Why would people play the HL2 beta???

[Pi Mu Rho]

The truth is we know more than half of them are lying...

That looks more like a wide-assed presumption than anything even remotely resembling truth.

 

[Chris D]

All of you don't let it get too out of hand or the thread'll get closed.

 

[Crusader]

Whether or not that is true, the fact remains that downloading the stolen software, and downloading stolen MP3 music are equally bad. In fact in stealing MP3 files you are stealing a finished product, so you could argue that thsi is worse.

If you go to musicians and speak to them about it they won't give a rat's arse that people are downloading HL2, but they will care about people downloading music.

Here we have the other side of the story HL2 fans don't seem to give a hoot about people downloading MP3s, but they feel inclined to spew abuse at some people who have downloaded the leak.

The fact is very few people here have a leg to stand on, if you've ever downloaded an MP3 illegally, cease your hostilities now.

When the 2 and a half people who haven't downloaded MP3s start flaming some more, maybe we should listen to them, because at least they're not hypocrites.

Let he who has never done wrong cast the first stone.

 

[Rupertvdb]

thanks Jesus...

You have a total point but you miss the thrust of some people's arguemts. They suggest that it is bad because people are able to spoil the game for others through their actions. Music isn't something that gets delayed or has to be re written if people hear it during production. People don't cheat in music. People don't go to toehrs and go hey this one bit goes da di da di da, and the other guy goes...NOOO you ruined the story for me!

Get some perspective, the illegality isn't all that's wrong with the leak.

 

[Burn]

Well personally, I downloaded the leak for myself, not for others, and I wont say anything about it to anyone.. if they wanted to know about it, they can go get it themselves..

 

[Dalamari]

I didn't steal the leak and you hopefully didn't (talking about everyone else) so unless you were the person who stole the leak, there is nothing wrong with it.

 

[Pi Mu Rho]

Dalamari: so you condone the actions of the thief then? You applaud his efforts?

 

[Crusader]

I'm glad you picked up the quote my holy friend

However if that's all you lot are arguing about, then this wasn't worth me commenting on. Bar the multiplayer cheats, everybody is just being selfish.

And it's the source code that helps the cheat developers, not the playable leak, so whoops, there's that argument gone as well.

I was talking about the individual act of one person downloading the leak for his/her own use, compared with one person downloading an MP3. Both harm the developer an equal amount, one could argue the MP3 does more harm as it cuts out possible profits. So you seem to suffer from this inability to pick up the thrust of someone's argument, too.

So there you go, if you've never done anything wrong, keep complaining. If you have, and you're just moaning about people spoling the game for you with bits of information no-one will ever force you to read, and enjoying the opportunity to insult people, then I don't want to hear it.

How silly of me, for a moment I believed this was all about ethics and morals, not just the spoiling of a computer-game's storyline.

 

[poseyjmac]

thanks Jesus...

You have a total point but you miss the thrust of some people's arguemts. They suggest that it is bad because people are able to spoil the game for others through their actions. Music isn't something that gets delayed or has to be re written if people hear it during production. People don't cheat in music. People don't go to toehrs and go hey this one bit goes da di da di da, and the other guy goes...NOOO you ruined the story for me!

Get some perspective, the illegality isn't all that's wrong with the leak.

the thrust of people's arguments is null and void. this is so because anyone can choose not to visit any hl2 related forum where its possible for spoilers to reside. now its analogy time. dont want to get wet? dont stand close to the waterfall.

 

[RoguePsi]

Ok, lets get something straight.

Downloading an MP3 = a finished product/song by an artist. Causes no delay to the song being released. File sharing 'shares' the talents of the song writer and perhaps even gives them more fame. Possibly increases song sales. Rate at which songs can be produced - as little as a day. Song cost average - $1.

Downloading leaked HL2 content = Delays the product whilst code is rewritten and the company evaluate and come to terms with the demoralisation. Unfinished material previewed before the developers are ready to show the game. Rate at which the game is produced - 6 years. Half-life 2 cost - $40m.

There is such a gulf between the two that they are incomparable crimes. Downloading MP3's is the speeding ticket to HL2's serial killer.

Both are wrong but one is unforgivable.

 

[clarky003]

your right ,delayed for the better though?... it apparently wasnt even finished anyway according to Doug.

I wouldnt say unforgivable though, you make the people who downloaded it sound like complete criminals. which they are not. they just wanted to have a look at what all the hype was about.

 

[RoguePsi]

Perhaps unforgivable is too strong a word, however, I feel no appreciation for those who have downloaded the leak. Whilst they aren't responsible, they compound and encourage such acts to be repeated from their very actions.

I have no patience for those who have no patience.

 

[Crusader]

Downloading leaked HL2 content = Delays the product whilst code is rewritten and the company evaluate and come to terms with the demoralisation

OMG OMG OMG OMG MY EYES MY EYESSSES THEY HURT FROM THE LIES!!!

Please read through this and see why it is so wrong, so blatantly wrong that it is making me jump up and down in frustration.

Oh dammit, I'm not going to chance the fact that you can't work it out, I'll give you a head start.

When people download the leak it has already been stolen. The act of an individual downloading the leak is virtually undetectable to Valve. I could go on a little longer, but I think that's enough to get you started.

 

[PatPwnt]

Perhaps unforgivable is too strong a word, however, I feel no appreciation for those who have downloaded the leak. Whilst they aren't responsible, they compound and encourage such acts to be repeated from their very actions.

I have no patience for those who have no patience.

People who download the leak do not affect you at all... so keep quiet.

 

[Foxtrot]

People who download the leak do not affect you at all... so keep quiet.

Sure they do, they affect valve which affects half-life 2 which affects him.

 

[Moto]

im planning on taking a look at it after i play HL2 a couple of times, just to see what i prevented myself from spoiling, and what was changed.

Same with me.

By the way, I just got home from one week of racing motorcycles in Mammoth Lakes, CA. Did anyone miss me?

 

[InFeRnO]

Ok, since I just got added a major jolt to my computer, I figured it's time to get on the HL2 and Doom 3 train (Doom 2 used to make me physically nausious, no kidding).

Now, I really didn't care that the beta was stolen, since at that time my computer was shit and it didn't even come into consideration. But now, I find myself still not wanting to play it, simply because it'll ruin the finished game. I find it very gratifying that the guys were arrested; I mean, what kind of life do you lead if you have to spend your time stealing unfinished games (I would do it for the challange, but not post the code all over the internet, like I could hack :farmer: )

Even the Doom 3 beta is pointless, but since I don't care about Doom so much, I won't talk about it (I'll steal the game from one of my friends once its done, cheaper that way).

Now, without giving anything away, the peopel that have played the beta (for whatever reason imaginable), could you just give your impression of the game (NO SPOILERS, for the love of god), just like a fortaste of what's to come, what you liked, what you didn't like.

PS: They are already offering the combo H2+Doom3 on amazon.com.

Because they wanted to. I played the doom 3 alpha, was horrible, but let me see what it was like. Had the HL2 beta half downloaded then decided to wait (Only because i had it preordered...)

 

[FoB_Ed]

Sure they do, they affect valve which affects half-life 2 which affects him.

How did me downloading Half-Life 2 affect valve in any way?

 

[DrJones]

I only played it to check out the weapons and the buggy and also because I'm jonesin for the game and needed a fix. I only spoiled little minute details from the beginning of the game, no big plot twists or anything. I also wanted to see how it would run on my computer too since valve didn't release their promised benchmark...

 

[Devilphish]

The only reason I downloaded it was to get my hands on the manipulator and see what it was like to fool with. I hate when people form opinions on things like a leaked pre-beta builds. Especially in cases like the Doom3 "alpha", which had absolutely nothing to do with the game at all. It was just set up as a technology demonstration in the weeks before e3 2002.

 

[adulus]

This whole discussion sounds sorta like a debate about whether you are a virgin or not...

dont flame, its 2 am in the morning when im writing this

 

[urseus]

Ok, lets get something straight.

Downloading leaked HL2 content = Delays the product whilst code is rewritten and the company evaluate and come to terms with the demoralisation. Unfinished material previewed before the developers are ready to show the game. Rate at which the game is produced - 6 years. Half-life 2 cost - $40m.

Bullshit. They didnt need to recode it. They wernt finished. They have a program that auto-updates files. If the game was ready to be released they could have fixed any hacks while it was out being played. In fact it would have been easier for them to release the game, see what hacks people make for the game, what part of the system they are exploiting, and then patch it up.

I bet that there would have been a fraction of people who would have downloaded it with the intention of making hacks for the multiplayer. Why would you bother, its not even the full game, the hacks wouldnt work anyway.

 

[ferd]

Bullshit. They didnt need to recode it. They wernt finished. They have a program that auto-updates files. If the game was ready to be released they could have fixed any hacks while it was out being played. In fact it would have been easier for them to release the game, see what hacks people make for the game, what part of the system they are exploiting, and then patch it up.

I bet that there would have been a fraction of people who would have downloaded it with the intention of making hacks for the multiplayer. Why would you bother, its not even the full game, the hacks wouldnt work anyway.

No.
They had to rewrite the netcode for sure, otherwise servers could've been hacked, like you can hack msn accounts, and that's not good. It's not about cheats only.

Btw, CS and sorts already works with Steam now, but there are still cheats around so...

 

[poseyjmac]

Ok, lets get something straight.

Downloading an MP3 = a finished product/song by an artist. Causes no delay to the song being released. File sharing 'shares' the talents of the song writer and perhaps even gives them more fame. Possibly increases song sales. Rate at which songs can be produced - as little as a day. Song cost average - $1.

Downloading leaked HL2 content = Delays the product whilst code is rewritten and the company evaluate and come to terms with the demoralisation. Unfinished material previewed before the developers are ready to show the game. Rate at which the game is produced - 6 years. Half-life 2 cost - $40m.

There is such a gulf between the two that they are incomparable crimes. Downloading MP3's is the speeding ticket to HL2's serial killer.

Both are wrong but one is unforgivable.

lol you're right, both of your statements are wrong

dont even try and talk about music piracy and how you think its ok to pirate songs because 'it helps them by spreading it around''. you think music piracy helps sales? you must be dreaming. the average file sharer downloads songs so they dont have to buy the cd. plus songs are intellectual property, they cost money to have on a cd, it doesn't matter how much the cd costs to make, its the price of the stuff ON them that matters. god, im not even going to get further into this because its so ridiculous that i even need to. you and other music pirates brainwash yourselves into thinking its ok and that you're helping the artist just so you can sleep at night.

and then your second statement. well simply put, downloading the leak doesn't cause delays. now malicious hackers that take the leak and exploit it for future use can be a factor in a delay. the only two parties that make a difference in this whole leak fiasco are the leaker himself and the ones who would find weakness in the code to exploit later. everyone else doesn't factor into the equation.

 

[Neo_Kuja]

Put it another way "innocent" beta downloaders, you actually affected the development of the game quite alot !
An Example :

1) Downcast Moral - We ALL know that the Valve crew were depressed about the stolen beta going around, and were probably even more depressed when YOU downloaded it !. They thought their fans were loyal, and wouldn't touch it, but no, you had to download it, and ruin the game for yourselves. I know the affect that downcast moral has on work, and you probably added a week or more to the development cycle.

2) You are supporting hacking ! "No" you say, "THEY downloaded it, so I'm innocent if I download it, because I didn't hack Valve, THEY did". Due to you downloading it, hackers are probably thinking that Valve is a prime hacking target, so Valve naturally upgraded their Firewalls/Anti-Viruses etc. That would have taken at least a day to do, because of the sheer amount of computers in the building, and all the HL2 stuff they had to back up.

3) The netcode. By downloading it, Vavle is now concerned that YOU are going to design hacks for multiplayer and so on. "Not me" you say, but there are certainly are going to be people out there who are making hacks RIGHT NOW, from the stolen build, to use in the main game multiplayer.

Those are 3 good reasons on how YOU are hurting HL2's development if YOU downloaded it, and I find the excuses pathetic :

The only reason I downloaded it was to get my hands on the manipulator and see what it was like to fool with.

I only played it to check out the weapons and the buggy and also because I'm jonesin for the game and needed a fix.

When people download the leak it has already been stolen. The act of an individual downloading the leak is virtually undetectable to Valve.

You are by no means BIG criminals, far from it, I just feel that you have unfairly (And illegaly I may add) played stolen game code, which the general community has no access to, without risking Trojans and Adware. I will wait until HL2 is released, and then smile when I realize that YOU are having no fun because you spoilt it for yourself by playing the stolen beta. It doesn't matter what state it is in, YOU downloaded it, YOUR fault !

We loyal fans will have our retribution when HL2 is released, and you have spoilt it for yourself !

 

[Mr_W]

I don't plan on getting that Beta, after looking at a couple sites that reviewed it. It looks like a good waste of 30 minuets of my life that I will never get back, so I'm going to wait for the complete version of Half-Life 2, it probably works better anyway.

 

[urseus]

We loyal fans will have our retribution when HL2 is released, and you have spoilt it for yourself !

This is the only valid argument anti-leakers have. And its a stupid one at that. At its best, its about emotional attachment to a game. Big deal. How is somone who played 10 mins of the first level going to be burning in your retribution when he plays the first 10 mins in the offical version. Hell be sitting there thinking "oh yeah ive played this bit, hmm thats abit different. Now onto the rest of the game.."

Not "OH JESUS GOD I RUINED THE GAME AND KILLED SO MANY PUPPIES!"

I dont justify the people who have downloaded the leak, but its stupid to blame them for valve not schedualing properly.

 

[ailevation]

:| I admit it, i've played the Half-Life 2 Leak.... do not worry I have gotten myself castrated for punishment. Don't play it, I dunno what people are saying about how the leak ruined the story for them. I GOT NO SORT OF STORY SPOLIERS FROM THE LEAK. The maps in the leak were already revealed through the videos; town, beach, prison, tunnels, etc etc. The only spoils were enemies and some weapons.

 

[The Monkey]

I dont justify the people who have downloaded the leak, but its stupid to blame them for valve not schedualing properly.

That is NOT a good argument. It's like justify a brake-in by saying that the store wasn't secured enough.

 

[ailevation]

:| I thought Gabe mentioned that the leak was not the cause for the delay, but they actually realised that the game needed to be worked on some more. Although he could be lying, we do not know? By the way, if you're gonna blame someone for the delay, do not blame the players of the leak, but the one who actually stole it and gave it out.

 

[poseyjmac]

Put it another way "innocent" beta downloaders, you actually affected the development of the game quite alot !
An Example :

1) Downcast Moral - We ALL know that the Valve crew were depressed about the stolen beta going around, and were probably even more depressed when YOU downloaded it !. They thought their fans were loyal, and wouldn't touch it, but no, you had to download it, and ruin the game for yourselves. I know the affect that downcast moral has on work, and you probably added a week or more to the development cycle.

do you have any tangible evidence? no, you are assuming that they are crybabies that let what some users on a forum do affect how they operate in life. you really should give valve more credit than that of a little girl. christ. did i mention you have no evidence of this? oh i think i did.

2) You are supporting hacking ! "No" you say, "THEY downloaded it, so I'm innocent if I download it, because I didn't hack Valve, THEY did". Due to you downloading it, hackers are probably thinking that Valve is a prime hacking target, so Valve naturally upgraded their Firewalls/Anti-Viruses etc. That would have taken at least a day to do, because of the sheer amount of computers in the building, and all the HL2 stuff they had to back up.

im almost laughing out loud in real life from this. ok now that ive gained my composure, do you seriously think valve wouldn't have upgraded their firewalls/anti-virus software if no one would have downloaded the leak? heres a little theoretical skit to highlight the stupidity of this comment:

<valve worker> we have just been hacked into, and our source code was stolen, gabe.

<gabe> Ok, but has anyone else downloaded it?

<valve worker> uhh, no actually, the hacker has kept it to himself.

<gabe> ok, well since no one has downloaded it other than the hacker, lets leave our security the way it is, and not take any precautionary measures.

<valve worker> Ok, thats what i was thinking too, but if some forum member from hl2.net does download it, we will install new firewall/anti virus software at once.

<gabe> ok that doesn't make any sense at all. oh wait its because its neo_kujas idea!

<valve worker> ahh, lets see to it that he is banned from steam forever.

3) The netcode. By downloading it, Vavle is now concerned that YOU are going to design hacks for multiplayer and so on. "Not me" you say, but there are certainly are going to be people out there who are making hacks RIGHT NOW, from the stolen build, to use in the main game multiplayer.

Wrong again. when the hacker stole the source, the damage was done, valve had no choice. now whether no one or 50000 people downloaded it after that would have no affect on valve's course of action. the fact that valve knew that one person had the code was reason enough to have to make some changes. so again, the thousands of people you think are guilty dont even come into play.

You are by no means BIG criminals, far from it, I just feel that you have unfairly (And illegaly I may add) played stolen game code, which the general community has no access to, without risking Trojans and Adware. I will wait until HL2 is released, and then smile when I realize that YOU are having no fun because you spoilt it for yourself by playing the stolen beta. It doesn't matter what state it is in, YOU downloaded it, YOUR fault !

We loyal fans will have our retribution when HL2 is released, and you have spoilt it for yourself !

everyone has fun with the game in their own way, dont worry about people spoiling it for themselves. none of us are complaining about missing out on anything, so i think i speak for a lot of people when i say, just leave us the hell alone, let us enjoy the game how we want to. in the end, we are buying it just like you and are no different.

 

[urseus]

That is NOT a good argument. It's like justify a brake-in by saying that the store wasn't secured enough.

Breakin or no, valve would have delayed the release of the game. It wasnt ready, and they lept on this hack to use as an excuse for them not fullfilling their constant guarenteed claims, almost rite uptill the day, that it was coming out sept 30.

 

[Rupertvdb]

the thrust of people's arguments is null and void. this is so because anyone can choose not to visit any hl2 related forum where its possible for spoilers to reside. now its analogy time. dont want to get wet? dont stand close to the waterfall.

So i should avoid doing something that gives me pleasure because people who indulged in somehting that they knew was illegal may well **** the game up for me. By that reasoning people shouldn't go out to clubs if they don't want to get in fights because fights happen in clubs and if you go you get what you deserve.

 

[Tiddalick]

do you have any tangible evidence? no, you are assuming that they are crybabies that let what some users on a forum do affect how they operate in life. you really should give valve more credit than that of a little girl. christ. did i mention you have no evidence of this? oh i think i did.

Ugg, "hl2_douglombardi_e32004.mov"
Doug says himself:
"...bigger then that was the moral hit, you know, you had artists and designers who had spent four years trying to create something that was going to live up to the expectations to all the people that played the first games; and the press and people like yourself and months or weeks or however long it was we were away from finishing it the uncomplete product was taken and put out on the internet. And thats, thats a downer and really the biggest thing was getting folks re-invigirated to come back to the project, to finish it and it took a while..."

Of COURSE having the early versions of the game affected people at valve.

Sure, people don't care, they will buy the game anyway, but to those at valve its major disapointment.
It's like your creating something (say a picture) for someone, and they see it before its done. Of course your disapointed! You didn't want them to see it once its done! Im sure many artists have this mentality, especially people at valve who seem to strive for perfection! To a perfectionist there is no greater crime then seeing work that is not yet perfect!

 

[Venmoch]

I'd like to Download the Beta just to see what the Mod potential is like and have a fiddle with the new Hammer editor. But the large size is kinda preventing me.

 

[CR0M]

....

Well quoted Tiddalick, but even spelling it out for some of these childs repeatedly hasn't (and won't) change their attitudes.

 

[RoguePsi]

I've noticed some things from this thread.

1) It's funny the lengths that the leak downloaders go to to justify their wrong-doing.
2) Those that downloaded the leak are very ignorant people (go run for American Presidency NOW!)
3) Those that downloaded the leak will not accept responsibility for their actions.
4) Those that downloaded the leak are not the most intelligent people in the world.

 

[Cybernoid]

It occured to me last night that the person who stole the code in the first place had more backbone than the freeloaders who downloaded it afterwards. He had to break into Valve's network (not that easy) and risk getting caught (which he apparently did). The sup4hL1337 freeloaders just go to their nearest warez site and brag about how they've played the leak.

 

[urseus]

I've noticed some things from this thread.

1) It's funny the lengths that the leak downloaders go to to justify their wrong-doing.
2) Those that downloaded the leak are very ignorant people (go run for American Presidency NOW!)
3) Those that downloaded the leak will not accept responsibility for their actions.
4) Those that downloaded the leak are not the most intelligent people in the world.

Conversly:

1) People who get angry at those who downloaded the leak, do it with Futurama, Dodgeball and Family Guy running in other windows on media player.

2) People who downloaded the leak seem to be able to point out hypocritical and contradictory arguments in their oponants.

3) People who downloaded the leak seem to be well aware that what they did is wrong, but feel it to be a victimless crime and their downloading it has not effected valves end profit margin.

4) Those that run out of points to argue with with will repeat earlier ones, only worded slightly differently.

5) They will word points differently when in an argument, however they may repeat ones brought up earlier.



Also, just for the record, i havent downloaded the leak.

 

[dura]

I've noticed some things from this thread.

1) It's funny the lengths that the leak downloaders go to to justify their wrong-doing.
2) Those that downloaded the leak are very ignorant people (go run for American Presidency NOW!)
3) Those that downloaded the leak will not accept responsibility for their actions.
4) Those that downloaded the leak are not the most intelligent people in the world.

If any of you are going to sum up your stupidity, go in glory and do it like this.