugs; I don't bug them. But when they bug me and try to get me to use them--I don't ****ing want them. I want to be myself, and I don't need drugs in my life because the fact of the matter is; my life and how it progresses is a high--What about yours?


Summary: Drugs feel good--but their side effects are bad.
Its illegal, and thats the big deal--thats why noone wants them around or to hear about them; let alone see any for you might get blaimed by the asshole who has them, you carry them aswell.

---other issues---

I agree with some of the people who've said the goverments involvement to "safe secure" you to be a certain way is wrong; theres no doubt the government tries to instill lawing that otherwise reduces us to the mentality of sheep.

P.S. Don't illiterate from the numerical support you get from people who do drugs on these forums--making cat calls, calling me ignorant, arrogant, or not "free-minded" is only going to get you the same referencing back.

You make some very good points, and i agree with all of them. Im assuming you were talkin about me when asking is my life good without drugs. Well you can think whatever you want, but seriously yes. I only smoke weed on occasions, what are those occasions? When im down or just depressed, i have alot of shit that goes on in my life and sometimes i need to just relax. But ever since i left my moms apartment, ive only smoked it once and i left her apartment around a year ago.

So just to let you know my motives arent just around smoking weed, but mainly personal freedom. I used to smoke it often, but i just......stopped. I dont know why just stopped.

 

[Wildhound]

I've discovered after years of debating this issue with solid fact that there's simply no point.

People are too blindly biased on this issue and full of false facts from which they will not sway.

Marijuana is not physically addictive, it has also not been proven to damage the brain in any way, shape or form. I could give you pages of evidence from research conducted in many parts of the United States and Europe, but really it's pointless. Those of you who are against it will remain that way, due to ignorance.

Needless to say, I have debated and argued this issue with hundreds (literally) of people over the past two years and after showing them research and facts for two days straight proved that marijuana should be legalized.

In all cases, people who were severely opposed to its legalization ended up agreeing that it should be legalized. I had several resolutions passed on this issue in its favour. And through it all there remained those few who refused to see the facts that were right in front of them.

Those with an open mind who do not wish to be lead around blindly by propaganda will research this issue themselves and discover the truth. Those who are closed-minded sheep, I will not waste my time with.

Furthermore, do any of you actually know why hemp was made illegal in the United States in the first place? Was it because it was a harmful, evil, addictive, mind-altering drug? No, it was because of a dispute in the textile industry. Go figure.

In closing, once again, I have never smoked or taken any illegal drug in my life. I have no desire to. But I do know the facts. And marijuana should be legal.

 

[Beta Man!]

Originally posted by crabcakes66
your not exactly correct there.....mary jane is addictive when used(abused) heavily.....but so are a million other things.

Pot does cuase short-term memory loss....and emotional imblances.
(it did in me ..and still does in lots of my freinds)

Show me one study that says that Marijuana is addictive in any way and I'll eat my hat. Short term memory loss and emotional imbalances? Yea sure.... its called being high. Those symptons go away in a few hours after you get high anyway, so whats the big deal?

 

[Warbie]

Beta Man! wrote:

'Show me one study that says that Marijuana is addictive in any way and I'll eat my hat. Short term memory loss and emotional imbalances? Yea sure.... its called being high. Those symptons go away in a few hours after you get high anyway, so whats the big deal?'

You can be addicted to anything, especially weed. The symptoms don't all go away after a few hours either. This kind of statement makes me so angry, and is ignorance in the extreme.

Try smoking everyday for many years - then tell me you can get to sleep ok without a joint, or that you can think of anything else when you're dry. Explain the massive mood swings.

Reading a few case studies with no actual experience of cannabis use is no basis to make good argument.


Wildhoud wrote:

'In closing, once again, I have never smoked or taken any illegal drug in my life. I have no desire to. But I do know the facts. And marijuana should be legal.'

No offense meant - but I completely disagree with your post. I also doubt that you, or most scientists, know the facts.

I'm not close minded - and am an ex long-term user who used to love cannabis, and preach it's benefits (much to my shame). Years of experience, and hanging around with 100's of other users, has taught me otherwise.

I KNOW PPL WHO'VE BEEN HARMED FROM CANNABIS USE. This has been mentioned in every post i've made but the 'pro use' guys have managed to ignore this.

It's not just a few ppl either ........ young kids (10-13 years old), many students who've fallen out of various universities and needed counselling (one was put away). Others who've 'recovered' yet still have to pop pills everyday to keep them 'stable'. This isn't debatable - it's all true.

Some of the case studies used are laughable, quite often a small number of ppl (who smoke very little) are picked - the results are nearly worthless. Other studies are good, but none have any proof about the long term effects.

Sure there are other good reasons for legalisation. But the harm long-term use can cause outweighs these - imo of course.

 

[Wildhound]

I respect your opinion, but that's all it is; opinion.

I do have medical and scientific facts at my disposal. Not the results of 'case studies', but of scientific and medical reasearch. Some of which is based on animal testing (which I disagree with, but that's a seperate issue).

This drug can not be blamed for the downfall of a human being. Just as alcohol can not be blamed for the existence of alcoholics. Alcohol is not physically addictive either, it's a psychological addiction, usually brought about by issues already existing in the user.

Drugs are used by people to negotiate difficult periods, events and situations and as a result they can come to rely on them. There are various prescription drugs as well as drugs which are freely available over the counter that are abused in the same way.

People can become so addicted to computer games that they require counselling and in some cases even commit suicide, as has been seen with some of the larger MMORPGs. The same thing can happen with television and other things that are not drugs. It's a mental addiction, based on a problem rooted in the sufferers own mind. Should we ban computers and television? Of course not.

 

[Maskirovka]

Originally posted by EvilEwok2.0
People like you have absolutely NO insight on how such a decision liek legalizing weed would effect the whole of society. None. And its people like you, whith no insight of how their personal decisions would effect those around them, that cause most of the trouble our society is plauged with.


The ONLY people who want to legalize weed are people who smoke it. Doesnt that say something? If not you need to wake up.


Legalizing weed would not lead to a single positive consqeunce. On the flip side, it would only make weed available to more people. And more poeple smoking weed will only lead to more negative effects.

wow i'm not reading this whole thread before responding to this idioitic statement.

A: i don't smoke weed and i think it should be legalized. (just like alcohol, there should be rules about driving, etc. to prevent someone's use from affecting another person)

B: Making weed less taboo would make it less attractive to many people...just look at how many people have quit smoking recently...people are quitting in droves and there are bans on public smoking in so many places....yet smoking kills you just the same as weed can.

C: who are you to tell someone what they can or can't do with their life? someone who smokes weed and wastes their life isn't affecting you, so you shouldn't be concerned with their waste. you might feel sorry for them or something, but if they're not affecting you, you have no say at all.

this is the same damn argument as abortion...if it's not affecting you, what say do you have?

people look at drugs as a problem, when they're really a symptom. why do people choose to do drugs in the first place? what came first, the weed or the problems? think about that.

 

[Warbie]

I agree with your last post Wildhound.

But the problem with weed - the one most seem to ignore - is that it's so damn fun and so easy to do all the time. Use is so wide spread - more than u'd think. Everyone I know smokes weed all the time, everyday. So do many of the little children around here, and their parents ..... it's 'normal' now, as common as making a cup of coffee (no exageration)

It stops ppl caring .. and makes you mean (from experience I believe it can damage the brain, but will concede there's no proof) You can still drive, go to school and work. It won't kill you (directly) and anyone can use all the time, without ever needing to stop - unlike booze, coke etc.

Legalisation will result in greater use - cannabis won't stop becoming fun - and more ppl will be getting stoned regularly. It should stay illegal if only for the kids (I know that sounds terribly soppy - but it's what I honestly believe)

 

[Maskirovka]

i get your point, and that's where the argument for legalization sorta breaks down...that parents who use might affect their kids in a negative way...kids who have no choice.

but still, like any change it'd seem bad at first, but saying that "weed is bad for society" just has no factual basis.

i'm amazingly highly against making laws that punish people for doing things that are totally legitimate and non-harmful to others just because a few people do bad things with them.

just because some assholes get drunk and beat their wives doesn't mean i shouldn't be able to have a few beers here and there. just because some people steal music off the internet doesn't mean there should be a law preventing me from making backup copies of the CDs i've paid for, yet peopl argue for that kind of law all the time.

if you made a law prohibiting everything that some people use in a negative way, we'd live in a society most people wouldn't like very much.

what about obesity? should we outlaw foods that are bad for you because some people eat them too much and get heart disease? heart disease is bad and costly for society and kills more people per month than weed has killed in the entire history of it's existence (maybe exaggerated but not by much)

so if you want to keep weed illegal, then by that logic, you have to make bad food illegal too, because it's bad for society.

 

[Maskirovka]

it's that same "guns dont kill people, people kill people" argument...it's not alcohol or weed that is bad, it's the fact that the person decided to start using it for the wrong reasons.

there are many legitimate uses for guns, but they're not illegal just because a small percentage of the population uses them for the wrong reason...hunters keep deer populations low while having fun...if they don't, it increases deer-car accidents and stuff like that.

 

[Warbie]

It's a bit different. My point is that a 13 year old can't get away rolling into school drunk (or on other harder drugs). Weed is different .... they can, and do - and noone knows (or do and can't do a thing about it)

Even if their parents don't smoke there's no difficulty in getting cannabis. Sure, it won't kill them - but that's not the problem.

 

[Wildhound]

Actually Warbie, you raise an interesting point there, because I had the same thought myself. When I was first brought into debate regarding the legalization of cannabis, I was completely against it. Even after the medical and scientific facts were shown to me, I was still doubtful, and it was for the reason you just pointed out.

I was worried that even if there were no long term effects, even if it wasn't addictive or physically damaging (or perhaps even because of this), that people might use it all the time, and thus we'd be surrounded by stoners who lived their lives perpetually in that state. Admittedly, this would be a bad thing.

However, I came to the conclusion that it wouldn't really pan out that way. The truth is it's already pretty much freely available. Anyone who wants it can get it quite easily. And yet the vast majority of people limit themselves and know when to stop. Just like with, for example, alcohol.

I know several people who do smoke cannabis and thoroughly enjoy it. Some of them aren't even particularly responsible people, yet they still know when's a good time to be stoned and when is not.

One guy I work with loves the stuff and he's the type of person you'd expect to get carried away with it. Yet he doesn't. In the time I've known him I think I've seen him stoned maybe twice, and if there were any more times I didn't even notice, thus rendering it irrelevant.

He does it in his spare time, in the company of his friends, to chill out, relax and have a bit of fun. But in his day to day life his the same as everyone else. Nobody is harmed, nobody is hurt. And I strongly believe that this is how the vast majority of cannibis users behave. You'll find people that abuse everything, but really, that's no reason to restrict the rest of us.

 

[Maskirovka]

the problem is, why is that kid doing drugs in the first place? that's a bigger societal issue and has nothing to do with weed itself. like you said, there's no difficulty in getting it.

so what's the point of it being illegal? is it being illegal helping anything? clearly it's not working...no matter how much money you dump into it...fighting drugs is like bashing your head into a brick wall...people are gonna get them no matter what you do.

drugs are the symptom, not the problem. but it's something that has to be fought at the source...you have to fix the reasons people do drugs. taking the drugs away doesn't work.

it's just like keeping candy from a child...most kids who have candy taken away from them end up wanting it more. it's just bad parenting not to just teach your kid to eat candy in moderation, or that other things can be tasty too.

taking choice away from kids just ****s them up...go read a psychology book. lots of those parenting tips apply to adults and laws as well.