Fragmaster posts his delay "proof"

[Spiffae]

Let's do a quick rundown:

Positive
1. The ATI event on the 30th. If a card is launched with HL2, HL2 should be done, right?
2. Gabe's "we'll see"
3. Benchmark on September 30th. At least we'll have source on our comps.
4. No other date has been mentioned.

Negative
1. The event is "ATI only" and has nothing to do w/ HL2 (-spitcodfry)
2. Gabe's "we'll see"
3. Lack of any press advertisement (HL1 had tons of ads)
4. Lack of any real press coverage.
5. Fragmaster's update (if it's true)
6. This EB conference (if it's true)
7. In-Store dates.
8. Lack of gold.

 

[Spiffae]

Originally posted by oldi1knoby
HOW MANY ****ING TIMES DOES GABE HAVE TO SAY THE DATE IS STILL SEPTERMBER 30th BEFORE YOU ASSHATS GET THIS THROUGH YOUR HEAD. VALVE HAVE SAID IT 50 THOUSAND TIMES, AND YOU KEEP SAYING "valve is treating us like ass crap". HOw???? They have said September 30th EVEN YESTERDAY when that kid visited their office. GO sit on a banana and rotate. Watch out for the monkeys, they bite!

this is almost worse than delay threads. no, actually it's definetly worse.

 

[shapeshifter]

Originally posted by Spiffae
Let's do a quick rundown:

Positive
1. The ATI event on the 30th. If a card is launched with HL2, HL2 should be done, right?
2. Gabe's "we'll see"
3. Benchmark on September 30th. At least we'll have source on our comps.
4. No other date has been mentioned.

Negative
1. The event is "ATI only" and has nothing to do w/ HL2 (-spitcodfry)
2. Gabe's "we'll see"
3. Lack of any press advertisement (HL1 had tons of ads)
4. Lack of any real press coverage.
5. Fragmaster's update (if it's true)
6. This EB conference (if it's true)
7. In-Store dates.

uh you could also add to positive "they had time to show spitcodfry around" usually if they were in the last few weeks of codings its very nuts, so as when he was there it was nice and not crazy, so pretty much shows they are done, if anything I think they are waiting for a certian date they want, or pre planned.
8. Lack of gold.

 

[Mountain Man]

What does Valve have to gain by keeping a delay a secret? More to the point, if they really have told some large and respected publications about the delay (as is Fragmaster's contention), why have they kept quiet?

And Gabe's "We'll see" is far to vague to draw any sort of conclussion from, so that's really not proof one way or the other.

Personally, I think it's coming out the 30th and Valve is just having some fun by keeping us all in suspense.

 

[Orange]

only reason press wouldn't leak it as being straight from the horse's mouth, would be if they had signed one of those Disclosure of information thingies that binds the publication from releasing information, as they did with the actual creation of hl2.

but why do that with a delay ?

 

[Mountain Man]

See what I'm saying? It simply don't make sense.

 

[shapeshifter]

they may not be dealing they may want to just go "hey every one, games done, its in stores today go have fun" most game devlopers don't pay for the game themselves when devolping it, the publisher helps out in that regard or the studio that owns/hires them, valve on the other hand is paying for it themselves, and giving the "privallage" of publishing the game to vu, so valve can tell them to keep their mouths shut on anything they like in terms of realse dates annoucements.

 

[Mountain Man]

Well what do you know. It looks like I've been banned from posting at Planet Half-Life. Can't say I'm too troubled by it. Just one more reason for me to not bother visiting that pathetic site.

Oh, and his latest excuse why he's the only with this super secret delay information is that, now get this, his information is simply better than that of other Half-Life 2 fansites.

No, really, just how arrogant is this guy?

 

[Kyle2]

lol mountain man, i asked him to post his proof and he said that no one would believe it and than i said that i'd believe it if he posted it and that i'll shut up and than he edits his post to say "i have to go now and do some work" than he locks the topic. what a pussy


<Kyle2> http://www.forumplanet.com/planethalflife/topic.asp?fi

 

[spitcodfry]

Originally posted by Mountain Man
Well what do you know. It looks like I've been banned from posting at Planet Half-Life. Can't say I'm too troubled by it. Just one more reason for me to not bother visiting that pathetic site.

Oh, and his latest excuse why he's the only with this super secret delay information is that, now get this, his information is simply better than that of other Half-Life 2 fansites.

No, really, just how arrogant is this guy?

I'm assuming there's no way we can get that jackhole fired? Maybe a higher-up department within Gamespy?

 

[Kyle2]

we should all send emails to gamespy telling them to get rid of fragmaster

http://www.gamespy.com/feedback/

 

[CommieX]

I love you Mountain Man.:dork:

 

[Apos]

I don't think frag is lying about the email. He may be basing far too much on it, and we have no way of knowing whether it is itself legit, but there's no reason to think he'd lie about something that could so easily be disproven later.

 

[Kyle2]

if he did have the email he would've posted it instead of constantly avoid doing so.

 

[CommieX]

I find it hard to believe that all the print magazines knew about the delay, and yet they all stated Sept. 30 in their previews.

 

[Orange]

I agree with apos, he is taking something pretty reliable that says delay, and basing EVERYTHING on it, despite what has happened since then.

I do have to admit he's not going to get this worked up over a nothing piece of evidence, but what about everything else?

 

[Apos]

Well, he's been very hardline in refusing to even reveal what it was that had him so worked up. Now that he has revealed it, though, people are in the position to confirm or deny or at least explain his evidence. I'm sure plenty of PHL people immediately fired off emails to valve people demanding some reaction or explanation, and I'm sure we'll hear something about it soon (since, if the game is delayed, it's going to soon be very hard to keep this fact under wraps)

 

[spitcodfry]

Originally posted by Orange
I agree with apos, he is taking something pretty reliable that says delay, and basing EVERYTHING on it, despite what has happened since then.

I do have to admit he's not going to get this worked up over a nothing piece of evidence, but what about everything else?

Well it looks like his info---whatever it is, might be correct. What I'd like to know, though, is why he thinks it was a good idea to post a news item that cannot be backed up by evidence? If he had to keep it secret, he should've kept his mouth shut period. For a journalist (if you can call him that), he should know better than to start something like this.

 

[Apos]

Well, he actually sort of did what was right. He got confidential and/or unconfirmed information. Instead of posting it, he tried to get confirmation from the relevant players. But they rebuffed him. So he sat on it... except he couldn't quite keep quiet about it either.

 

[spitcodfry]

Originally posted by Apos
Well, he actually sort of did what was right. He got confidential and/or unconfirmed information. Instead of posting it, he tried to get confirmation from the relevant players. But they rebuffed him. So he sat on it... except he couldn't quite keep quiet about it either.

Do we know what that info is yet? Isn't he still withholding it?

 

[DigitalAssassin]

For someone to say "It's going to be delayed, but I can't show you how I know" is pretty dumb. Keep your mouth shut 'cuz you're not supposed to say anything, or back up your info.

EDIT: Didn't read whole thread, just first post. :|

 

[spitcodfry]

Originally posted by DigitalAssassin
For someone to say "It's going to be delayed, but I can't show you how I know" is pretty dumb. Keep your mouth shut 'cuz you're not supposed to say anything, or back up your info.

I'm not disputing that Fragmaster is a jerk in many respects...but it does seem like this may be for real. Apos, as I remember, was once flaming him, but now he's considering the info is legit. I thought it was all a hype to mess with HL fans, but it seems like it might be true. My guess is whoever gave the info to him was in a tight position and could've lost their job if it was leaked who it was that spilled the beans.

 

[Kyle2]

nope, he's bullshitting, if you look at the last page when i ask to see the evidence he avoids me completely until i say "look he's avoiding me cause he doesn't have shit" he says that he won't post it cause we won't believe it than when i said that i would believe the email and i would shut up if he posted it he edited his post to say he was going to sleep and closed the topic. what an ass.

http://www.forumplanet.com/planethalflife/topic.asp?fid=2348&tid=1165104&p=5

 

[spitcodfry]

Originally posted by Kyle2
nope, he's bullshitting, if you look at the last page when i ask to see the evidence he avoids me completely until i say "look he's avoiding me cause he doesn't have shit" he says that he won't post it cause we won't believe it than when i said that i would believe the email and i would shut up if he posted it he edited his post to say he was going to sleep and closed the topic. what an ass.

http://www.forumplanet.com/planethalflife/topic.asp?fid=2348&tid=1165104&p=5

Yeah I tried to reply to the thread to ask him some questions but it was closed. Why would he close the thread?

 

[spitcodfry]

So lemme get this straight...Fragmaster is claiming that there was a leaked e-mail back in July that Doug Lombardi sent to game magazines explaining the game would be pushed back because they needed more time to work on it, and also to allow more time for coverage on it before release. Correct? What I don't understand is if Doug sent such an e-mail, then why would he contradict himself at ECTS by saying "the release date is unchanged"?

 

[nullvector]

From what I gather, as a programmer, im guessing that theyre just working out some last minute bugs and things. With bugs, its impossible to set a Gold-date in stone, because you never know what could crop up next, after something is fixed. Thats just the nature of code.

Im assuming a gold date will be soon, next couple of days. If the bugs were major, they'd have already set a delayed date.

Most likely right now, its just fixing the bugs that come up in playtesting, where they have myriads of hardware configurations, and many other variables that are reproduced when the game actually releases.

Testing is hard work on PC's. Its not like Xbox/PS2 where your hardware is always the same, and you dont have to write enhancement code for poor hardware implementations of standards.

What I'm really interested in....is someone finding out who is actually doing the playtesting for this game. In my development experiences, we always had temp workers that were hired for the sole purpose of testing the new game. Usually they were kids in the 15-20yr old range...

It would be fun to find one of these testers....encourage him to 'talk'

 

[spitcodfry]

Originally posted by nullvector
From what I gather, as a programmer, im guessing that theyre just working out some last minute bugs and things. With bugs, its impossible to set a Gold-date in stone, because you never know what could crop up next, after something is fixed. Thats just the nature of code.

Im assuming a gold date will be soon, next couple of days. If the bugs were major, they'd have already set a delayed date.

Most likely right now, its just fixing the bugs that come up in playtesting, where they have myriads of hardware configurations, and many other variables that are reproduced when the game actually releases.

Testing is hard work on PC's. Its not like Xbox/PS2 where your hardware is always the same, and you dont have to write enhancement code for poor hardware implementations of standards.

What I'm really interested in....is someone finding out who is actually doing the playtesting for this game. In my development experiences, we always had temp workers that were hired for the sole purpose of testing the new game. Usually they were kids in the 15-20yr old range...

It would be fun to find one of these testers....encourage him to 'talk'

Those testers are lucky bastards

 

[Apos]

if Doug sent such an e-mail, then why would he contradict himself at ECTS by saying "the release date is unchanged"?

Cus that's is part of the job? (not saying it's something he does, but it is sort of the responsibility of the position to put things in the best possible light)

 

[Apos]

Apos, as I remember, was once flaming him, but now he's considering the info is legit.

I was angry that he waffled to me: first saying there was evidence (to me) and then denying it in his editorial. I didn't dout that there was something behind it, and now we know, there was. I was angry that he was going back and forth on the issue of WHETHER he had any good evidence.

 

[spitcodfry]

Originally posted by Apos
Cus that's is part of the job? (not saying it's something he does, but it is sort of the responsibility of the position to put things in the best possible light)

Um...I'm not sure I understand. I know Doug's job is to make statements, PR, etc, but if he made a statement to the gaming magazines that it would be delayed, and then turn around less than a month later at ECTS and say "the release date is unchanged," then that would be contradicting his previous statements to the magazines, correct? I'm just trying to rationalize Fragmaster's claim.

 

[Orange]

maybe letting the press know the truth, but not letting it go public for a good PR image!

. . .wtf would they do that? Does that make it look better than announcing a delay of up to a month or 2? and if its so close to the end, how can you tell how long it would take ? (as mentioned about bugs)

 

[Apos]

then that would be contradicting his previous statements to the magazines, correct?

Yes, but not publically.

but then, I have no reason to accuse Lombardi of this, and I'm not doing so. I'm just saying that it's not implausible in the business for someone to do this.

 

[spitcodfry]

Originally posted by Apos
Yes, but not publically.

but then, I have no reason to accuse Lombardi of this, and I'm not doing so. I'm just saying that it's not implausible in the business for someone to do this.

Now I understand. Didn't really consider the business angle side of things. Do you think it's delayed, Apos?

 

[BloodyL]

Just look at the fever that all the fans are in right now over the release, Valve have always seemed to be on the consumers side, why would they not tell us of the delay?, especially when we are getting so close to the infamous 30th.

NDA'ing a magazine over a delay date sounds so silly it's almost plausable.

Unless they've said "It might (as in we've just hit a showstopping bug) be delayed, but don't say anything as we could have it squashed before release day."

 

[Orange]

Valve can't act like a normal business . . . they are better than that :'(
lol Still love'm : D
actually being prepared for the worst will make you happier come sept 30th. :\ Still in the middle

 

[spitcodfry]

Originally posted by Orange
Valve can't act like a normal business . . . they are better than that :'(
lol Still love'm : D
actually being prepared for the worst will make you happier come sept 30th. :\ Still in the middle

So you do believe it'll come out the 30th?

 

[Apos]

Do you think it's delayed, Apos?

I have no opinion. I am, however, a little skeptical that they would have known about a MAJOR delay all the way back in July, and not told anyone but gaming mags. They sure don't seem like they're going to have a major delay, but anything could happen at this point. We simply lack information.

 

[Orange]

I think it will make 30th , but I'm starting (GASP) to have doubts.
I guess a better way of putting it is that im optimistic of the 9/30/03, but not positive

 

[Rice-Rocketeer]

Until we get a clear answer from VALVe, or the 30th hits (whichever comes faster), then none of us can really be sure, least of all Fragmaster. He shouldn't be posting conjecture like that as news, as it definitely degrades his credible journalism. As far as I'm concerned, the only people that *know for sure* are the employees at VALVe, and until I hear it expressly from one of them in an e-mail that I can see, and know as the truth...it is coming out on the 30th, just as they said.

 

[.5c0ut-WHoR3.]

We still have 11 days people, alot will happen then.